tob should be reworked into BG3 and not be made a part of BG2EE. around 80 hours of gameplay could be added to an expanded ToB storyline in the form of additional locations and quests and characters, and the ending should be reworked somewhat and be made even more epic.
so in my opinion, a perfect BG3 would actually be a very big expansion for ToB.
People do not understand how owned IP's. WOTC, or Canon works.
I understand. I just don't care. My suggestions are my dream for a BG3, and I imagine most others contributing to this thread have a similar thought process. Let the legal monkeys sort out what Beamdog can and cannot do in a sequel, I won't let it influence what I would like to see in BG3.
I'm a Baldur's Gate fan, not a Forgotten Realms or D&D purist. If the developers find a way to completely break free of the bindings of the Forgotten Realms setting, I'd be thrilled.
Not sure about the story, but as it's probably a ground-up from level 1. I do hope that we don't level up quickly in BG3. If it could be like BG1 when the player only have the chance to lvl up to level 6-8/9... I once tried to design a NWN module for low level players but somehow it doesn't look right.
Dream scenario would be to remove Throne of Bhaal from Baldur's Gate 2 and make it a standalone game. Then double or triple the content of Throne of Bhaal and call it Baldur's Gate 3. Add extra regions on the map inbetween the Bhaalspawn dungeons, expand the land of Tethyr to the west and introduce the metropolis of Darromar as the game's main city (Especially since the starting area of Saradush becomes unavailable after the introductory portion of the expansion).
It would be cool to bring back NPCs that were largely disregarded from Baldur's Gate 2 like Quayle, Garrick, Branwen, Xan, Shar-Teel, Kagain, Eldoth, Yeslick, Skie, Kivan, Alora, etc... as NPCs through the Pocket Plane. Or even characters like Xzar brought back from the dead, pretty funny to necro a necromancer. Why summon people like Nalia for a reunion when you're got some buddies from BG1 who are more worthy?
But that's probably a longshot thanks to the contract.
Another option is to do a bringing story between BG1 and BG2, or BG2 and ToB. But that would have to be sorted out before they release BG2. Bit hard to retroactively add that in.
I would be totally cool if they followed up some of the NPC epilogues from ToB and have it centered around Imoen's prodigy. It's been a few decades after Charname either ascends as a god or leaves the Sword Coast for good. Imoen has since matured and taken up the mantle of Gorion in Candlekeep, where she has made a following for herself among the many wards of Candlekeep for her tall tales of the Bhaalspawn and the Black Throne. The adventure begins when a stranger seeks shelter within Candlekeep's walls, welcomed in by Imoen herself. Grown up among tales of adventure and a nagging curiosity over the identity of the stranger, you decide to hitch a ride in secrecy. Thus taking you far outside Candlekeep's walls to a land you've only heard of in stories.
The adventure takes you north to the land between Baldur's Gate and Watersdeep. With familiar faces of Viconia and Edwina who now reside in the walls of Watersdeep. Not to mention Saemon who frequents the ports of Baldur's Gate and Watersdeep. The identity of the Stranger could be Elminster or even Charname come down from his ascended status in the form of a familiar or avatar with no discernible race or gender as your guide. As for the campaign it could be about anything threatening the Sword Coast really. It doesn't have to be related to the Bhaalspawn saga if you have some key figures from past games reprising their roles. If you can't have an epilogue from the perspective of Charname, then you can most certainly have an epilogue of Baldur's Gate NPCs which arguably are the heart of the franchise.
