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The least useful school of magic for a solo mage

OssoryOssory Member Posts: 56
edited December 2012 in Archive (General Discussion)
Hello fellow magelings,

I just started a solo mage game and I'm playing a non-specialist, because I wasn't sure which school of magic to neglect, however, I really miss that extra spell slot per level ;) So, for future reference, I decided to collect some input on the usefulness of particular schools. Go ahead and share your opinion as to which one is the least useful (for a solo character rather than a team player). Apart from voting, please substantiate your choice.

I'll cast a blank vote as I honestly have no idea.
  1. The least useful school of magic for a solo mage171 votes
    1. Alteration
        3.51%
    2. Divination
      50.88%
    3. Conjuration
        4.09%
    4. Evocation
        5.26%
    5. Necromancy
      11.11%
    6. Enchantment
      10.53%
    7. Illusion
        7.60%
    8. Abjuration
        7.02%
«1

Comments

  • HexHammerHexHammer Member Posts: 288
    edited December 2012
    Imo Divination is good for PnP RP'ing and very strategic matters where you just can't outwit the AI ..there's not much for it in itself in computer gaming.
  • szdobosszdobos Member Posts: 36
    Most important is invocation/evocation, and very useful are:abjuration, alteration, charm/enhanc. Less usesful are: illusion, and divination. Illusion is just the invisible spell, and some familiar.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    edited December 2012
    In BG1 I think it is necromancy partly because you can get many of its good spells as innate abilities if you are willing to have a rep less than ten at the times in the game when you get them, and partly because they are very replacable spells (though Skull Trap is one of my favourite spells I will admit). For the whole series I would still lean towards necromancy, even though Horrid Wilting and Skull Trap are two great spells. For a solo gamer I think invisibility detection spells/illusion dissipating spells are a must in the series, so I'm not inclined to suggest a conjurer.

    Edit: I have never tried Wail of the Banshee when combined with Greater Malison, but I imagine that helps make it considerably more effective. So it along with Horrid Wilting are certainly reasons to keep necromancer spells open if you want a strong late game mage, but generally I'd still say you can pass on the school if needed .
    Post edited by elminster on
  • aXidalaXidal Member Posts: 61
    I'd say it depends on whether you're playing only bg1, or if intend to play the whole saga. I chose enchantment with the all the games in mind, in bg1 only it might be alteration, necromancy or enchantment

    That said, I do not think enchantment is useless, but I don't think it is critical.

    Explanation on why I think the other schools are more important, please bear in mind that I have actually never played solo mage:

    Abjuration: It Contains almost all protection spells, vs spell and vs weapons, while this might be of less use in a party of 6, it is crucial solo. It also contains most anti-protection spell, which is essential in bg2

    Alteration: Stoneskin, haste and slow, later on Tenser's transformation and time stop

    Conjuration: Summons make excellent meat shields.

    Divination: One reason, you can't target partially visible creatures with spells. May be replaceable with glitterdust though.

    Enchantment: The big drawbacks of not having enchantment spells is the lack of Sleep (in bg1) and greater malison, There are no enchantment spells over level 5. In bg1 you'll have Algernon's cloak, so charm won't be a problem.

    Evocation: Probably the best school with magic missle, web, fireball and cloudkill to name a few.

    Illusion: Invisibility, Mirror image, Blur, Projected Image, Simulacrum

    Necromancy: Not very useful in bg1, even if horror and skull trap are excellent spells. It truly shine late bg2 though with finger of death and Abi-Dalzim's horrid wilting.

    That said, if I would go solo I'd go wild mage, unless it was no-reload.



  • DinsdalePiranhaDinsdalePiranha Member Posts: 419
    let's see...

