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Recent Wand Changes

Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
in General Discussions NWN:EE
I've noticed that wands can now carry far more charges than 50. I've also noted that monetary values for said wands seem to have been de-valued simultaneously. For instance, a Wand of Missles (3) once sold (using default Toolset values) for 1500 gold from a default merchant. However, since the recent change that same wand now sells for about 300 gold. It will still show the 1500 gold value in the toolset, but in actual gameplay it is drastically reduced. Such a change can wreak havoc on PW economies and balance. Has anyone else experienced this?

Comments

  • GrymlordeGrymlorde Member Posts: 121
    edited June 2018
    I created a new module with no haks or customization in 1.69 and tested it in both 1.69 and EE. The merchant was set to sell at 100% of toolset price with no appraise checks.

    Result: In 1.69 the wand of missiles sells for 1,000gp as expected while in EE it is offered for 200 gp.

    As for # of charges, in 1.69 the wand of missiles was capped at 50 while in EE it can be changed to 250.

    Conclusion: I get the same result (sell price of wands is 20% of 1.69 asking price) that you did.

    Please open a bug with BeamDog. The increased # of charges is a feature while selling the wand for 20% of the toolset price is definitely a bug.
  • pscythepscythe Member Posts: 116
    edited July 2018
    That was actually the case since EE was first officially released. Maybe it have been there even before.

    The 20% in price seems to reflect the 20% in charges.
  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    edited July 2018
    I noticed that both arrived simultaneously. The 250 charges was by design (and is probably closer to a 500% increase). The drastic de-valuing may be close to the same, only in reverse.

    But I'm glad others have noticed it. I often wonder if I'm just crazy. But then quickly realize that my noticing has no direct correlation to my inherent instability.

    No matter, I have reported this on Redmine: Issue 37900 created.
    Post edited by Grizzled_Dwarflord on
  • superfly2000superfly2000 Member Posts: 76
    That "buff" seems steep indeed. Wands in general could need a slight buff though....they tend to always get sold and never be used (the way it is now)....

    ...naturally depending to some extent in what world you are playing maybe...but still...
  • GrymlordeGrymlorde Member Posts: 121
    edited July 2018
    pscythe said:

    That was actually the case since EE was first officially released. Maybe it have been there even before.

    The 20% in price seems to reflect the 20% in charges.

    That makes sense. However I think it was a bad decision. What they should've done was multiply all wand prices by 5 so that 50 charge wands would still have the same price. And what about builders who want to maintain 3.x compatibility and keep 50 charges? Or the builders who are not enabling the X2 switch for 50 charge wands? Why isn't this a switch as well? And why aren't standard palette wands 250 charges?

    Also, it is not possible to craft a wand with 250 charges without custom code.

    Builders now have to decide if they want 250 charge wands (which must be custom made since no standard wands are 250 charges) or if they want 50 charge wands to sell for 80% less than before. Beamdog took a good idea but did a lousy implementation in my opinion.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,760
    Grymlorde said:


    Please open a bug with BeamDog. The increased # of charges is a feature while selling the wand for 20% of the toolset price is definitely a bug.

    Has this been filed yet?
  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    JuliusBorisov said:

    Grymlorde said:


    Please open a bug with BeamDog. The increased # of charges is a feature while selling the wand for 20% of the toolset price is definitely a bug.

    Has this been filed yet?
    Aye. I reported here, # 37,900.
  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    I didn't see any fixes to this yet. Has this been forgotten? As a reminder, this was an issue where there wasn't an issue, and someone arbitrarily decided to give wands 250 charges, without thought for economics and balance, thus devaluing the cost of all wands everywhere across the NWN multiverse.
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,760
    It's been submitted to the internal tracker. https://support.baldursgate.com/issues/37900

