It is kind of hilarious looking at the launch-era critiques of the game, and just how off-base they look today. How petty and minor they seem.
I still think there are some serious issues overall. The second half of the game seems a lot less polished, play-tested, etc. And so still feels kind of rough. But overall the product is very good for what it is.
Frankly, I wouldn't recommend it to anyone except diehard BG1/BG2 fans. But it's exactly the perfect product for those people. It's a much more difficult game than both of those, generally speaking, especially on insane difficulty.
The story of BG1 leads to the next parts of the saga, it's the beginning of something bigger, you realize your status and who you are. In the future, at the end of everything (Throne of Bhaal), The Realms will see you as a hero who ended a legacy of evil, or as a great villain who embraces that evil and rises with it.
This is big.
SoD is a mere filler or "interlude" that leads to nothing in particular, a pretentious little adventure that can be played, but is not very memorable, and has little to do with the main saga.
This is meh.
Hot take, I feel sort of the same with SoA. Not that SoA's story is bad, far from it, Just that it has barely anything to do with the bhaalspawn. Sure, you get your
Spoiler
soul stolen because you're a bhaalspawn, Imoen is revealed to be one and the slayer gets introduced
but it all just feels like a side quest. A really good side quest but still one nonetheless. ToB rectified that, and I feel bg2's story should have been in that direction from the start.
It is kind of hilarious looking at the launch-era critiques of the game, and just how off-base they look today. How petty and minor they seem.
I still think there are some serious issues overall. The second half of the game seems a lot less polished, play-tested, etc. And so still feels kind of rough. But overall the product is very good for what it is.
Frankly, I wouldn't recommend it to anyone except diehard BG1/BG2 fans. But it's exactly the perfect product for those people. It's a much more difficult game than both of those, generally speaking, especially on insane difficulty.
Hot take, I feel sort of the same with SoA. Not that SoA's story is bad, far from it, Just that it has barely anything to do with the bhaalspawn. Sure, you get your
Spoiler
your soul stolen because you're a bhaalspawn, Imoen is revealed to be one and the slayer gets introduced
but it all just feels like a side quest. A really good side quest but still one nonetheless. ToB rectified that, and I feel bg2's story should have been in that direction from the start.
I used to play Shadows of Amn thinking it was the best, and it's a great game, yes... but if you think about it, it's true that it's still a side quest (long, maybe too long), with "too many" things happening. And in the end, what happened is "not very important" for the continuity of your destiny.
The same thing happens to me with SoD but worse because the story is "fine" but not so special.
On the other hand, the Black Pits seem like an optional addition to me that isn't as bad as something separate and superfluous, in a good way... I had a lot of fun with them, especially with the Black Pits 2.
It's like Watcher's Keep, Durlag Tower, etc. Those have never been out of place for me in my campaigns, as what they are: secondary, non-invasive missions.
Hot take, I feel sort of the same with SoA. Not that SoA's story is bad, far from it, Just that it has barely anything to do with the bhaalspawn. Sure, you get your
Spoiler
your soul stolen because you're a bhaalspawn, Imoen is revealed to be one and the slayer gets introduced
but it all just feels like a side quest. A really good side quest but still one nonetheless. ToB rectified that, and I feel bg2's story should have been in that direction from the start.
I used to play Shadows of Amn thinking it was the best, and it's a great game, yes... but if you think about it, it's true that it's still a side quest (long, maybe too long), with "too many" things happening. And in the end, what happened is "not very important" for the continuity of your destiny.
The same thing happens to me with SoD but worse because the story is "fine" but not so special.
On the other hand, the Black Pits seem like an optional addition to me that isn't as bad as something separate and superfluous, in a good way... I had a lot of fun with them, especially with the Black Pits 2.
It's like Watcher's Keep, Durlag Tower, etc. Those have never been out of place for me in my campaigns, as what they are: secondary, non-invasive missions.
I found SoD enjoyable, though not really worth playing through again. I did not care for any of the added NPCs to BG1, BG2 and of course SoD, but they aren't bad (I've played with all once and will never use them again...I find they simply do not fit, especially in BG2). I would have much preferred to continue using more of the original BG1 NPCs (silence is golden). The overall adventure in SoD is a lot of fun.
The final encounter design in SoD though....absolute failure in design as far as I'm concerned (mechanically speaking, the narrative design is exceptional and had a giant smile crossing my face....only to be removed shortly thereafter). You need +3 or better to be even viable in melee (of which there are simply too few options, one of which is acquired JUST before the encounter). MR levels are ridiculous (though appropriate)....so basically you're left to either let Caelar do the work (IF you make the right choices), thus completely removing player agency, or rely almost entirely on Enchanted Weapon (4th level wizard spell).
Just a horrible design, mechanically.
Again, very glad I bought and played it, but I have not and will not play through it again.
It is kind of hilarious looking at the launch-era critiques of the game, and just how off-base they look today. How petty and minor they seem.
Couldn't agree more. Especially when you compare the alleged "wokeness" complaints to releases like Veilguard today.
And you're completely on the money regarding the comparison with SoA too. I'm never quite sure whether that's a positive or a negative, but it's certainly true to the spirit of the series. It makes for a less thematically coherent narrative, but on the other hand it feels somewhat more organic and even true to life (or at least to a tabletop GM who suddenly gets so sidetracked by this new, brilliant idea for an epic antagonist that he forgets about the original concept for the campaign for a while).
Comments
I still think there are some serious issues overall. The second half of the game seems a lot less polished, play-tested, etc. And so still feels kind of rough. But overall the product is very good for what it is.
Frankly, I wouldn't recommend it to anyone except diehard BG1/BG2 fans. But it's exactly the perfect product for those people. It's a much more difficult game than both of those, generally speaking, especially on insane difficulty.
Hot take, I feel sort of the same with SoA. Not that SoA's story is bad, far from it, Just that it has barely anything to do with the bhaalspawn. Sure, you get your
I fully agree with this.
I used to play Shadows of Amn thinking it was the best, and it's a great game, yes... but if you think about it, it's true that it's still a side quest (long, maybe too long), with "too many" things happening. And in the end, what happened is "not very important" for the continuity of your destiny.
The same thing happens to me with SoD but worse because the story is "fine" but not so special.
On the other hand, the Black Pits seem like an optional addition to me that isn't as bad as something separate and superfluous, in a good way... I had a lot of fun with them, especially with the Black Pits 2.
It's like Watcher's Keep, Durlag Tower, etc. Those have never been out of place for me in my campaigns, as what they are: secondary, non-invasive missions.
I agree.
The final encounter design in SoD though....absolute failure in design as far as I'm concerned (mechanically speaking, the narrative design is exceptional and had a giant smile crossing my face....only to be removed shortly thereafter). You need +3 or better to be even viable in melee (of which there are simply too few options, one of which is acquired JUST before the encounter). MR levels are ridiculous (though appropriate)....so basically you're left to either let Caelar do the work (IF you make the right choices), thus completely removing player agency, or rely almost entirely on Enchanted Weapon (4th level wizard spell).
Just a horrible design, mechanically.
Again, very glad I bought and played it, but I have not and will not play through it again.
Couldn't agree more. Especially when you compare the alleged "wokeness" complaints to releases like Veilguard today.
And you're completely on the money regarding the comparison with SoA too. I'm never quite sure whether that's a positive or a negative, but it's certainly true to the spirit of the series. It makes for a less thematically coherent narrative, but on the other hand it feels somewhat more organic and even true to life (or at least to a tabletop GM who suddenly gets so sidetracked by this new, brilliant idea for an epic antagonist that he forgets about the original concept for the campaign for a while).