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Sexuality in the Realms Answer from Ed Greenwood

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Comments

  • BaldursCatBaldursCat Member Posts: 432
    Forse said:

    Jaheira is actually my favorite romance. Aerie and Viconia seemed even less plausible. They are more shallow and unrealistic than Jaheira. In my opinion.

    I haven't tried Anomen, but I can imagine it's got some rich, realistic dialog, despite him being kind of an ass.

    Anomen's romance is great. Him being an ass works because he doesn't feel like a cardboard cutout Knight-In-Shining-Armour however much he wants to be seen as such. I think I've said elsewhere he feels like one of George R R Martin's so called Ser Knights...

  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    When it comes to Jaheira's romance in BG 2, I gotta agree with @fitscotgaymer. In BG, my PC saw Jaheira more like some kind of mother figure, more like family. I was quite shocked and disappointed Khalid had died in BG 2, as I thought him and Jaheira made such a cute couple together. Nevertheless, I tried out Jaheira's romance and imagined how Jaheira was rather looking for some comfort after the death of her husband and therefore saw the PC as a source of consolation, as they'd gone through a lot before during whole BG. Eventually, she would fall in love with my PC. I didn't think it was a 'bad' romance, but it certainly *does* rise questions such as the age gap (elven age # human age) and the fact her romance triggered so quickly. So yeah, I think there was a bit of fanservice intended in this romance, I bet. Yet, I wouldn't call Jaheira's relationship with the PC a case of pedophilia, rather just a very, very uncommon bond between two people with such issues involved.

    Moomintroll
  • CalmarCalmar Member Posts: 685



    *vom*

    I couldn't disagree more.

    I am of the opinion that her romance is probably the biggest example of a fanservice romance in any bioware game ever. And considering its the first game bioware did romances in, is a pretty big statement to make.

    It is horrible.

    In BG1 the intended role for her (and Khalid) is to step into the role of surrogate parent(s) for the CHARNAME in place of Gorion, if he died.
    There isn't a lot of dialogue in BG1 in terms of character development to confirm this, but if we assume that it is true, then she is essentially attempting to romance her ward in BG2. I will leave that to sink in for a moment.

    Now let's think about the Age difference also. CHARNAME is about 18 to 20 years old in game, and in some species that makes him still a child. As an elf for example he would be the elven equivalent of 5 years old thereabouts.
    Jaheira is significantly older than him, by an order of years making her old enough to possibly be his grandmother. Let THAT sink in for a moment too.

    Now consider Khalid. He has literally been brutally murdered right before the game starts. And she only finds this out in the prologue of the actual game. So she only begins to grieve and mourn for her beloved at that moment.
    She has not accepted his death, she has not recovered from it. And having been with him for so long, her recovery process from his death ought to be a lengthy one. At the very least, more than a week.
    And yet, within the week of her beloved being murdered in a horrific and brutal way, she is all over CHARNAME. Obstentsibly, her ward.

    Now I know the book apparently explains that away by saying that Khalid and Jaheira were having "problems" and she didn't really love him anymore by the time he died. But honestly that to me just seems like a poor attempt to excuse a really terribly written and implemented romance.
    Also we don't know any of this from the games. As far as we know in BG1 she and Khalid were (literally!) inseperable and very much in love. And none of this is dealt with in a very significant way in BG2.
    You can not tell me she was over Khalid, or that CHARNAME was anything more than a shallow rebound for her.

    I guess Jaheira only suspects Charname to be a child before or when she first meets him at the Friendly Arm Inn, but after fighting many battles with him she starts to regard Charname as a real man. Besides, in a more or less medieval world you're probably considered to be of legal age at age 15 or the likes.

    As far as Khalid is concerned, the timing might be a bit rash. But again, facing possible death every day could be a good reason to focus on the now and take what you want. And if I remember correctly, it takes some time until the romance with Jaheira starts and depends on what you do and when, as well.

