The Good, the Bad and the Ugly - Classes/kits edition - Shamans

darko1beamdog

Hello there!

Would someone who's knowledgeable on the subject of shamans in BG EE, please tell me what they're all about?

What are the pros and cons of rolling a shaman? How do they fit in the grand scheme of things?
And so on...

Hopefully we'll all learn something new from this discussion.

Thanks in advance.

Zaghoul

I like the class myself, having played shamans quite a bit (druids even more). The ability to forgo memorization of spells is nice, esp. after having experience with the druid spell selection it was easier to choose. Here they are more akin to druids but I tend to play them as the humanoid race versions of cleric type figures from my old PnP days.

Rolling up shamans is somewhat less stressful than any other divine class of castor as Wis will not give any bonus spells (lower wis. will not hurt spellcasting). Other physical stats can be focused on a little more.
The ability to summon spirits anytime is quite useful. There are various tactics involved in getting the most use out of summons but they are quite useful (solo OR in a group).
Fits half orcs quite nicely with their str. The weapon selection is a nice change of pace as well with the ability to use slashing and piercing weapons. Overall quite a different feel than the standard divine classes.

To top all that off, in BG they will reach 10th lvl (exp cap removed only, 9th vanilla-4th lvl spells only) and get the chance to use 5th lvl spells like insect plague and ironskins.
I'm playing an ogre shaman at the moment with a 9 wis (EEKeeper . Low wis doesn't hurt a bit (well, he can't read scrolls due to low Int, zero lore, and low Dex means watch out for loose gravel, but hey, he's got part of the ogre combat voiceset "I-will- crush!) Fun though, lots o fun
I tend to enjoy and work weaknesses of classes or races into play. It often leads to new uses for less frequently used spells as well.
Heck, anything that includes a new opportunity for H/O's with AOE spells is darn nice.

ThacoBell

Shamans are a lot of fun. The overly simple explanation is that they are basically the sorceror version of druids. Their exclusive spells are not overly powerful, but have good utility.

darko1beamdog

Thanks very much for the comments, @Zaghoul and @ThacoBell. You covered quite a bit of ground there.
Is the shaman a good substitute for the druid and/or cleric?

Zaghoul

@darko1beamdog I find they sub quite well. No turn undead ability but they have some spells that protect and deal with spectral undead a little more. Healing is fine, summons from druid are great. Most of my runs unless a cleric CHARNAME are all druid/shaman based so I may be a bit biased.

_Luke_

Zaghoul said:

To top all that off, in BG they will reach 10th lvl and get the chance to use 5th lvl spells like insect plague and ironskin.

You can't reach level 10 with a Shaman (the XP cap is 161,000 XP). Only rogue classes (bards, thieves) and druids can reach level 10. Shamans can't exceed level 9......

OlvynChuru

Luke93 said:

Zaghoul said:

To top all that off, in BG they will reach 10th lvl and get the chance to use 5th lvl spells like insect plague and ironskin.

You can't reach level 10 with a Shaman (the XP cap is 161,000 XP). Only rogue classes (bards, thieves) can reach level 10. Shamans can't exceed level 9......

Druids can also reach level 10, but shamans can't. Shamans require the same amount of experience to level up as mages and sorcerers.

ThacoBell

darko1beamdog said:

Thanks very much for the comments, @Zaghoul and @ThacoBell. You covered quite a bit of ground there.
Is the shaman a good substitute for the druid and/or cleric?

I find that using either a Druid or a Shaman is all the divine casting I need.

Zaghoul

Luke93 said:

Zaghoul said:

To top all that off, in BG they will reach 10th lvl and get the chance to use 5th lvl spells like insect plague and ironskin.

You can't reach level 10 with a Shaman (the XP cap is 161,000 XP). Only rogue classes (bards, thieves) can reach level 10. Shamans can't exceed level 9......

Doh! Yup, I've been playing with an EXP cap remover long enough now it's hard to remember that sometimes.

