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Problem with Dorn becoming a fallen blackguard

HepcatHepcat Member Posts: 2
in Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition
Ok so with a reputation around 5, when we came across Laurel the paladin, instead of asking for help with the gibberlings, she made a short speech about evildoers and attacked.

No problem there, but after we killed her, Dorn was changed to a fallen blackguard, and Viconia to a fallen cleric.

Obviously this doesn't seem correct, as they're both evil.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

Comments

  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,714
    Fallen Cleric?!
  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381
    Any mods involved? I've never seen Dorn or any cleric "fall"
  • HepcatHepcat Member Posts: 2
    Yeah. I installed a number of mods just before this run-through. Damn.
  • alceryesalceryes Member Posts: 380
    edited October 2016
    I believe, in unmodded BG:EE, only CHARNAME can fall from ranger or paladin.
  • SirBundlesofJoy_1912SirBundlesofJoy_1912 Member Posts: 57
    It's cool to think that if Dorn knowingly performed a good deed, he would fall from grace and have to atone for his misdeeds.

    There are paladins and blackguards, but are there warriors dedicated to neutrality?
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    @SirBundlesofJoy_1912 Harpers
  • GallowglassGallowglass Member Posts: 3,356
    SirBundlesofJoy_1912 said:

    There are paladins and blackguards, but are there warriors dedicated to neutrality?

    As a playable class/kit which is mandatorily neutral, no.
    ThacoBell said:

    @SirBundlesofJoy_1912 Harpers

    Er ... no. Harpers believe in balance, but that doesn't necessarily make them Neutral; it's a broader interpretation of balance than the strict Neutrality of Druids. (Khalid, for example, is a Harper but Good-aligned, not Neutral.)
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    balance=neutrality
  • FrancoisFrancois Member Posts: 452
    Characters who care about balance are neutral but the reverse in not true. Some neutral characters are just self-centered individualist without either benevolence or malice to others (like Yoshimo is TN, but not harper material).

    ''What makes a good man go neutral? Lust for gold? Power? Or were you just born with a heart full of neutrality?"
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,235
    The Harpers are neutral though.
  • TheArtisan TheArtisan Member Posts: 3,277
    edited December 2016
    @ThacoBell I'm not sure whether it changed at some point but Harpers have been exclusively non-evil with tendency towards Chaotic Good since at least 3e (never mind, Songs and Swords was written before 3e, it must have been way sooner than that). Elminster, for example, is CG and a leading member of the Harpers, and the characters in Elaine Cunningham's Songs and Swords series are Harpers and all some shade of good.
  • GallowglassGallowglass Member Posts: 3,356
    ThacoBell said:

    balance=neutrality

    No, that's not how it works.
    ThacoBell said:

    The Harpers are neutral though.

    Not so. See Khalid.
  • RelSundanRelSundan Member Posts: 918
    We are falling a bit off topic. Clerics can't fall so your mods are obviously to blame for this hilarious incident.
  • ZaramMaldovarZaramMaldovar Member Posts: 2,309
    edited December 2016
    BG2 spoiler:

    Dorn does become a Fallen Blackguard if you complete the last quest of BG2 by killing both demons instead of worshiping either. But as for other instances? No, that doesn't normally happen.
    Post edited by JuliusBorisov on
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,760
    @DJ_Sweatz_2013 I've edited your post because this thread in the BGEE subforum and what you're saying is a spoiler for BG2.
  • jsavingjsaving Member Posts: 1,083
    edited March 2019
    Harpers are not neutral, see http://dnd.wizards.com/dungeons-and-dragons/story/faction/harpers for more on this. They "aid the weak, the poor, and the oppressed" while combating "leaders who grow too powerful," which is more or less the textbook definition of chaotic goodness. Also see the wiki page https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Harpers which pegs them as CG as did AD&D's Code of the Harpers sourcebook.

    There was a lengthy discussion on Harper alignment a couple of years ago on the enworld boards, http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?350458-Alignment-of-Forgotten-Realms-Harpers, which basically concluded they're predominantly chaotic good but have a fair number of neutral and neutral good members.
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