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Theism - The feel in your head

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  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    ThacoBell said:

    @LadyRhian Um no. None of what you mention of God havinga wife, or Adam having 2 is anywhere in the Bible. You are confusing multiple different religions. There is a very large difference between Middle Eastern polytheism and Chrisitan canon.

    Actually, no. I'm not confused. I am reading the Bible with things that are already in there. Like the two creation stories in Genesis 1 to 2:4 and Genesis 2:5 to the end of Genesis 2. So far, you haven't given any proof.

    This is from Wikipedia: "Asherah is identified as the queen consort of the Sumerian god Anu, and Ugaritic El,[1] the oldest deities of their respective pantheons,[2] as well as Yahweh, the god of Israel and Judah.[3] This role gave her a similarly high rank in the Ugaritic pantheon.[4] Despite her association with Yahweh in extra-biblical sources, Deuteronomy 12 has Yahweh commanding the destruction of her shrines so as to maintain purity of his worship.[5]"
    "William Dever's book Did God Have a Wife? adduces further archaeological evidence—for instance, the many female figurines unearthed in ancient Israel, (known as Pillar-Base Figurines)—as supporting the view that in Israelite folk religion of the monarchal period, Asherah functioned as a goddess and consort of Yahweh and was worshiped as the Queen of Heaven, for whose festival the Hebrews baked small cakes."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asherah

    There's also this:https://www.gotquestions.org/Asherah-pole.html
    Most areas in that time and place had a god and goddess designated as responsible for the well-being of crops and livestock. Likely, in the constant evolution of pagan gods and goddesses, Asherah was one of the names given for a fertility goddess in the region. Asherah’s consorts varied, depending on the cultic beliefs of the people—sometimes Asherah was said to consort with the Canaanite creator-god, El; or with the god of fertility, Ba’al; or, horrifically, with the Lord God Himself.

    Why "Horrifically?" Why would the idea of God having a wife be so horrifying?

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/42154769/ns/technology_and_science-science/t/did-god-have-wife-scholar-says-he-did/#.XBmyGRpKiT8

    Grond0mlnevese
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    And this also just came up for me: https://www.ancient-origins.net/artifacts-ancient-writings/what-happened-eden-alternative-translation-tells-very-different-story-021833?utm_source=sumome&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=sumome_share&fbclid=IwAR1s2e1WEohGGW_9xlp8vdutBcD4p8Wcz0hFa4ofd71GlFkKDG3_n5QZc4g
    What Happened in Eden? Alternative Translation Tells a Very Different Story

    I also love "101 Myths in the Bible":https://www.amazon.com/101-Myths-Bible-Invented-Biblical/dp/1570718423
    Gary Greenberg is the author of The Moses Mystery: The African Origins of the Jewish People. He is a member Society of Biblical Literature, The Egypt Exploration Society, The American Research Center in Egypt and The Archaeological Institute of America. He has addressed The International Conference of Egyptologists, The Society of Biblical Literature and conferences held by the American Research Center in Egypt. He is a senior trial lawyer for the Criminal Defense Division of the Legal Aid Society in New York City.

    Grond0mlnevese
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    And there is a difference between what's in the Bible and what is the Christian canon.

  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,456

    Isn't the question, "Was Eve really?"

    That's one of those questions only the book authors can really answer.

    Why do you say that?

  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,066

    Isn't the question, "Was Eve really?"

    That's one of those questions only the book authors can really answer.

    Why do you say that?
    Why wouldn't I say that? All authors take influence from their own experience to at least some degree. It is not exactly a rarity to find fictional characters which are based off people, folklore or plays after all. Could be the author did indeed know an Eve, had a crush on her, and decided to implement her into his stories for all we know.

  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,456

    Isn't the question, "Was Eve really?"

    That's one of those questions only the book authors can really answer.

    Why do you say that?
    Why wouldn't I say that? All authors take influence from their own experience to at least some degree. It is not exactly a rarity to find fictional characters which are based off people, folklore or plays after all. Could be the author did indeed know an Eve, had a crush on her, and decided to implement her into his stories for all we know.
    But that wouldn't be relevant to whether the Eve described in the book is real or not. As in Eve who was made by god from the rib of Adam or whatever. Of course I am aware people named eve have existed and still do.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 9,560
    @LadyRhian
    "These are the generations of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens." Genesis 2:4

    "When no bush of the field was yet in the land and no small plant of the field had yet sprung up—for the LORD God had not caused it to rain on the land, and there was no man to work the ground," Genesis 2:5

    Nope, no mention of Asherah or two wives for Adam. You also keep bringing up explicitly Sumerian and other pagan gods, even though they have ZERO to do with the Christian God. You may as well be arguing that Buddha is really an Egyptian deity, while trying to use the Koran (I really hope I spelled that right) as proof. Your stance is a mishmash of at least 3-4 different religions.