One scenario could be that while Bhaal might be dead some of his crazy followers are still around enacting some sort of doomsday cult. Afterall the goddesses Loviatar and Talona were followers of Bhaal, and although they eventually ditched Bhaal to hook up with Bane, they are still around and vengeful. I'm not well versed in the lore of the pantheon of Forgotten Realms but it could be possible to have a cult of Loviatar that wants to exact revenge on all those who aided Charname in halting the resurrection of her master. Her MO is pain, so she could just be doing it for the pleasure of it and has fooled her followers in expecting a reward. So her followers have come to tax those responsible in blood. So all surviving allies (Imoen, Viconia, Minsc, Jaheira, Edwina, etc...) or even the non-NPC people of Baldur's Gate have a giant target on their heads. So guided by Imoen, Elminster, an Avatar of Charname or whoever, you set about to dismantle this doomsday cult. The player's motivation could be an assassination attempt on the life of your tutor and mother figure Imoen.
I once thought that it might be cool to let players in BG3 be "guided" by the CHARNAME of BG1/2, assuming that he/she became the new Lord of Murder. And you can even "give" the new party some powerful equipments obtained from previous BG1/2 saves as "gifts from God".
I'm thinking if BG 3 is to continue forward with the events taken place in BG 1 through BG2 through ToB...it might make more sense to start from lvl 1 with a new character...for the following reasons
after ToB you could have 8 million xp and be at lvl 40 depending on your class...have all of the best items and be unstoppable. I mean continue CHARNAME would be pointless...you could only fight superior beings and what items could possibly be better or even worth taking the time to try and find? i mean really now... if you just want to blow shit up start a new game after beating ToB and import your character and keep experience and items then just go cause mayhem.
If CHARNAME were to be the main character continuing into BG3 and EVEN start back at lvl 1, whats the point? just to keep your super inflated stats? (which they can get that way if using all the tomes in BG 1 on yourself...the ending of BG2 and Watchers keep). Going down this kind of path just sounds like a MOD expansion.
*******BUT continue the bhaalspawn saga is a must...so I think it would make most sense if in BG3 you are the child of CHARNAME. That way you have something to connect to and maintain the story line...CHARNAME clearly made TONS and TONS of enemies leaving up possible plot lines, sub plot lines, you name it. Cameos could happen from party members of CHARNAME since they are legendary heroes or villains at that point. it would kind of be like Elminister and Drizzt appearing in BG1. or possibly that later in the game characters from BG1 that didnt make an appearance in BG2 could show up as NPCs since they werent choosen in the "original party" who is to say they achieved epic hero status? they may have just sat on their ass...it would kinda of be like Khalid and Jaheria being Gorions friends and then join you...clearly they werent always just a lvl 1 or 2... BUT it would definitely have to be NPCs not from BG2 as clearly they became way too powerful...but some of the NPCs should be present in BG3 just not playable. Much possibilities of subplot and quests around them..
Since Bhaal technically isnt dead that is one possible plot, or even Cyric or another god trying to do something similar. Or something completely different. the possibility of revisiting enemies you thought were dead...dont want to spoil anything...but lets just say hes at the Bandit camp and final battle in BG1 and you clearly kill him.
The new character would either have to completely unaware of his lineage(like CHARNAME) or have full knowledge of it.
The map for BG3 should be ginormous. Really...being able to revisit Baldurs gate and the sword coast would be sweet, possible athlaka...but definitely needs a new city to be set in. The others would just be for enjoyment, exploration, sub quests. etc.
@Pshlos But by the end of the saga, you're party is like (if I remember correctly) like level 30+... By then all of your companions including yourself are legendary heroes. What challenge could possibly face you? It sounds cool but how high of level can D&D players achieve?
@Pshlos But by the end of the saga, you're party is like (if I remember correctly) like level 30+... By then all of your companions including yourself are legendary heroes. What challenge could possibly face you? It sounds cool but how high of level can D&D players achieve?
Thats up to the storytellers. But you HAVE to continue with your party in some form. I don't know maybe they teleport you 100 years into the future where your 30-40 levels are shit or something. But it has to be the same party and the same infinity engine.
