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The term "Adventurer" is really dumb, and I wish it was dropped already.

KaliestoKaliesto Member Posts: 282
edited June 2017 in Off-Topic
They really should be called Mercenaries since that is basically what they are, but instead they put themselves in harm's way in more perilous situation than that is considered normal for a mercenary job, I swear I blame Neverwinter Nights for the term to make it sound really dumb.

(Moderator please lock this topic, this is getting ridiculous).
Post edited by Kaliesto on
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Comments

  • KaliestoKaliesto Member Posts: 282
    edited May 2017
    Idk, the general consensus with older DnD fans is that they despised that term because they felt realistically that most people in a DnD world wouldn't just decide to go up, and "adventure" to put themselves in harm's way with no general purpose other than for fame & bragging rights.

    It just seems like too much of unrealistic random behavior for anyone without some kind of "real" purpose to go out and "adventure" if they had to do so.
  • O_BruceO_Bruce Member Posts: 2,790
    But the phrase "I used to be mercenary like you, then I took arrow in the knee" doesn't sound so good anymore. It has to be "adventurer".

    Now, focusing on the topic at hand, I think there is difference between adventurer and mercenary - the fist doesn't have to be motivated by money. For example, traveling paladin can and most likely will help out other people in his adventure, but generally won't ask for any reward. Mercenary, most of the time, would want to just make a living, and that's understandable.

    So basically, being mercenary is about making a living, while being adventurer can be about something else than money. Thrill of adventure and discovery, some self-imposed mission and so on.
  • tbone1tbone1 Member Posts: 1,985
    Actually, a lot of the European explorers from the late 1400s on were called adventurers, even the Portuguese sailors who were trying to sail around Africa before Columbus sailed to the New World.
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    As far as written literature goes, Publius Ovidius Naso already used the term 'Adventurer' before Anno Domini even was a thing. And it's very likely he wasn't the person who conned the term.

    Even Ancient Rome had its fair share of NEET's it seems.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    What is a NEET?

    The only thing I can think of is "not evil evil things" from Angel, but that seems quite wrong.
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870

    What is a NEET?

    Someone who is not in education, employment, or training. NEET for short.
  • abacusabacus Member Posts: 1,307
    edited May 2017
    I think adventurer is fine for out-of-character discussion... it's the broadest fit for all classes & motivations.

    That said, I do find it cringeworthy when it pops up in-game... if someone were to describe themselves that way IRL, I personally would roll my eyes and mentally give them another title (probably only four letters long). What? Went on a gap year to Thailand, did you? How original of you.

    I have a similar reaction to "the party".
    Post edited by abacus on
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    Well real life is a bit different from life in a world where people go dungeon delving and slaying dragons and so on.

    Although I think there have been and are people in the real world who could be characterized accurately as adventurers.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    As I mentioned, there are people in real life who call themselves adventurers. They usually make thier living by filming it for TV, which would make them the equivelent of Volo. Some have inherited wealth (e.g. Sir Ranulph Fiennes).
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    It is more correct to call anyone going on expeditions an 'Explorer'. For that's what they (and Volo) are. But then again, it seems nowadays anyone who's doing extreme sports for the kicks calls themselves 'Aventurer' as well. Me? I call them 'Death Wishers'.
  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    edited May 2017
    I have to disagree. One could just as well say that Adventurer equals Tourist. Or just simply Traveler for that matter. It is not an occupation, nor really a blanket term to call complete strangers on the road by so to speak.

    On the other hand exploration is as old as life itself. Whenever the Explorer seeks for resources (loot), researches on the field (questing), or tries to establishes new ways. I think the term fits like a glove.
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 7,320
    I have to agree with Fardragon that there seems to be a cultural issue here. In the UK the term adventurer would seem to describe the activities of the PC perfectly - unlike explorer (as territory is mainly well-known) or mercenary (as they're not normally being paid by anyone).

    Just to double-check my own perceptions I did an internet search on Ranulph Fiennes and Walter Raleigh. Both are prominently described as adventurers, which is what I expected. Nor would I have the slightest problem with someone in real life describing themselves as an adventurer - if indeed they were used to going on adventures.
  • abacusabacus Member Posts: 1,307
    Fardragon said:


    I do wonder if there is some cultural/national bias coming in here. To me (English) it seems perfectly natural and reasonable to call someone and adventurer, both in fantasy and real life. To be disparaging about such people sounds like geek prejudice against non-geeks.

    More of a get-a-real-job-you-pompous-twerp prejudice really.

    It's a self ascribed title, and as such strikes me as inherently pretentious. I've a good friend who has done 6 of the world's 10 highest peaks and a number of other trails and similar (he goes every couple of years as a charity thing)... he doesn't descibe/define himself by these things... he does that by what he does the other 10-11 months of the year. They're just things he's done.

    U.K. British and done a jaunt or two myself here btw.
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 7,320
    abacus said:

    It's a self ascribed title, and as such strikes me as inherently pretentious. I've a good friend who has done 6 of the world's 10 highest peaks and a number of other trails and similar (he goes every couple of years as a charity thing)... he doesn't descibe/define himself by these things... he does that by what he does the other 10-11 months of the year. They're just things he's done.