    As mentioned during the livestreams, we'll return to broader bug-fixing once the big features are in (64bit, NWSync, the Android version).
  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    Perfect, thank you, Master Julius.
  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    It's been nearly a year since this was broken. Any chance that this is going to be fixed this year? It's not okay to break something like that, and subsequently upset the balance across every module and PW out there that decided to invest in EE. For those who need a refresher. Here's a pic of a fully charged Wand of Missiles that once sold for 1500 gold pieces (the old default toolset standard). At 1500 gold, such an item was well out of reach of new adventurers, and for good reason -- it's like having a small Nuke when you're second level. It now sells for 200 gold pieces, and so young magelings can buy a six-pack:
    arqnx7glgtkv.png

    The same could be said for the tileset textures gone awry that I reported. It's been 6 months since I reported that. And still not a fix. I understand that there's work on the shader, and I am appreciative of that, believe me. But what I don't understand is why Beamdog broke things that weren't broken, and then have made no attempt to fix these things. Is it really just so that more millenials can play it on their androids for a greater revenue stream?

    My apologies if this comes off as bent sideways. I lose patience after 6 months.

  • Prince_RaymondPrince_Raymond Member Posts: 445
    @Grizzled_Dwarflord I understand your frustration, Master Dwarflord. Just as you have been waiting for progress to be made on this bug, so too have I been waiting for news on the Combat UI's attack bonus miscalculation issue and Weapon Masters being able to select Unarmed Strike as their weapon of choice. However, we must trust in @Beamdog's wisdom and technical knowledge that these bugs will eventually be fixed in due time. Two of the three big features (Android and NWSync) are in. All that's left is the release of 64-Bit, and for the Google Play fiasco to get resolved, so that they can focus their efforts on broader bug-fixing. If you have truly run out of patience, feel free to borrow mine. Stay strong. Have faith. Thank you for reading, and happy gaming to all.
  • ShadooowShadooow Member Posts: 402
    @Grizzled_Dwarflord try community patch 1.72, it does not fix the charge issue but it does solve textures in dungeon tileset (though I recently found another tileset where this happens). Also, the texture issue is caused by the new shaders. I highly recommend to every player to disable all new graphical features of NWN:EE they are just causing issues for no apparent benefit (to me at least).
  • AaezilAaezil Member Posts: 178
    Sucks that bugs and playability of the ee games takes a backseat to playing them on phones. Le sigh.
  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    Shadooow wrote: »
    @Grizzled_Dwarflord try community patch 1.72, it does not fix the charge issue but it does solve textures in dungeon tileset (though I recently found another tileset where this happens). Also, the texture issue is caused by the new shaders. I highly recommend to every player to disable all new graphical features of NWN:EE they are just causing issues for no apparent benefit (to me at least).

    That is something we considered, and something I am still considering. I'm trying to weigh the pros and cons of adding it to an EE server that uses the CEP and ACP and has it's own custom tlk and a few other haks. I guess I'm hesitant because I'm not quite certain to what extent I'm going to have to make mergers.
  • ShadooowShadooow Member Posts: 402
    what about just try to install it without any merging and see what happens?
  • HawkwinterHawkwinter Member Posts: 14
    So - I think I have got a fix until Beamdog fixes it on their end.
    https://pastebin.com/dXP9mtHN

    Just a replacement 2da I whipped up. So far as I can tell it works properly in game, the only downside is that the prices are wrong in the toolset. But I'd rather that than have them be wrong in game.
  • GrymlordeGrymlorde Member Posts: 121
    Has anyone been using wands with 250 charges? If so, how has that impacted your game? In my single player module testing, I haven't noticed a difference because the module is finished before even 50 charges are used up on any given wand.
  • ShadooowShadooow Member Posts: 402
    edited May 2019
    Grymlorde wrote: »
    Has anyone been using wands with 250 charges? If so, how has that impacted your game? In my single player module testing, I haven't noticed a difference because the module is finished before even 50 charges are used up on any given wand.

    No, but vanilla wand crafting can now go beyond 50 charges.
  • Grizzled_DwarflordGrizzled_Dwarflord Member Posts: 168
    edited August 2019
    Any chance on getting Wands returned to their traditional values with the upcoming patch?
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