    Alteration: Stoneskin. nuff said.
    Divination: not useless, but maybe skippable.
    Conjuration: if you're soloing, you want to summon.
    Evocation: heh, no way.
    Necromancy: horror, aka the best second level spell, and spirit armor... how about NO.
    Enchantment: basically all the best spells are enchantment. if you want to win a fight, you use enchantment. Dynaheir is next to useless because she's missing this school. definitely the MOST important spells are here.
    Illusion: the loss of mirror image alone means you're kinda screwed.
    Abjuration: in a team, where Edwin doesn't have access to divination spell, you probably want to lose this. soloing, well... doable. second best to skip after divination. (going strictly by BGEE, not BG2 - abjuration is required there)

    tl;dr version: skip divination, aka be a conjurer. if you want to change things up, transmuter is also worthwhile. others are mostly horrid.
  • MaltaMalta Member Posts: 11
    Illusion also has Spook which pretty much gets anyone to flee for their lives. Among the 1st level Mage Spells the important and useful three are Magic Missile, Chromatic Orb, and Spook.
  • aXidalaXidal Member Posts: 61
    @Malta Sleep is extremely powerful in bg1
  • MungriMungri Member Posts: 1,645
    Every school except Divination is useful. The only good thing about divination in the entire game is identify, which you can do with high lore or by paying merchants.
  • JaxsbudgieJaxsbudgie Member Posts: 600
    The devs should have implemented barred schools better. I believe that every school EXCEPT Divination has TWO barred schools (this is according to the 2nd edition rules).

    Conjuration for example is barred from both Divination and Evocation.
  • PawnSlayerPawnSlayer Member Posts: 295
    Divination is the worst, nothing of value you can't easily do elsewhere is lost. Invisible enemies aren't such an issue in this game, so you don't need things like True Sight.

    Best schools are definitely Evocation (the powerful offensive spells like Magic Missile), Alteration (the key defensive spells like Stoneskin) and Conjuration (Summoning, Dynaheir being much weaker for lacking).
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    Evocation because it's the only one that has two opposition schools.
  • MortiannaMortianna Member Posts: 1,356
    @Jaxsbudgie Illusionists actually have THREE barred schools in 2e (Necromancy, Evocation, and Abjuration) and Diviners only have one (Conjuration). The others have two. I think they only went with one barred school because they didn't implement any of the perks for being a specialist wizard aside from the extra spell per level.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    Under normal circumstances I'd say Necromancy, but if you're soloing, then Larloch's Minor Drain and Vampiric Touch start looking very nice (not to mention Skull Trap and Horror). Losing Divination means you have to pay for Identifies, but money's not usually that much of an issue. Losing True Sight might hurt in BG2 and ToB, though. Enchantment would be another pick, if there was a way to just drop enchantment.

    That said, I would agree with aXidal; a Wild Mage gets you the extra spell slot without having to give up any schools, if you don't mind having to reload after the occasional wild surge gone horribly awry. At higher levels Nahal's Reckless Dweomer + (Imp.) Chaos Shield can also be an interesting way to put your level 1 spell slots to use.
  • IntoTheDarknessIntoTheDarkness Member Posts: 118
    Divination, period. If you know about magic mechanics in BG it's definitely divination.
  • DinsdalePiranhaDinsdalePiranha Member Posts: 419
    edited December 2012
    @Jaxsbudgie, @Mortianna: I'd say BG's homebrew rules are awesome, actually, or at least nothing worse than pnp adnd. just look at diviners in pnp - they're the only ones having one barred school, and (as anyone can attest who ever played/was in the same party as one) a well played diviner can break the whole game in ways no one could ever foresee, and easily make the DM go somewhat... stabby.

    there is a reason the term "scry and die" exist, or little fun things like using magic to find an underground river, and the wall closest to it, then casually downing every enemy hiding in that particular cave... even in low level parties, the words "hey, that guy you sorta trust is blocking my divination attempts directed at him, I think you should go and stab him about 534 times" can easily give an unprepared DM something akin to a brain aneurysm. :D
  • ajwzajwz Member Posts: 4,122
    I voted and then found out that most people had formed the same opinion that I had.
  • MungriMungri Member Posts: 1,645
    Awong124 said:

    Evocation because it's the only one that has two opposition schools.


