Suggestion for BG2:EE: Xpcap for SoA
Djonne
Member Posts: 71
I've always felt that the last part of SoA is really too easy when playing with SoA+ToB.
This is mainly because we usually are a bit above 3,000,000xp (HLAs and 9th level spells) at the time of the fights against Irenicus, which was not the case in the classic game, with its 2,950,000xp cap.
An idea to make Irenicus a stronger mage than you are again, would be to bring back this xp cap, and removing it just after. The xp you gain would still be granted in the background, but disactivated until you retrieve your soul. Hence no balance issue at all for ToB. No headache for the developers.
I even think it makes some sense roleplay wise. Not having your soul should be limiting your potential, right?
There is the problem of Watcher's Keep, which can be made during SoA time. You would have to do it at a somewhat lower level than before. I personnally don't see it as a big issue. If you're stuck, wait until ToB to see what is lower down.
This is mainly because we usually are a bit above 3,000,000xp (HLAs and 9th level spells) at the time of the fights against Irenicus, which was not the case in the classic game, with its 2,950,000xp cap.
An idea to make Irenicus a stronger mage than you are again, would be to bring back this xp cap, and removing it just after. The xp you gain would still be granted in the background, but disactivated until you retrieve your soul. Hence no balance issue at all for ToB. No headache for the developers.
I even think it makes some sense roleplay wise. Not having your soul should be limiting your potential, right?
There is the problem of Watcher's Keep, which can be made during SoA time. You would have to do it at a somewhat lower level than before. I personnally don't see it as a big issue. If you're stuck, wait until ToB to see what is lower down.
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Comments
Not neccessarily a problem with reaching level 9 spells but HLA's could do with a serious overhaul.
Even without the SCS mod, playing against Irenicus on the 'insane' difficulty level is still very difficult, even with advanced characters. If you want it to be more challenging, I would suggest first trying to play it on one of the harder difficulty settings that already exist.
Still, as long as it's a cap that can be removed and not a hardcoded limit, I wouldn't mind very much.
Wasn't Sarevok fight made a bit harder when you installed TotSC?
Ex: If you were say level 35 fighting Irenicus (O.o what have you been doing? lol) Then Irenicus would be scaled sufficiently higher than you and with some comrades, etc.
BTW I believe that Sarevok has been made much stronger with the release of TotSC (doesn't he get a haste effect?).
Nerfing the player in anyway just because you think something is too easy or powerful is a lazy work around, and all it would do is remove something from the game that lots of other players currently enjoy.
In vanilla SoA, even if you make Irenicus level 50 and give him 1000 health and unlimited time stops and dragon breaths, he'll still be controlled by the vanilla AI, and there's only so much that it can do.
I played on SCS with tactics and on the 'insane' difficulty level. It was an extremely difficult battle and my entire party was killed several times. It took many different revisions in strategies and was one of the most difficult battles I've ever fought. I eventually won, but the time when I won lasted for over an hour real time (not counting all the times I lost and had to reload). When I did win, I only barely did so. Viconia was killed, despite having 341 HP, an armor class of -13, and three regenerating items. My PC survived because he had 4 regenerating items and because I had him run around to get his health back up when he came within 20 HP of dying out of 312.
"Easy" is most certainly not a word I would use to describe it.
This suggestion is about making Irenicus an interesting fight, as are the ones against Sarevok and Melissane, and as was the one against Irenicus before ToB existed.
It is a balance issue, not a difficulty issue, so please stop talking about Tactics/SCSII or anything completely anti-AD&D, you're completely missing the point, there, sorry.
Did you guys even ever played SoA without ToB in the first place? SoA was balanced for you not to have access to memorized level 9 spells. Removing the cap has completely OP your party for the end game...
Sarevok can be more challenging because 1) The increase in player party power is exponential rather than linear up to level 20 or so, making a lot of early encounters difficult; and 2) Sarevok as a warrior type is unlike Irenicus very effective with a simple move-and-melee AI due to his good stats and high magic resistance.
With the cap AND better mage AI, you don't need to have to install tactics to have a good challenge when you're an expert, don't you see this as a good thing?
If you want that particular battle to be harder, but don't want to change the rest of the game, I would suggest playing the rest of the game on one of the easier difficulty levels and then raising the difficulty scroll bar when you get to Irenicus. I used to do that sometimes before I installed SCS. Either that or just don't click the level-up button once you reach whichever point you've decided is the highest you want to go that game.
I am strongly opposed to any kind of level cap since increasing my characters' power over the course of the game is one of the main things I find fun in Baldur's Gate. If I reach a level cap and can't circumvent it, I stop playing wherever I happen to be since to continue is inherently pointless as no matter what I do I won't be accomplishing anything.
And I don't understand the fact that when you hit the cap you lose interest in the game.
When you reach 161,000 in BG1, do you actually stop playing and don't kill Sarevok?
Same here, even if xp is capped, item looting is still there and even increases in xp. It is just frozen up until you retrieve your soul.
Tell me, how many other RPGs as old as BG still have such a loyal fan following today? The reason why BG is still so popular is because it did everything right, including potential character power because seriously, becoming uberlicious and blasting through enemy mobs is extremely fun and enjoyable.
The only reason why people today feel like nerfing anything they consider to be overpowered or unbalanced is purely a sickness inherited to playing too many vastly inferior modern RPGs / MMOs where due to some some silly reasons, everything and every player needs to be made 100% equal, and being able to solo a party based game should simply be impossible, because you know everyone that enjoys soloing games with just 1 character absolutely shouldnt be allowed to have fun after they've already completed the game many many times over, and feel like soloing it for the fun of it, /sarcasm.
Stop asking for the single best RPG ever made to be nerfed to oblivion just because you dont like how other people can play the game. Me playing my game with a completely overpowered pwn everything in sight solo character does absolutely nothing to reduce your enjoyment of the same game, its SINGLE PLAYER!.
In BG2 I reach the level cap all the time, especially if I have a small party. Some games I've quit half-way through. More recently I've been using Shadowkeeper to re-set my characters' XP and level to zero and one, respectively so that I can continue to advance. This workaround isn't perfect though since level-based spells like Magic Missile and Energy Blades don't really work anymore if the game thinks the characters are level ones. It's a viable option when I'm playing with a party since everyone won't reach the cap at the same time, but if I'm playing solo it makes difficult encounters such as Irenicus and Watcher's Keep almost impossible since my spells and saving throws won't work the way they're supposed to for a while. I eventually quit my main solo game because of that. I was in Watcher's keep and my cleric PC went from a functional level 39 to a temporarily okay level 1 with the HP and proficiencies of a level 40, but not the spells that go with it.
Yea, I like playing absurdly uber overleveled characters and blasting through everything, its awesome fun.
And I'm even asking for something that already existed.
For SoA.
The part of BG2 that almost everybody agree is far superior to the other, ToB, which kind of reduced the interest of SoA because it caused imbalance to it due to the removal of the xp cap.
Cap exists in BG1, and it is even less understandable there, since you're not lacking part of your essence.
I find it ridiculous to be able to have a mage far more powerful than Irenicus, who in the various sequence is shown to be an extremely powerful mage. Give him improved alacrity, at least...
And for the fact that you lose interest when not seeing your xp increasing, I'm sorry but I don't think you represent the majority of players there.
Lets put it this way: for un unmodded game, which solution is the best in term of general balance of the game for a newcomer to BG saga? I say with the cap on, since I find the SoA part of classic game way more interestingly balanced than the SoA part of SoA+ToB.