    BaldursCat
  • DeeDee Member Posts: 10,447
    SO much time. I reached a point where I had to manually speed up her timer, because I was afraid I might beat the game before the end of it.

    My relationship with Jaheira evolved over time. The first time I played, I thought she was whiny and annoying, and more often than not I just dumped her in favor of Aerie. As I got older, though, I came to appreciate her struggles--both with the Harpers and with the loss of her husband. She has a moving, emotional character arc, and unfortunately that arc is only played out when you romance her.

    BaldursCat
  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    Aosaw said:

    SO much time. I reached a point where I had to manually speed up her timer, because I was afraid I might beat the game before the end of it.

    My relationship with Jaheira evolved over time. The first time I played, I thought she was whiny and annoying, and more often than not I just dumped her in favor of Aerie. As I got older, though, I came to appreciate her struggles--both with the Harpers and with the loss of her husband. She has a moving, emotional character arc, and unfortunately that arc is only played out when you romance her.

    So basically you dumped a whiner for an even bigger whiner who can't stop whining about having lost her wings?

    Seems legit. :I

  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629

    Lol @Kitteh_On_A_Cloud

    Awesome innit?

    The amount of whine is...legendary. O_o

    Aerie deserves a trophy. :')

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    It makes me laugh.

    People complain about Carth and Kaidan being "whiney romances" and yet there seems to be a lot of love towards Aerie...

    Yeah.

    lol.

  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    @fitscotgaymer: Mind you, I do not dislike Aerie. I've heard she drove quite some people mad with her complaints, though. :p

  • JalilyJalily Member Posts: 4,681
    @fitscotgaymer People complain about Aerie being a whiny romance, too. Pretty sure the ones who love her aren't the same ones complaining about Carth and Kaidan.

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    edited December 2012
    @Kitteh_On_A_Cloud

    (I hate your username - its a pain in the backside to type lol)

    For myself I liked Aerie.

    Her romance isn't fantastic, but none of the BG2 romances are great. For the most part she is okay, and her whining is understandable - I mean someone sawed off her wings!

    That would be like someone sawing off a hand from us.

    @Jalily

    I don't think Carth is all that whiney either.

    And Kaidan is absolutely NOT a whiner.

  • typo_tillytypo_tilly Member Posts: 5,702
    Yeaaah, I always thought Jaheira was a total cougar. Her advances squicked me. :| She's basically your adoptive guardian/parent - at least, that was Gorion's wish according to her own words when you first meet.

    Now I only play female characters and ignore Anomen XD


    As for Pride parades, I feel they're important. We still face much harassment and need to show that we exist and we're not afraid - and we won't stand for bad treatment. We can't quietly hide our faces while we lobby the government for rights. We have to be out and proud, and force the world to sit up and take notice. Erm, provided it's safe for our physical well-being to do that where we live. -_-

    I don't think there should be nudity at these marches, though I may be a prude. On the other hand, I have no sympathy for straight people who cringe or complain when two people of the same sex kiss or hold hands. I see straight people do this in public, and I don't complain about it. Why would I?

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    tilly said:

    Yeaaah, I always thought Jaheira was a total cougar. Her advances squicked me. :| She's basically your adoptive guardian/parent - at least, that was Gorion's wish according to her own words when you first meet.

    Now I only play female characters and ignore Anomen XD


    Thanks for agreeing with me! lol.
    tilly said:

    On the other hand, I have no sympathy for straight people who cringe or complain when two people of the same sex kiss or hold hands. I see straight people do this in public, and I don't complain about it. Why would I?


    I totally do! lol.

    Seriously, though. I object when it goes beyond hand holding and kisses into full on making out and dry humping.

    Gay, or straight, I don't think that is appropriate for public viewing. I mean, won't someone think of the children?

    typo_tilly
  • typo_tillytypo_tilly Member Posts: 5,702


    Seriously, though. I object when it goes beyond hand holding and kisses into full on making out and dry humping.