I've always felt that a true BG3 should've taken place IN BETWEEN SoA and ToB. The end video for SoA implies that there will be a final showdown between CharName and the Cowled Wizards, but this was almost entirely disregarded as ToB was hastily thrown together to bring the entire series to a quick resolution. In effect, ToB is the Matrix 3 of RPGs IMO. :-)
Incidentally, how about the possibility that Beamdog's BG3 will actually be a prequel to BG? One of the books in either BG1 or BG2 says Bhaal met his death in a battle on a bridge - perhaps in BG3/prequel, you play as the char who hunts down and kills Bhaal?
What they should do is have charname stripped of his powers like the Thor movie.
Simple
obviously flesh it out a bit more and give a good reason why but that's the way to make it work
You know say the other gods got angry etc etc, you get stripped of powers and wake up naked outside baldurs gate and then it's a quest to regain the power, rope in your old allies and go to war with the ones who wronged you
What they should do is have charname stripped of his powers like the Thor movie.
Simple
obviously flesh it out a bit more and give a good reason why but that's the way to make it work
You know say the other gods got angry etc etc, you get stripped of powers and wake up naked outside baldurs gate and then it's a quest to regain the power, rope in your old allies and go to war with the ones who wronged you
We had a lot of threads on this forum about this topic during the summer and fall. Regardless of players' various personal wishes, there are some business imperatives that will frame what is possible and what isn't. I think the issues surrounding BG3 are summarized well here.
@Lemernis I still like to see what other people are thinking about for it right Now, they pose some very interesting ideas! Thanks for the link however, it shows some very nice information indeed!
@Kouga Oh yeah, it's not intended to quash discussion at all. FWIW I agree. Plus, there's a whole lot of new members on these boards now. Anyway, we need to hear what everyone's thoughts and wishes are.
I kind of half wanted to see a prequel using the same game engine. But evidently there is less than zero chance that will happen. I'm not thrilled about the post-Spellplague setting (i.e., after 1479 DR). Nevertheless, it's going to be a brand new game using a different toolset than Infinity, and odds are it will be set over a century after the conclusion of ToB.
But at least if Beamdog is making the game, they have an intimate knowledge and appreciation of why the Infinity engine BG series works so well in various dimensions. So I trust that they can give us a game that lives up to the predecessors of BG, BG2, BG:EE, and BG2:EE.
They'll need to hire more staff though, lol! It's a minor miracle that they were able to pull off what they have done so far with a staff of only 13--or at least that is the number I have seen cited on the forums. (If that's accurate they should have added their own "Bilbo" to the staff and made it 14!)
@Lemernis Indeed, I never really thought of a prequel but the ideas people give here are really interesting. Maybe Beamdog can think of that after doing BG3, who knows? But that's still veryy far ahead. Haha
Yea... I would love to see more of CHARNAME and companions, but @#$% that if we are forced to use the new D&D ruleset. It's utter trash. I'll hold my breath and hope we can continue with the original rules that the series has been using, but I have the sinking feeling that Hasbro will continue to suck the life out of the property and destroy D&D. In tabletop I've already abandoned WOTC/Hasbro years ago and gone with Paizo's Pathfinder.
I agree with the people who think that it should continue the story of the Bhaalspawn. I don't think CHARNAME should be involved, but maybe their descendants, at least as NPCs. Basically, it has to take place sometime after ToB ends. I honestly am only super-opposed to some kind of prequel thing.
If you dont have the same party then dont call it baldurs gate 3. Call it Baldurs gate:Different Alliance
It's perfectly acceptable to call another game Baldur's Gate III. It's called Baldur's Gate due to the city, it isn't called The Bhaalspawn's Story. Long as they use the same setting (Baldur's Gate/Sword Coast) and not say Sigil or Waterdeep or whatever, it's perfectly okay. Naturally it should have some relation to the previous games, but there's a difference between that and recycling characters and story just for the sake of it.