    U.K. British and done a jaunt or two myself here btw.

    It might be self-ascribed, but normally would be applied by others.

    As for your friend, from what you've said his main occupation is clearly not adventuring, so why should be describe himself as an adventurer? Contrast that, however, with someone like Ranulph Fiennes whose main occupation (at least in later life) has been adventuring.
  • abacusabacus Member Posts: 1,307
    Looking back, my comments are heavily based on a particular type of person that I've spent altogether too much time with... wet-behind-the-ears numpties from extremely privileged backgrounds who go on a glorified holiday (on their parents' dime, of course) and then strut around like they've discovered some profound calling.

    I recognise that this isn't the case for all applications of the word.
  • TheElfTheElf Member Posts: 798
    Idk, if the real world were full of monsters and people who couldn't solve their own problems without some level 6 adventurers showing up, sounds like about the most noble occupation one could have to me. Never heard anyone having problems with the term before.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    Every now and then people get annoyed with the language used in RPGs and we get a thread like this somewhere (not necessarily on beamdog's forum).

    I mean I am not trying to say their annoyance is wrong or anything, although I do disagree with it.
  • KaliestoKaliesto Member Posts: 282
    edited May 2017
    The Issue:

    It gets really annoying hearing the word "Adventurer" in the most cringe worthy tone, and it starting to feel more like a mockery of DnD than anything actually serious. NWN & NWN (MMORPG) just went violated that word over, and over again in the most terrible tones, and usage in writing. The other problems with "Adventurer" nowadays that is now being used in almost every sentence in DnD games from villagers, and to whatever, and to me that signals incredibly lazy writing, it is like they couldn't come up with anything other than reminding you that you are a "Adventurer" over, and over again.

    Also you have stereotype characters like one in Temple of Elemental Evil that really make a mockery of a Adventurer with that writing in it (Oh? You want to go out adventuring do you? How about not sounding like a moron first?).

    Other (Somewhat related for writing):

    When you have villagers, and other characters spouting the same lines to you over, and over again like "Well Met" that signals to me the game developers didn't care to put in any soul into their work, but this is not the case so much for BG & IWD, but more of a issue with NWN. I just don't want to see a trainwreck like that again in future DnD games by making every character say the same thing over, and over again, it is unrealistic & pretty annoying.

    The core issue I'm trying to get here is that certain terms & writing are feeling more like a running gag that never stops, and it also baffles me that every character must say "well met" for the 100th time.

    Conclusion:

    Though I don't really agree how Adventurer is applied in the dnd World, I just wished they came up with something better than that term.


  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    Good morning! Most cultures have a standard/formulaic greeting, which you would expect to here whenever you spoke to someone.

    Back when BG was first written, voice over in computer games was rare and minimal. No one would have considered recording dozens or different greetings, even if it made sense. And NWN is a toolset. You want NPCs to say something different? Write it yourself.
  • KaliestoKaliesto Member Posts: 282
    edited May 2017
    Fardragon said:

    Good morning! Most cultures have a standard/formulaic greeting, which you would expect to here whenever you spoke to someone.

    Back when BG was first written, voice over in computer games was rare and minimal. No one would have considered recording dozens or different greetings, even if it made sense. And NWN is a toolset. You want NPCs to say something different? Write it yourself.


    I understand that, but the point I was trying to make that not every person is going to say "well met", and especially evil aligned characters, the term "well met" was so overused in voiced lines or in writing that it created a unrealistic atmosphere with the characters, and I'm well aware that most cultures have their own greeting (I'm not ignorant on this, apologies if it seemed like I was first).

    There is a lot of Synonyms that could have been used to diversify the cast of characters in voiced lines, and other standards for evil-aligned characters, but they were very underused because some reason "well met" must be pounded to the ground for everything.

    Well Met, Well Met, Well Met, Well Met, Well Met.

    WELL MET

    WELL MET

    WELL MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET

    It haunts me so much.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    I feel like you might be blowing things just slightly out of proportion.
  • KaliestoKaliesto Member Posts: 282
    edited May 2017
    I apologize, I came to despise that greeting just out of principle of being overused since that is voiced line I hear often more than other variations of a greeting whether positive or hostile.
  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 2,072
    I'm fine with the term adventurer, but like @whoeversaidit it is definitely a common cause of bad writing, jarring and pretentious in the way it is used. I think it comes from having too lofty and unrealistic associations with the word.

    However, that's also why I feel like using the word mercenary, which is even more restrictive than adventurer, would run into the same kind of trouble very fast. A writer that can't handle the word adventurer will not be better prepared to use mercenary. Less common synonyms like freelancer, freeboter, sellsword or the like might do better, but it would still run into the above problem plus a feeling of overuse of slangish terms.

    Finally, as for people using the word adventurer to describe themselves in the modern age, just big fucking lolz. No. Just no. Non-jokingly calling yourself that is a huge mark in the pretentious douchebag book.
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