Canonically, He remained a mortal. That is the only canon part of the BG saga, since it maintained the status-quo.
I refuse to acknowledge the novels simply because they're worse then the worst baldur's gate fanfic you've ever read (Seriously, the author is on par with whoever wrote the Solufein mod in terms of taking a characters name and race, and making the rest up as they go, completely ignoring the MASSIVE amount of information you're given about said character.)
The novel can only be described as a horribly done parody, attempting to portray all the characters as close to opposite of the way they're actually portrayed and described in game.
Attempting to read it is like trying to find enjoyment in slamming your hand in a car door..repeatedly...followed by setting it on fire, then dousing it in salt water, then rubbing even more salt into the wound...while watching The Sound of Music.
I wouldn't really call this a truth, the only people who consider the novels more canon than the games to my knowledge are the folks at the Forgotten Realms Wiki, and I wouldn't call a fan run wiki an authority on such matters. I don't think anyone who is actually in charge of the setting has ever stated that they consider the novels more "canon" than the games.
Even if the novels are officially recognized as being more canon than the games, does it matter? You're free to create your own canon.
There ARE no Baldur's Gate Novels. To say otherwise is nothing less than heresy, and it shall not be repeated. ON PAIN OF DEATH.
Oh sure, there MAY be some thud and blunder rubbish out there with the name "Baldur's Gate" on the cover, and those books MAY feature totally unrelated characters who happen to share names with various NPCs in the games, but there is not, and has never been, a series of Baldur's Gate novels.
I treat Forgotten Realms canon the same way I treat Star Wars canon: I take what I like and blatantly disregard everything else. Star Wars consists solely of KOTOR and episodes 4-6, and the novelizations of Baldur's Gate never happened.
Okay, how bad are we talking about, and in what ways? Bad plot? Bad dialogue? Or is its most damning fault that it differs greatly from the story of the actual game? Because if I know it's terrible going into it, and keep my expectations at rock bottom... Point is, I'm oddly fascinated now.
I need somebody to tell me in explicit terms that the novels lack any and all redeeming value, and I will derive no pleasure from them.
(Seriously, the author is on par with whoever wrote the Solufein mod in terms of taking a characters name and race, and making the rest up as they go, completely ignoring the MASSIVE amount of information you're given about said character.)
Westley Weimer, is most definitely not on par with who ever wrote those novels. He developed WeiDU the dialogue utility used by hundreds of mods, and several other mods he made himself...
He's also the associate professor of computer sciences for the University of Virginia...
Just sayin'. -Prince_of_Lies
EDIT: If I'm not mistaken, I'm pretty sure he helped with development of BG2.
Okay, how bad are we talking about, and in what ways? Bad plot? Bad dialogue? Or is its most damning fault that it differs greatly from the story of the actual game? Because if I know it's terrible going into it, and keep my expectations at rock bottom... Point is, I'm oddly fascinated now.
I need somebody to tell me in explicit terms that the novels lack any and all redeeming value, and I will derive no pleasure from them.
Umm...all of the above. If you're one of those people that likes watching movies like Plan 9, you might feel a sort of fascination with how terrible they are. Otherwise, I'd avoid the books like the plague.
Whelp...lost a lot respect for the Weimer guy...turns out HE IS the author and it's just as horrible as the novels....
Good work on the programing I guess, but you suck with the story part.
The actual content of mod itself utter garbage....roughly on par with level of wrongness that the novels (that don't really exist) perpetrated on this great series.
For future reference...don't make crap up. Soluafein is a Lawful Neutral fighter with stats on par with the other recruitable NPCs (since he was originally planned to be one, but they changed their mind as the deadlines started looming), with equipment you'd expect for a drow weaponmaster. Not, a Fighter/Mage, Emo, chaotic good quasi-Drizzt clone, with brokenly powerful custom gear and stats akin to a min/maxing PC. He wasn't broody at all, hell he out right tells you he made peace with his past along time ago, and when he turns down your offers, he says he simply wishes to go his own path . It's almost like Crossing the novel's making people opposite to the way they are in-game with Saerilith-lite in terms of spot-light stealing.
@ Prince_of_Lies You're an idiot. Weimer did not write the Soluafein mod, he created the program that pretty much all the infinity engine mods use for installation these days. Completely different things.
The actual content of mod itself utter garbage....roughly on par with level of wrongness that the novels (that don't really exist) perpetrated on this great series.
I treat Forgotten Realms canon the same way I treat Star Wars canon: I take what I like and blatantly disregard everything else. Star Wars consists solely of KOTOR and episodes 4-6, and the novelizations of Baldur's Gate never happened.
