Inquisitor or Cavalier Solo? BG1-TOB

ahhyep

I guess the endgoal is to do a good amount of melee damage, but also have fun throughout the entire saga. I might take Imoen with me in BG1 for haste, lockpicking, and immunity to petrification. Can easily farm exp with her to dual class her if it's just us two.

BG2 I will solo with the help of Yoshimo to unlock some areas for me (City Gates Lich, Kangaxx area) but will kick him out after he has done his job.

So that leaves me with the choice for Inquisitor or Cavalier... I am really interested in the Cavalier due to spellcasting and if I am being honest with myself, DUHM is the only real reason I am considering a Cavalier. Thinking long term.

I was planning on wielding Carsomyr no matter which character I choose, as I have gotten tired of dual-wielding damage lords. I wouldn't roll a paladin for that.

Since BGEE doesn't really have any great 2h's until late game I might decide to level using a 1h and a shield. Just curious on how I should build and what 1h I should use that will be useful in the entire game? I suppose I can get Varscona pretty quickly, and Daystar in BG2 is really nice for undead fighting. I know eventually I will want to specialize in a single handed weapon to tank with for fun when I don't want to chop up people with the holy avenger.

So....

Which 1h should I specialize in?
Should I specialize in it before 2h?
Should I choose Cavalier or Inquisitor?

On one hand inquisitor is pretty Overpowered for mage fights, but on the other... DUHM (late game), healing spells (all game), poison resist (early game), and having dispel on carsomyr eventually anyways I am kinda torn.

SirBatince

Inqui. Dispel is just that good.

As for your spell needs, the priest of gond in the hall of wonders sells 20x oils of speed and durlags tower is full of them

You can bash open nearly all locked chests with potions of STR

and the nashkel fair has a scroll of petrification immunity to clear the basilisk field. Potions of mirror eyes also work.

JumboWheat01

I'm fond of Cavaliers, they have some nice immunities, resistances, and damage boosts with practically no downsides.

ThacoBell

Go Cavalier, everyone does Inquisitor.

ahhyep

Can you solo durlag's tower for the +3 2h?

OrlonKronsteen

Tough choices! I've never played an Inquisitor but I have to assume it would be easier for solo play because of the dispel. Cavalier may be more appealing thematically, but IMHO DUHM really doesn't make that much difference in a game where you'll be plenty powerful with the array of potions and items that are available. Also, your Inquisitor will get DUHM as a Bhaal power in late BG1 and for a good chunk of BG2. As for 1-handed weapons, boy, that's a tough choice. Longswords are great as you mentioned, but at some point you may want to get pips in a blunt weapon (maces or flails) and it wouldn't be a bad idea to do that early, moving to 2-handers next. If you're playing a Cavalier, axes would be a good early choice because they can double as a ranged option. Tough call! Inquisitors can use bows, so you might think about that early, too, when low hp can leave you vulnerable to one-hitter-quitters. As for soloing Durlag's Tower, you're a braver man than I!

Yann1989

Themewise I like the Cavalier... BUT the Inquisitor has Dispel, which is so powerful against the stronger foes... BUT Carsomyr gives you access to Dispel anyway... so, it's as you like I guess. For deeper thoughts, I call upon holy advice from people in this forum.

Edit: As for the 1 handed weapon, you might consider flails, as the Flail of Ages is very useful against golems in BG2, if I remember well. A blunt weapon is also always useful on skelettons and jellies.

SirBatince

ahhyep said:

Can you solo durlag's tower for the +3 2h?

scroll of protection from magic makes the chess easy

ahhyep

SirBatince said:

ahhyep said:

Can you solo durlag's tower for the +3 2h?

scroll of protection from magic makes the chess easy

So does cloak of balduran and resting with heal spells, but I meant specifically for locked doors and the like

Gallowglass

@ahhyep - I don't recall any doors in Durlag's Tower which you wouldn't be able to get through (although I won't swear to that). However, some of the treasure chests in there have pretty tough locks, so you probably won't be able to bash them open.