    Gay, or straight, I don't think that is appropriate for public viewing. I mean, won't someone think of the children?

    o_o

    ... OK dry humping not allowed at Pride parades either now. :p So says me ^-^

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    tilly said:


    Seriously, though. I object when it goes beyond hand holding and kisses into full on making out and dry humping.

    Gay, or straight, I don't think that is appropriate for public viewing. I mean, won't someone think of the children?

    o_o

    ... OK dry humping not allowed at Pride parades either now. :p So says me ^-^

    I said... WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHLDREN?!?!?!?!??!?!

    lol.

  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    Really, just keep those parades a bit decent. We're still supposed to be rational and 'evolved' beings, more than animals, right?

    ...Good. Glad I made that clear.

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    To be fair Kitteh most Gay Pride parades aren't any worse than the Mardi Gras...

    But I agree that some are truely horrific.

  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    @fitscotgaymer: Mardi Gras? What's that? Fat Tuesday? (literal translation from French)

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    Mardi Gras?

    That really famous party/parade that Brazil has every year in Rio?

  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    @fitscotgaymer: Oooh, I see. Guess I just didn't know the name of that festival-celebration-thingie. Well, maybe it's just because I'm not such a wild, outgoing person...I prefer quiet environments. I'm boring like that. :p

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    I think that Gay Pride events are rather like that, the Mardi Gras, loud and ostentatious but not vulgar for the most part.
    Sadly, however, there are events and groups where this is not the case - where the very worst of the "gay community" is showcased and it is from that that people make the "assumptions" they do about gay folk. It's both frustrating, and sad.

    People have a tendancy to forget that any sort of assumption can be made about group of people, and it doesn't necessarily have to be true.

    Online I encounter stereotypical assumptions about me (and folk like me) ALL the fricking time.

    Gay = Slag.
    Gamer = Pathetic shut in.
    Scottish = Tight, cheap, penny pinching.
    British = Stiff upper lip, "Do you know the Queen?"
    Intelligent = Condescending.
    Attractive/Fit = Arrogant.
    Trekkie = Sad little virgin.
    Glasses = "OMG! It's Harry Potter!" (Used to be "It's Adrian Mole! I've read your Diaries!)
    Nice = Walkover.
    Generous = Spineless.

    I could keep going...

    It is depressing if you think about it too much.

  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    Well, I'm actually wearing glasses. Having Potter's fame would be quite handy. :p

  • MoomintrollMoomintroll Member Posts: 1,481
    So long as stereotypes are being discussed.
    Aerie has more whine than a French chateau.

    TJ_Hooker
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    And some of the characters carp so often, they could feed the hungry of the world... ;)

  • MoomintrollMoomintroll Member Posts: 1,481
    You could hear that half elven druid going on about nature this and nature that from all the way across the city, d'ya hear'er?

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    Oh there is the more recent one as well.

    I like to think im pretty fit/attractive, and with the whole fake geeks thing the now I have been on the recieving end of that too lately.

    *sigh*

    I think I need to point to this site and go "LOOK IM ROLEPLAYING ON BG DOT COM!"

    lol.

  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    @fitscotgaymer Thus, my Geek Cred Pictures on Deviant Art.... http://ladyrhianwriter.deviantart.com/gallery/38919912

    With this much stuff, it's hard to say I'm fake...

    MedullaOblongataGenderNihilismGirdle
  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    @LadyRhian

    I don't have that many books... Never mind RPG books...

    I'm jealous. I only have one bookcase of books.

    *cries cos I want a library*

    Also, are you a pretty geek too? :-)

  • ScotGaymerScotGaymer Member Posts: 526
    edited December 2012
    Ya know your tagline in that pic is right.

    You defo don't look the age you are (I don't wanna say cos its not polite to say a lady's age hehe). :-)

    Must be all that good living. ;-)

    You look awesome.

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