The BG novels, in my opinion, were disgraceful. I actually burned them. You might think that's a facetious joke, but it really isn't. I burned them both.
Westley Weimer, is most definitely not on par with who ever wrote those novels. He developed WeiDU the dialogue utility used by hundreds of mods, and several other mods he made himself...
He's also the associate professor of computer sciences for the University of Virginia...
People specialise in different things. There's no doubt that Weimer is very good at programming. That doesn't mean he can write worth a damn. Just sayin'.
That doesn't mean he can write worth a damn. Just sayin'.
Well, of course, never said he could. My point is that in general the content that was put forth by Westley Weimer contributed more to Baldur's Gate than the author of the novel(s?).
Sorry, but I refuse to let my love of the games cloud my judgment. The books aren't good, but the game can't be canon.
How can I possibly define canon in a game environment with multiple choices and without a common plot. In one game I steal from Drizzt his famous scimitars, on another I kill Elminster, on another I do none of those things. On a game I'm an evil protagonist, on another a good hunter or a neutral depressed mage. On a game I visit Durlag's Tower, on another I completely skip it. On a game I go as quickly to Nashkel, on another game I take a month to get there.
I define an alternative reality every time I play the game, depending on my choice of protagonist, who I take with me on my adventure and what actions I decide to undertake. And then... who knows how many people are playing the game in entirely different manners.
No canon here. Bad or not, the books for their immutable nature are better sources for canon. A game can never be, unless you strip off it any choice.
Sorry, but I refuse to let my love of the games cloud my judgment. The books aren't good, but the game can't be canon.
How can I possibly define canon in a game environment with multiple choices and without a common plot. In one game I steal from Drizzt his famous scimitars, on another I kill Elminster, on another I do none of those things. On a game I'm an evil protagonist, on another a good hunter or a neutral depressed mage. On a game I visit Durlag's Tower, on another I completely skip it. On a game I go as quickly to Nashkel, on another game I take a month to get there.
I define an alternative reality every time I play the game, depending on my choice of protagonist, who I take with me on my adventure and what actions I decide to undertake. And then... who knows how many people are playing the game in entirely different manners.
No canon here. Bad or not, the books for their immutable nature are better sources for canon. A game can never be, unless you strip off it any choice.
I agree.
The only FR canon I refuse to accept is the Spellplague and 4E. Me and my friends in our D&D group just ignored it.
@Necroblivion, I'm curious as to why you refuse to accept the Spellplague? I mean, it shows the long-term affects the Time of Troubles has on the setting... Hell, R.A. Salvatore mentions the effects of the Spellplague without naming it as such before "Spellplague" was it's common name. I do however, think they messed up with introducing Dragonborn and HOLY HELL THAT HELLSPAWN IS A TIEFLING?!
On topic: There isn't anything that can actually be done about the novels... As bad as they might be.
@Necroblivion, I'm curious as to why you refuse to accept the Spellplague? I mean, it shows the long-term affects the Time of Troubles has on the setting... Hell, R.A. Salvatore mentions the effects of the Spellplague without naming it as such before "Spellplague" was it's common name. I do however, think they messed up with introducing Dragonborn and HOLY HELL THAT HELLSPAWN IS A TIEFLING?!
On topic: There isn't anything that can actually be done about the novels... As bad as they might be.
The Spellplague for itself was kinda awesome idea. I didn't like all the changes they did with the gods, geography, and old characters. Talos is an aspect of Gruumsh? really now?! Mulhorand disappear?!!@?! there's a new continent only because you needed to push in dragon ppl?!?! WTF!?!?! they broke and twisted the FR so it will work with their new game. Nothing more.
I treat Forgotten Realms canon the same way I treat Star Wars canon: I take what I like and blatantly disregard everything else. Star Wars consists solely of KOTOR and episodes 4-6, and the novelizations of Baldur's Gate never happened.
The BG novels, in my opinion, were disgraceful. I actually burned them. You might think that's a facetious joke, but it really isn't. I burned them both.