As for the choice between Cavalier and Inquisitor ... hmmm, I agree with those who prefer the Cavalier thematically, and also the Cavalier's casting ability is quite useful ... but on the other hand, the Inquisitor's double-strength Dispel is really terrific (and his True Sight is pretty useful too), arguably outweighing all the other spells which a Cavalier can cast. Close call, I reckon either choice is justifiable, although maybe I'd lean towards the Inquisitor.

SirBatince

ahhyep said:

SirBatince said:

ahhyep said:

Can you solo durlag's tower for the +3 2h?

scroll of protection from magic makes the chess easy

So does cloak of balduran and resting with heal spells, but I meant specifically for locked doors and the like

As I mentioned above potions of strength will crack open most chests however there's no critical passage that forces thieving skill.

cloak of balduran won't help much for the chess

Papa_Lou

I'm currently playing a Cavalier (not solo, though), and I'd definitely recommend the class. That being said, cavs can't use missile weapons. I've never tried a solo run, so I don't know if that's important or not, but definitely something to keep in mind.

The cav's immunities, though, are awesome.

Objulen

If it's solo, I'd go Inquisitor. Cavaliers is a good, solid kit, but if you're in a situation where you need ranged attacks, you're SOL as a Cavalier. Additionally, the Dispel Magic and True Sight are very, very helpful when dealing with enemy mages, and IIRC you get them early in your career (lvl 1 or so). The main benefit of the Cavalier -- the group anti-fear buff -- is largely irrelevant once you get standard Paladin fear immunity.

I'd specialize in Long Sword and Sword and Shield early on, as there is a +2 long sword available as early as the Nashkal mines. Two-handed weapons are great -- especially Holy Avenger in BG2 -- but that can wait until later. Given that you can only put two pips in each weapon, you have spares to spend on 2 handed weapons later.

Thus, my recommendation would be Inquisitor w/ the following specs: Long Sword 2, Sword and Shield 1, ranged weapon of your choice 1.

Danacm

Vanilla sword and shield style not recommended. Only gives ac vs missiles, and it looks like waste of prof. point. Better just use shields without s&s style. In tweaks, mods there are nice additionw to that style, like scales of balance mod.

Gallowglass

Papa_Lou said:

That being said, cavs can't use missile weapons.

Objulen said:

... if you're in a situation where you need ranged attacks, you're SOL as a Cavalier.

Cavaliers can't use bows or slings or darts, but they can use Throwing Axes and Throwing Daggers, so they've got ranged attack when necessary.

Certainly there are situations where ranged attack is what you want, but I can't think of any situation where it necessarily has to be a missile weapon. Throwing an axe or dagger instead should suffice.

Grond0

Playing solo in BG2 the availability of skeleton warriors with the cavalier is a huge benefit - sending them in one at a time makes mage fights just as easy as for the inquisitor as well as helping in many other situations. With the bonus resistances for the cavalier and other good cleric spells like death ward, silence and holy smite I think the cavalier is far better suited to solo play than the inquisitor.

ahhyep

Objulen said:

If it's solo, I'd go Inquisitor. Cavaliers is a good, solid kit, but if you're in a situation where you need ranged attacks, you're SOL as a Cavalier. Additionally, the Dispel Magic and True Sight are very, very helpful when dealing with enemy mages, and IIRC you get them early in your career (lvl 1 or so). The main benefit of the Cavalier -- the group anti-fear buff -- is largely irrelevant once you get standard Paladin fear immunity.

I'd specialize in Long Sword and Sword and Shield early on, as there is a +2 long sword available as early as the Nashkal mines. Two-handed weapons are great -- especially Holy Avenger in BG2 -- but that can wait until later. Given that you can only put two pips in each weapon, you have spares to spend on 2 handed weapons later.

Thus, my recommendation would be Inquisitor w/ the following specs: Long Sword 2, Sword and Shield 1, ranged weapon of your choice 1.