    ArtonaBalrog99
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    ThacoBell said:

    @LadyRhian
    "These are the generations of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens." Genesis 2:4

    "When no bush of the field was yet in the land and no small plant of the field had yet sprung up—for the LORD God had not caused it to rain on the land, and there was no man to work the ground," Genesis 2:5

    Nope, no mention of Asherah or two wives for Adam. You also keep bringing up explicitly Sumerian and other pagan gods, even though they have ZERO to do with the Christian God. You may as well be arguing that Buddha is really an Egyptian deity, while trying to use the Koran (I really hope I spelled that right) as proof. Your stance is a mishmash of at least 3-4 different religions.

    11 Then God said, “Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds.” And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

    14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. 16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

    20 And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.” 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.” 23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

    24 And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

    27 So God created mankind in his own image,
    in the image of God he created them;
    male and female he created them.

    Now, Genesis 1: Creatures and Plants created before man. Man and woman created at the same time.

    Genesis 2: Man created before plants and animals. Man created alone, without a woman.

    4 This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were created, when the Lord God made the earth and the heavens.

    5 Now no shrub had yet appeared on the earth[b] and no plant had yet sprung up, for the Lord God had not sent rain on the earth and there was no one to work the ground, 6 but streams[c] came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground. 7 Then the Lord God formed a man[d] from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.
    8 Now the Lord God had planted a garden in the east, in Eden; and there he put the man he had formed. 9 The Lord God made all kinds of trees grow out of the ground—trees that were pleasing to the eye and good for food. In the middle of the garden were the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

    10 A river watering the garden flowed from Eden; from there it was separated into four headwaters. 11 The name of the first is the Pishon; it winds through the entire land of Havilah, where there is gold. 12 (The gold of that land is good; aromatic resin[e] and onyx are also there.) 13 The name of the second river is the Gihon; it winds through the entire land of Cush.[f] 14 The name of the third river is the Tigris; it runs along the east side of Ashur. And the fourth river is the Euphrates.

    15 The Lord God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it. 16 And the Lord God commanded the man, “You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.”

    18 The Lord God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him.”

    19 Now the Lord God had formed out of the ground all the wild animals and all the birds in the sky. He brought them to the man to see what he would name them; and whatever the man called each living creature, that was its name. 20 So the man gave names to all the livestock, the birds in the sky and all the wild animals.

    Genesis 2: Animals created before a woman.

    And there's the proof, directly from the Bible. Creation Myth 1: Man and woman created after plants and animals, at the same time.

    Genesis 2: Man created before plants and animals, plants and animals, then a woman.

  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 4,985
    You're implying that that means two wives for Adam, then? It's not implicitly stated so that would be a stretch, logical maybe, but still a stretch. No mention of any wife of God though...

  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    Actually, it's the Jews who came up with the idea that it meant that Adam has two wives. And archaeology that says that God (El and Yahweh, who are the same person in the Bible El= Elohim) had a wife named Asherah. And so did Yahweh.

    The Bible was not set down all at once, by one individual. It was made up of many books, rewritten numerous times. God is named El or Elohim, Or Yahweh/Jehovah. All different names because they were incorporated from different religions, made into one. And yes, El (one of the names of God) had a wife. And so did Yahweh/jehovah, according to archaeology. The El/Elohim is the name of God in chapter one of Genesis. So if El had a wife, so did God, as EL is responsible for the creation in Genesis 1 to Genesis 2:4.

  • Balrog99Balrog99 Member Posts: 4,985
    LadyRhian said:

    Actually, it's the Jews who came up with the idea that it meant that Adam has two wives. And archaeology that says that God (El and Yahweh, who are the same person in the Bible El= Elohim) had a wife named Asherah. And so did Yahweh.

    The Bible was not set down all at once, by one individual. It was made up of many books, rewritten numerous times. God is named El or Elohim, Or Yahweh/Jehovah. All different names because they were incorporated from different religions, made into one. And yes, El (one of the names of God) had a wife. And so did Yahweh/jehovah, according to archaeology. The El/Elohim is the name of God in chapter one of Genesis. So if El had a wife, so did God, as EL is responsible for the creation in Genesis 1 to Genesis 2:4.

    That won't fly with folks who believe the Bible, and only the Bible, is divinely inspired scripture and anything not in the Bible, well, isn't...

    semiticgodThacoBell
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,456
    So why should anyone care what the bible says?

This discussion has been closed.