    It doesnt anymore in the BG2 engine, it only has Enchantment as the opposition school.

    I dont understand why that in vanilla BG, there were two schools with two opposition schools, and all the rest only had one opposition.
  • PawnSlayerPawnSlayer Member Posts: 295
    Even if Evocation did still have two opposition schools, the fact that it contains many of the best offensive spells means it's indispensible. For that reason more than anything else, I could never use Xan.
  • MungriMungri Member Posts: 1,645
    Evocation also has sequencers and contingencies, another reason for why enchanters suck.
  • elminsterelminster Member, Developer Posts: 16,315
    Having just tested something I switch my vote to divination.
  • DarkDoggDarkDogg Member Posts: 598
    lol
    I missclicked for conjurer.

    Divination ofk
  • MungriMungri Member Posts: 1,645
    elminster said:

    Having just tested something I switch my vote to divination.

    Tested what exactly?

  • colonel_burgercolonel_burger Member Posts: 279
    Enchantment, because you lose access to evocation.
  • ElendarElendar Member Posts: 831
    Just pick wild mage.... :P
  • waardeniuswaardenius Member Posts: 58
    edited December 2012
    Hit the wrong option, was opting för enchantment. Enchantment spells - while nice, especially in BG1 - are never really crucial.

    Divination may contain a lot of reduntant spells, but being able to counter invisibility feels sort of crucial.
  • The_CheesemanThe_Cheeseman Member Posts: 175
    I can't see any particularly good reason to solo a mage when you have the option to be a sorcerer.
  • ElendarElendar Member Posts: 831
    The_Cheeseman said:

    I can't see any particularly good reason to solo a mage when you have the option to be a sorcerer.

    Cause sorcerers don't get wild surges! :P
  • MungriMungri Member Posts: 1,645
    colonel_burger said:

    Enchantment, because you lose access to evocation.

    Thats not what this thread is asking.
    waardenius said:

    Hit the wrong option, was opting för enchantment. Enchantment spells - while nice, especially in BG1 - are never really crucial.

    Divination may contain a lot of reduntant spells, but being able to counter invisibility feels sort of crucial.

    Sleep is very powerful early in the game, and greater malison is crucial for solo play. Remove Magic dispels invisibility, you dont ever need to use true sight.
  • ZanathKariashiZanathKariashi Member Posts: 2,869
    edited December 2012
    Evocation is the worst, the domain of munchkins, nublets, and hedge wizards!?. And Evocation specialists lose two schools..and if you didn't, it's a bug (Conjuration and Enchantment, are bared in both BG1 and BG2, though I think it only says they lose enchantment).

    After further investigation....Evocation Specialization is weird...it loses some conjuration, but not others.


    Nothing it does is really all that spectacular...Skull trap by itself replaces pretty much every useful evocation damage spell.....the loss of web is regrettable, but.. ya can't have everything...well..actually you can technically (plain mage...or for the brave..WILD MAGE!?)...haha

    And true sight is essential for a solo mage, since you're gonna need to save your dispels for things actually worth dispelling..especially if you're up against an improved invisibility spammer.

    Strictly speaking, a Sorcerer is better as a solo...but only cause of how limited the selection of spells, combined with engine limitations GROSSLY under-powering several schools of magic that are actually quite powerful in PnP. They get 1 more spell cast per spell level per day, and with good spell picks can handle any situation from lvl 1 to till the end of ToB.
    Post edited by ZanathKariashi on
  • bbearbbear Member Posts: 1,180
    edited December 2012
    The only good spell in divination is True Sight. Does divination even have a lv7, lv8 or lv9 spell?

    My proposed spell is a "scan" spell. It displays the target's current hp, character stats, attacks per round, magic resistance, physical resistance, saving throws, immunities, items it carries currently and other perks about the target. Every round for 1 turn, displays the target's hp. Magic resistance cant stop this spell. Also no saving throw.

    Edit: This should work well with the power word stun/kill spell. No more guessing.
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