Do Inquisitors get immunity to fear? I thought only hold and charm.
I would not specialize in Shield at all. It's worthless and better spent on other weapon proficiencies.
I was thinking Mace or Long sword, then 2h sword, then 2h style, then flail in bg2.
Improved Mace of Disruption or Daystar for Vampires etc.
Level drain will not matter as I will more than likely be using Amulet of Power (can't think of a better amulet for a Paladin)
I have beaten the game without using ranged attacks of any kind before. Boots of Speed and haste pretty much make any melee a ranged character too. The only ranged attack I have felt I've actually needed was in the asylum, where there is a goblin I need to hit in order to spawn the overseer of the maze to get to the next level. In this case I would have a throwing weapon at the ready or a charge based item.

So as it stands, I guess really it's a toss up (and why I am having trouble deciding) on wether or not the dispel and true sight are going to be more useful (long term) than Paladin spellcasting. With Carsomyr, I don't know the answer to that.

Objulen

The main benefits of the Dispel Magic and True Sight for solo play is that you get them from the start, instead of waiting until level 9 to get your first level 1 spell slot. This is assuming a game that starts from level 1 and not BG 2.

I've got some fights where it is generally harder to get to targets out of melee range, or where it's better to target enemies without closing. If axes and/or daggers have the same range as bows, though, then that's not an issue.

Inquisitors don't get immunity to fear, but they do get immunity to charm and hold, the later being as useful as the Cavalier immunity to fear. It's a bit of a toss up as to which is better to have, as enemy clerics love throwing hold person around.

Objulen

The additional defense against ranged attacks from sword and shield is very important during early levels as well, as there are several fights where you will be essentially dog-piled at range. You may only need one point, however.

ahhyep

no it's not. i am used to playing a fighter mage thief with no armor solo and still survive. a paladin wearing ankehg plate mail and a large shield +1, and a ring of protection +1 from the start of the game won't be having any issues with range... period.

I did some simming and saw the following:

At the beginning of SOA, if the inquisitor has a DUHM special ability from dreams it's actually better than the paladin casted ability, I guess it goes off fighter level.

At the end of SOA, 2,950,000 exp cap I have a level 17 cavalier with 3x level 1,2,3 priest slots, and 1 level 4.
That means I can have bless, chant, DUHM, and skeleton warrior summoning.

There is also many pips to choose from for specialization which and inquisitor with dispel can make better use of. For instance, an inquisitor can dual weild crom/belm or foebane+belm and still dispel large targets. Useful for chopping up many enemies fast.

At the end of TOB, I have access to 17 HLAs so that is many GWW's if really needed.

At the end of TOB on the Cavalier with the priest spells I have 27-38 base damage on Carsomyr, -17 THAC0, and -12 AC with 233 HP. That's going to be slightly better THAC0, and 4ish more damage per swing.

I'd say that the Inquisitor is better overall during the entire duration of the saga than the Cavalier until late TOB (ONLY IF using Carsomyr) and even then it's close. The inquisitor has more usefulness in that it can dispel anything it wants (Even Mantle) and won't have to wait for mantle to be off, as well as having the ability to then use any weapons it chooses for all fights (IE, dual wield).

So it begins (and look at that roll!)

Gallowglass

Bear in mind that the SoA xp cap applied only to original BG2 without ToB installed, so that calculation is no longer relevant. For BG2ee (or original BG2 with ToB installed), the ToB cap applies throughout.

Soloing, you'll probably reach the ToB xp cap by half-way through SoA.

Objulen

ahhyep said:

no it's not. i am used to playing a fighter mage thief with no armor solo and still survive. a paladin wearing ankehg plate mail and a large shield +1, and a ring of protection +1 from the start of the game won't be having any issues with range... period.

Against what, exactly? I've played the game enough to see how quickly a couple of lucky rolls can knock down a low-level character, particularly with things like hobgoblin poison and enemies with fire/ice arrows. No one else is going to be targeted, you won't have any healing beyond LoH and a couple Cure Light Wounds, and kiting an ambush of ranged attackers isn't going to be simple. Sure, a fighter/mage/thief CAN survive -- depending on the rolls and other factors (wearing armor, etc), but that same character also has access to things like sleep that a paladin won't.

ahhyep said:

At the beginning of SOA, if the inquisitor has a DUHM special ability from dreams it's actually better than the paladin casted ability, I guess it goes off fighter level.