There has to be some plot device where the Bhaalspawn loses his powers. And this whole project has a certain amount of nostalgia attached to it. So we could pull a Marty McFly with it and have the big bad(Maybe Tiax...that could be fun) go back in time and prevent Bhaal from creating all or some of the Bhaalspawn, including you. So you are never raised by Gorian, but you may cross paths will him as well as other NPCS and characters. Maybe Sarevok, without Bhaalspawn powers is merrily cleaning tables at the Friendly Arms Inn or something. That would allow the developers to literally reuse many of the maps and resources. The (ex)bhaalspawn would have to relive a somewhat different version of events we've already seen which might unfold a certain feeling of deja vu which would culminate with CHARNAME going back in time to stop the big bad from stopping Bhaal and have to finally decide if they want to give up their current life to have the power and experiences from before.
I'd like to see Charname reappear in a way and continue the godliness. I mean it's D&D so anything can happen right? Two ideas I'd like to share:
1. Charname has its own spawn. (cheezy at best)
2. The gods are bored stiff and decide to have a little contest. A few of them reincarnate as humanoids. And they use the world as their personal arena. They will be free to travel and recruit those they find (up to 5 NPC's to join them, of course). Amongst them a few favorites could reappear, but time has passed on earth so most of the humans will have grown old. Imagine meeting an old Imoen, who you can try to make you remember you. Of course she'll have kids or something alike.
The main idea is that you'll have to survive all over again in a hostile world, make old friends remember you and meet new friends, while trying to survive attacks from the other gods. This could mean that Shar has entered the fray and she has recruited Viconia as cleric and you'll have to fight her instead of having her along. Or meeting Anomen or Keldorn in Battle.
Maybe the edge of being a god could help you restore some of your friends back to their glory days and have them join you. Maybe even the power to resurrect your former foster father Gorion, of course you’d have to find his remains first. He was a powerful wizard and would add a lot of power to your party.
After travelling the land and meeting some of the gods eventually you’ll be invited to an arena where you will fight the last of the gods standing in this contest. In one climactic battle.
I want to see a prequel. Preferably with Gorion as a joinable NPC
Pretty much this. CHARNAME cannot be used in BGIII because he is too powerful. A prequel would solve this, letting you play all the way from level 1 to around 18.
Comments
People do not understand how owned IP's. WOTC, or Canon works.
so in my opinion, a perfect BG3 would actually be a very big expansion for ToB.
I'm a Baldur's Gate fan, not a Forgotten Realms or D&D purist. If the developers find a way to completely break free of the bindings of the Forgotten Realms setting, I'd be thrilled.
EDIT: Whoops I meant would NOT
I'd rather start an all new character. That's what I said
I'm thinking if BG 3 is to continue forward with the events taken place in BG 1 through BG2 through ToB...it might make more sense to start from lvl 1 with a new character...for the following reasons
after ToB you could have 8 million xp and be at lvl 40 depending on your class...have all of the best items and be unstoppable. I mean continue CHARNAME would be pointless...you could only fight superior beings and what items could possibly be better or even worth taking the time to try and find? i mean really now... if you just want to blow shit up start a new game after beating ToB and import your character and keep experience and items then just go cause mayhem.
If CHARNAME were to be the main character continuing into BG3 and EVEN start back at lvl 1, whats the point? just to keep your super inflated stats? (which they can get that way if using all the tomes in BG 1 on yourself...the ending of BG2 and Watchers keep). Going down this kind of path just sounds like a MOD expansion.
*******BUT continue the bhaalspawn saga is a must...so I think it would make most sense if in BG3 you are the child of CHARNAME. That way you have something to connect to and maintain the story line...CHARNAME clearly made TONS and TONS of enemies leaving up possible plot lines, sub plot lines, you name it. Cameos could happen from party members of CHARNAME since they are legendary heroes or villains at that point. it would kind of be like Elminister and Drizzt appearing in BG1. or possibly that later in the game characters from BG1 that didnt make an appearance in BG2 could show up as NPCs since they werent choosen in the "original party" who is to say they achieved epic hero status? they may have just sat on their ass...it would kinda of be like Khalid and Jaheria being Gorions friends and then join you...clearly they werent always just a lvl 1 or 2... BUT it would definitely have to be NPCs not from BG2 as clearly they became way too powerful...but some of the NPCs should be present in BG3 just not playable. Much possibilities of subplot and quests around them..