_Luke_

@OlvynChuru You're right, post edited.

darko1beamdog

Based on the info you people were kind enough to provide, I've come to the conclusion that the shaman indeed is a viable substitute for a cleric or druid.
Feel free to continue as all input is appreciated.

jsaving

There are a couple of downsides to shamans that haven't been mentioned yet. The biggest of these is, they can't multiclass with fighter and hence are going to be much less melee-viable than a fighter/druid (or ranger/cleric) would be. They also can't do other things while summoning spirits, which in practice means players tend to get bored and ignore spirit-summoning (though in fairness the spirits actually aren't bad). Finally, shamans can't get a stronghold of any type, which doesn't matter much if you're sticking to BG1/SoD but hurts in BG2.

The big advantage of shamans, though, is that you can give them situationally useful spells like slow poison and negative plane protection without much weakening their combat-casting prowess. This in turn frees up your other divine casters to memorize fewer defensive/utility spells and more offensive or DPS-enhancing spells (in the same way that sorcerers can learn identify and protection from petrification so your other mages can focus on magic missile and chromatic orb). Having both a shaman and a fighter/druid (or ranger/cleric) can work well.

One other point worth mentioning is that, while shamans are stereotyped as casting only druid spells, they actually get a couple of pretty good shaman-only spells.

ThacoBell

There is an existing shaman stronghold mod to make up for the lack of a vanilla one.

darko1beamdog

I see. Thank you very much for the intel.

I'm going to go off topic and mark the next sub-question of this discussion with a "*".
If you're going to comment and refer to this particular question, I would ask that you please put "*" at the beginning so that we might mitigate potential confusion. Thanks in advance.

* Strongholds have been mentioned on multiple occasions in this discussion. I've bought BG 2 EE but haven't played it yet.
Could someone put up some bullet points and elaborate in short on what strongholds are, their purpose etc.?

ThacoBell

* Strongholds are a place that your character can take over as a base of operations. Each one comes with its own rewards and (usually) short questline. They aren't essential, but have good exp and class specific rewards.

darko1beamdog

* @ThacoBell - When you say base of operations, do you mean storage facilities, shops etc.? How deep does the rabbit hole go?

ThacoBell

darko1beamdog said:

* @ThacoBell - When you say base of operations, do you mean storage facilities, shops etc.? How deep does the rabbit hole go?

*I BELIEVE they all have storage space and they all are a safe place to rest. I only know one that has a shop, another one is a consistent source for a certain item type. At least two provide gold on a timer. They aren't super major or anything, but they are a nice addition.

darko1beamdog

* @ThacoBell - Great. Thanks.

Legend

jsaving said:

There are a couple of downsides to shamans that haven't been mentioned yet. The biggest of these is, they can't multiclass with fighter and hence are going to be much less melee-viable than a fighter/druid (or ranger/cleric) would be. They also can't do other things while summoning spirits, which in practice means players tend to get bored and ignore spirit-summoning (though in fairness the spirits actually aren't bad). Finally, shamans can't get a stronghold of any type, which doesn't matter much if you're sticking to BG1/SoD but hurts in BG2.

The big advantage of shamans, though, is that you can give them situationally useful spells like slow poison and negative plane protection without much weakening their combat-casting prowess. This in turn frees up your other divine casters to memorize fewer defensive/utility spells and more offensive or DPS-enhancing spells (in the same way that sorcerers can learn identify and protection from petrification so your other mages can focus on magic missile and chromatic orb). Having both a shaman and a fighter/druid (or ranger/cleric) can work well.

One other point worth mentioning is that, while shamans are stereotyped as casting only druid spells, they actually get a couple of pretty good shaman-only spells.

Out of curiosity, what are the shaman-only spells you mentioned?

Zaghoul

@legend Shaman specific spells are quite helpful.
Spirit Ward, Writhing Fog, Spiritual Clarity, Spirit Fire, Recall Spirit, Spiritual Lock, and Ether Gate
http://baldursgate.wikia.com/wiki/Shaman

The first time I had a shaman automatically cast Spiritual Clarity or Recall Spirit on a confused or dead NPC was awesome.