Need some input on a barbarian multi and cleric multi build for OC through HOTU

Muku

Hi all. Jumping back into NWNee for a bit and wanted to run through the OC and sotu with a couple builds and needed some advice on narrowing down some ideas about when to take certain levels.

First build I was thinking was the classic half-orc barbarian/fighter/weapon master using either greataxes or greatswords. Scythes really aren't my thing.
str 18
dex 13
con 14
int 13
wis 8
cha 6

Saw several other websites with similar builds but they never explain why they take the classes at certain levels during the leveling process and it confuses me. I assume its for certain feats or to avoid an exp penalty but they never really go into specifics.

I've seen barbarian 16/fighter 4 thrown around a lot for the OC, but I always see a varying amount of fighter and wm levels. Would it be stronger to just do barb 20 till hotu, then add in the fighter levels, or do a 16 barb/4 fighter multi until hotu then add the weapon master levels? Or a mix of all three?

For my second build I'd like to do a cleric x/monk 1 unarmored castery build but not sure about when to add that monk level or what feats and skills would be good.
Human
str 8
dex 14 (or 16)
con 14
int 10
wis 16
cha 14 (or 12)

WarChiefZeke

A Half Orc Barb/Fighter/Weapon Master won't get any XP penalties. I would get the 4 fighter levels out of the way quickly, so you can get the feats you need to take Weapon Master as early as possible. Weapon Master requires a lot of feats, and you will get there much faster by using those fighter levels early to compensate, since they get so many extra ones.

Cleric/Monk is fun to play and very solid. I would take 1 level of Monk early on, to add wisdom to your armor, expand equipment options, and to run faster. You can take a few more later, there are some advantages to doing so, but early on it's good to focus on caster levels so you can get those solid buffs that really make a Cleric/Monk shine. This class in particular benefits from every stat boosting spell, except for intelligence, and you get them early.

Muku

WarChiefZeke wrote: »

A Half Orc Barb/Fighter/Weapon Master won't get any XP penalties. I would get the 4 fighter levels out of the way quickly, so you can get the feats you need to take Weapon Master as early as possible. Weapon Master requires a lot of feats, and you will get there much faster by using those fighter levels early to compensate, since they get so many extra ones.

Cleric/Monk is fun to play and very solid. I would take 1 level of Monk early on, to add wisdom to your armor, expand equipment options, and to run faster. You can take a few more later, there are some advantages to doing so, but early on it's good to focus on caster levels so you can get those solid buffs that really make a Cleric/Monk shine. This class in particular benefits from every stat boosting spell, except for intelligence, and you get them early.

Might be a stupid question, but the fighter gets feats on 1st and 2nd levels, and then every other level after that, so does that mean if I went barb 1/fighter 1, then barb 1/ fighter 2, then barb 1/fighter 3, he would get the fighter feats on the first and second fighter level but not the third fighter level, or would he only get the feats on the character level?

WilliamDraco

All characters get feats at character level 1, 3, and then every third thereafter (6, 9, etc)
Fighters get a bonus feat at class level 1, 2, and then every second thereafter.

It works exactly as you would expect from the combination of those two rules. If it's an even fighter level, you get a bonus feat. If it's a multiple-of-three character level, you get a normal feat. If it's both even-fighter and 3x-character, you get both normal and bonus feat.

In your specific question:
Barb 1: One normal feat for character level 1.
Barb 1/ Fighter 1: One Bonus Feat for Fighter level 1
Barb 1/ Fighter 2: One normal feat for charcter level 3, and one bonus feat for Fighter level 2.
Barb 1/ Fighter 3: No feats at all.


Note that fighter bonus feats are NOT just "feats". They are bonus feats, and they have a much more limited selection available than standard feats (Typically centred on martial-type feats)

Muku

WilliamDraco wrote: »

All characters get feats at character level 1, 3, and then every third thereafter (6, 9, etc)
Fighters get a bonus feat at class level 1, 2, and then every second thereafter.

It works exactly as you would expect from the combination of those two rules. If it's an even fighter level, you get a bonus feat. If it's a multiple-of-three character level, you get a normal feat. If it's both even-fighter and 3x-character, you get both normal and bonus feat.

In your specific question:
Barb 1: One normal feat for character level 1.
Barb 1/ Fighter 1: One Bonus Feat for Fighter level 1
Barb 1/ Fighter 2: One normal feat for charcter level 3, and one bonus feat for Fighter level 2.
Barb 1/ Fighter 3: No feats at all.


Note that fighter bonus feats are NOT just "feats". They are bonus feats, and they have a much more limited selection available than standard feats (Typically centred on martial-type feats)

Great info! This is just what I was looking for, thanks!

One other thing I was curious about was a good cut off point for str and con with a build like this. Is 10 or 12 con too low, or would it be best to go with 14 or 16? For str is going with 19 str worth cutting other stats or is 16 or 18 a good starting point?

WarChiefZeke

For a Half Orc, it might be worth it to cut stats to reach 19, if that is what you want to do. Keep in mind, however, that to reach weapon master you must have at least 13 Dexterity and 13 Intelligence, to qualify for all the feats that you need. The extra damage from criticals and Kai easily makes up for a few points of strength loss in order to reach the minimum stat requirements. I would also keep CON at 14 minimum, but that is just me. You can certainly manage with 12.

Muku

WarChiefZeke wrote: »

For a Half Orc, it might be worth it to cut stats to reach 19, if that is what you want to do. Keep in mind, however, that to reach weapon master you must have at least 13 Dexterity and 13 Intelligence, to qualify for all the feats that you need. The extra damage from criticals and Kai easily makes up for a few points of strength loss in order to reach the minimum stat requirements. I would also keep CON at 14 minimum, but that is just me. You can certainly manage with 12.

I guess the trade-off is basically:

18 str, 14 dex, 14 con, 13 int, 8 wis, 6 cha

versus:

19 str, 13 dex, 12 con, 13 int, 8 wis, 6 cha

Does having access to greater rage with 15 barb levels make up the difference compare to the bonuses of 7 levels of weaponmaster with regular rage in the OC? In the first instance I'd proably go with a 16 barb/4 fighter build. The second one would be a 9 barb/4 fighter/7 weapon master.

WarChiefZeke

Greater Rage alone won't make up for the damage a weapon master can put out, but it could have some other advantages that a weapon master usually doesn't. For example, if you wanted to just go barbarian/fighter, you could use those Dex and Int scores to go for the Improved Knockdown and Improved Disarm feats, which give you a way to disable powerful casters and fighters. A weapon master usually can't afford to get these feats because the requirements for that class are so high. In fact, it's always a good idea to have at least a few points in the discipline skill, because Improved Knockdown can easily lose you fights if it goes off against you at a bad time.

The OC isn't supremely difficult so I wouldn't worry about only doing what is optimal. You have room to roleplay a character. I finished the OC with a druid 1/barbarian X. The druid level was just so I could talk to animals.