Since Bhaal technically isnt dead that is one possible plot, or even Cyric or another god trying to do something similar. Or something completely different. the possibility of revisiting enemies you thought were dead...dont want to spoil anything...but lets just say hes at the Bandit camp and final battle in BG1 and you clearly kill him.
The new character would either have to completely unaware of his lineage(like CHARNAME) or have full knowledge of it.
The map for BG3 should be ginormous. Really...being able to revisit Baldurs gate and the sword coast would be sweet, possible athlaka...but definitely needs a new city to be set in. The others would just be for enjoyment, exploration, sub quests. etc.
Incidentally, how about the possibility that Beamdog's BG3 will actually be a prequel to BG? One of the books in either BG1 or BG2 says Bhaal met his death in a battle on a bridge - perhaps in BG3/prequel, you play as the char who hunts down and kills Bhaal?
Baldur's Gate III: Baldurian Elevenses
Simple
obviously flesh it out a bit more and give a good reason why but that's the way to make it work
You know say the other gods got angry etc etc, you get stripped of powers and wake up naked outside baldurs gate and then it's a quest to regain the power, rope in your old allies and go to war with the ones who wronged you
But at least if Beamdog is making the game, they have an intimate knowledge and appreciation of why the Infinity engine BG series works so well in various dimensions. So I trust that they can give us a game that lives up to the predecessors of BG, BG2, BG:EE, and BG2:EE.
They'll need to hire more staff though, lol! It's a minor miracle that they were able to pull off what they have done so far with a staff of only 13--or at least that is the number I have seen cited on the forums. (If that's accurate they should have added their own "Bilbo" to the staff and made it 14!)
Keep the interesting scenario's comming everyone!
There has to be some plot device where the Bhaalspawn loses his powers. And this whole project has a certain amount of nostalgia attached to it. So we could pull a Marty McFly with it and have the big bad(Maybe Tiax...that could be fun) go back in time and prevent Bhaal from creating all or some of the Bhaalspawn, including you. So you are never raised by Gorian, but you may cross paths will him as well as other NPCS and characters. Maybe Sarevok, without Bhaalspawn powers is merrily cleaning tables at the Friendly Arms Inn or something. That would allow the developers to literally reuse many of the maps and resources. The (ex)bhaalspawn would have to relive a somewhat different version of events we've already seen which might unfold a certain feeling of deja vu which would culminate with CHARNAME going back in time to stop the big bad from stopping Bhaal and have to finally decide if they want to give up their current life to have the power and experiences from before.
I mean it's D&D so anything can happen right?
Two ideas I'd like to share:
1. Charname has its own spawn. (cheezy at best)
2. The gods are bored stiff and decide to have a little contest. A few of them reincarnate as humanoids. And they use the world as their personal arena. They will be free to travel and recruit those they find (up to 5 NPC's to join them, of course). Amongst them a few favorites could reappear, but time has passed on earth so most of the humans will have grown old. Imagine meeting an old Imoen, who you can try to make you remember you. Of course she'll have kids or something alike.
The main idea is that you'll have to survive all over again in a hostile world, make old friends remember you and meet new friends, while trying to survive attacks from the other gods. This could mean that Shar has entered the fray and she has recruited Viconia as cleric and you'll have to fight her instead of having her along. Or meeting Anomen or Keldorn in Battle.
Maybe the edge of being a god could help you restore some of your friends back to their glory days and have them join you. Maybe even the power to resurrect your former foster father Gorion, of course you’d have to find his remains first. He was a powerful wizard and would add a lot of power to your party.
After travelling the land and meeting some of the gods eventually you’ll be invited to an arena where you will fight the last of the gods standing in this contest. In one climactic battle.