Indeed I agree with Chow. Knew this even when the game first was out. The game wasnt like th ebooks. Thankfully i have most fo the series and the volumes within Baldur's gate dont even follow the story the same. I really proved that to LadyRhian and she got so flamed about me saying the game and the books werent exactly the same. Sadly I get banned for speaking the truth but thought id say that as I was right all along and had my right to fight back about it. If the game and the books were the same, Wed have seen Gorion get shot in the eyeball with an arrow instead of meeting Sarevok which cannonly the arrow killed Gorion, plus we dont see Abdel meet the two mercenaries he killed out of rage (similar to Brage) but met two assassins trying to kill him in Candlekeep. To LadyRhian and Kazumian(sp) if you are going to flame someone and falsely get them banned for speaking the truth,I suggest you guys back up your evidence next time. Again thanks Chow for bringing up the truth. Must hurt does it LadyRhian? You should be stripped of your moderator status for flaming me and telling me the game was like the books when it was not
Thank you Chow for bringing this up again. I hope this will give Kasumian (sp) and LadyRhian a chance to aplogize for the issues THEY caused those few months ago when I was right about what I stated the game is NOT exactly based on the books and its considered plagurism to follow an authors work exactly. Hopefully this can get my account back for I KNEW i wasnt flaming anyone ever on here especially abouty this topic written in the drow race topic!!! Alot of people including Tanthalas seem to take things judgingly the wrong way. But everyones different in the world. Some poeple just explain things more evidently and stricter but hopefully next time people will think before they try to make topics with others and not accuse them of false evidence when I had proved months ago.
Comments
I refuse to acknowledge the novels simply because they're worse then the worst baldur's gate fanfic you've ever read (Seriously, the author is on par with whoever wrote the Solufein mod in terms of taking a characters name and race, and making the rest up as they go, completely ignoring the MASSIVE amount of information you're given about said character.)
The novel can only be described as a horribly done parody, attempting to portray all the characters as close to opposite of the way they're actually portrayed and described in game.
Attempting to read it is like trying to find enjoyment in slamming your hand in a car door..repeatedly...followed by setting it on fire, then dousing it in salt water, then rubbing even more salt into the wound...while watching The Sound of Music.
Even if the novels are officially recognized as being more canon than the games, does it matter? You're free to create your own canon.
Oh sure, there MAY be some thud and blunder rubbish out there with the name "Baldur's Gate" on the cover, and those books MAY feature totally unrelated characters who happen to share names with various NPCs in the games, but there is not, and has never been, a series of Baldur's Gate novels.
I need somebody to tell me in explicit terms that the novels lack any and all redeeming value, and I will derive no pleasure from them.
He developed WeiDU the dialogue utility used by hundreds of mods, and several other mods he made himself...
He's also the associate professor of computer sciences for the University of Virginia...
Just sayin'.
-Prince_of_Lies
EDIT: If I'm not mistaken, I'm pretty sure he helped with development of BG2.
Good work on the programing I guess, but you suck with the story part.
The actual content of mod itself utter garbage....roughly on par with level of wrongness that the novels (that don't really exist) perpetrated on this great series.
For future reference...don't make crap up. Soluafein is a Lawful Neutral fighter with stats on par with the other recruitable NPCs (since he was originally planned to be one, but they changed their mind as the deadlines started looming), with equipment you'd expect for a drow weaponmaster. Not, a Fighter/Mage, Emo, chaotic good quasi-Drizzt clone, with brokenly powerful custom gear and stats akin to a min/maxing PC. He wasn't broody at all, hell he out right tells you he made peace with his past along time ago, and when he turns down your offers, he says he simply wishes to go his own path . It's almost like Crossing the novel's making people opposite to the way they are in-game with Saerilith-lite in terms of spot-light stealing.
http://www.weidu.org/main.html#weidu
In my personal opinion, anyway.
-Prince_of_Lies
How can I possibly define canon in a game environment with multiple choices and without a common plot. In one game I steal from Drizzt his famous scimitars, on another I kill Elminster, on another I do none of those things. On a game I'm an evil protagonist, on another a good hunter or a neutral depressed mage. On a game I visit Durlag's Tower, on another I completely skip it. On a game I go as quickly to Nashkel, on another game I take a month to get there.
I define an alternative reality every time I play the game, depending on my choice of protagonist, who I take with me on my adventure and what actions I decide to undertake. And then... who knows how many people are playing the game in entirely different manners.
No canon here. Bad or not, the books for their immutable nature are better sources for canon. A game can never be, unless you strip off it any choice.
The only FR canon I refuse to accept is the Spellplague and 4E. Me and my friends in our D&D group just ignored it.
On topic: There isn't anything that can actually be done about the novels... As bad as they might be.
Now we are all doomed…
when it was not
Thank you Chow for bringing this up again. I hope this will give Kasumian (sp) and LadyRhian a chance to aplogize for the issues THEY caused those few months ago when I was right about what I stated the game is NOT exactly based on the books and its considered plagurism to follow an authors work exactly. Hopefully this can get my account back for I KNEW i wasnt flaming anyone ever on here especially abouty this topic written in the drow race topic!!! Alot of people including Tanthalas seem to take things judgingly the wrong way. But everyones different in the world. Some poeple just explain things more evidently and stricter but hopefully next time people will think before they try to make topics with others and not accuse them of false evidence when I had proved months ago.