Bhaal spawn powers run off of character level. Paladin spell casting doesn't.

As I said, if we're just talking about BG2, then it's a different story. In BG1, however, a paladin won't have spells. The Inquisitor loses nothing in BG while gaining powerful anti-mage tools.

Sims are great, but you have take into account every stage of the game, not just high-levels.

ahhyep

A couple of unlucky rolls can take down any class no matter what they are. There is plenty of exp and gear available for free, with the addition of things like the ring of wizardry, to sell for tons of gold to get what is needed when soloing, without ever encountering an enemy. The early stages of the game before you have anhkeg plate or +1 large shield aren't really a concern for me since they come so quickly. There isn't much "toe-to-toe" fighting needed before I get great gear and a few levels. Once that happens on any class I can pretty much solo anything anyways. Inquisitor is looking to be much more useful mid to late BGEE, probably in SOD, and definitely in early SOA.

I just arrived at Nashkel, have not even hit the mines... and probably won't for a while.

1. Oil of Speed and Potions from Imoen, Xar, Montaron. Grab 500g diamond from tree.
2. Free Ring of Princes in Wildnerness Below Friendly Arm
3. Rings of Wizardry +9000g Friendly Arm
4. Kill Tarnesh - Truesight his mirror images and kill him in one hit mid cast.
5. Grab potions from Friendly arm in barrels and Khalid and jaheira.
6. Below high hedge kill a wolf and a skeleton and free melicamp the chicken for 2000exp. Ding level 3, character now has 30 hp.
7. Clam Marl down for 950 exp in Beregost
8. Return Sword for 500exp and kill assassin for 270exp in Beregost Inn.
9. (kill or pickpocket) Algernon for his dope cloak
10. Get the Stupefier +1 from inn in Beregost
11. Kill Silke either by using a potion of speed or dire charming her (cloak) and making her cast a spell on herself
12. Sell and use all your stuff, buy a +1 longsword from thunderhammer smithy
13. Go south and kill the ogres and hobgoblins for +1 ring and boots of stealth, return them for EXP and gold
14. Go to Nashkel and loot Ankeh armor


All of this takes about 10 minutes into the game and I am perfectly fine for the rest of the series. It took 22 bow shots from 3 bandits to hit me and actually do 6 damage to me. Here is my character:

Danacm

I always think that go straight to basilisk hunt at lvl 1, hire korax and go level 5.
After the game begins

SirBatince

you seem pretty knowledgeable in bg1, makes me wonder why you even asked for advice.

ahhyep

Danacm said:

I always think that go straight to basilisk hunt at lvl 1, hire korax and go level 5.
After the game begins

I feel too dirty doing that, I like to do a *little* work hahaha

ahhyep

SirBatince said:

you seem pretty knowledgeable in bg1, makes me wonder why you even asked for advice.

Well, it was because I was having trouble making up my mind on cavalier vs inquisitor

Objulen

What are the THAC0's on the ranged enemies? You probably won't need the shield spec for most of the bandits once you get the Ankeg Plate, but are there any, like the Sirens, who will hit you on less than a 20?

Bad rolls are bad rolls, but I'm considering the aggregated averages. If a pip raises what a group of ranged attackers has to roll from 19 to 20, you've effectively halved the DPS of each attacker, and since it's much harder to evade the multiple attacks (groups of elite kobolds come to mind), that can be an important factor (other than the elite kobolds awful THAC0), that's relatively more important.

ThacoBell

Blacktalon Elites would like to say hi.

SirBatince

The blonde bandits in the Camp itself are also much more buffed than the random spawn bandits. Har har.

Ithual

Cavalier doesn't allow ranged weapons. There may be moments when you wish you could use a nice deadshot or crossbow if you are soloing, of course, throwing axes also cover that area.

Some of the harder fights are draconic or fiendinsh is nature. Liches are undead but you didn't mention Undead Hunter, immune hold is a good perk for soloing.