Dude, we normally kill only 1 dragon per saga, Icewind Dale for example. In Baldur's Gate 2 we can kill a total of 10 dragons, do we really need more dragons in BG2?
Firkgaark - Red dragon in Windspear Hills. Thaxll'ssyllia - Shadow dragon in the Forgotten temple. Adalon - silver dragon in underdark. Nizidramanii`yt - Black Dragon in Suldanessar. Nameless dragon - Black Dragon in nine hells (tear of bhaal). Saladrex - Red dragon in Wacher's keep level 4. Nameless dragon - Green dragon in wacher's keep level 5. Draconis - Son of Abazigal outside Abazigal's lair (shoud be blue like his father but is a green dragon). Fll'Yissetat - Green Dragon slave to Abazigal, just outside of his lair. Abazigal - Blue dragon member of the five.
Do you disagree with my question? Cos say, "yes we need more dragons" is not like "i disagree that there are too many dragons in the game".
Or maybe i made a mistake and forget one dragon in my list, if so, please be kind and add the missing dragon here please !
Non mi dispiacerebbe combattere contro "nuove" creature di tipo draconico in BG1. Ci sono tipologie di mostri di tipo draconico anche per personaggi di basso livello (come ad esempio uno pseudodrago).
I would not mind to fight against "new" types of draconic creatures in BG1. There are types of draconic monsters for low level characters (such as a pseudodrago).
Se você for dizer que qualquer ser dracônico conta como dragão, as wyrms do jogo já dão mais do que o suficiente pra preencher a cota.
If you're gonna say that any draconic being will count as a dragon, the wyrms in the game will be suffice to fulfill the game quota
Try to use english here please, cos if everytime that an answer is given, you use Italian, i use Portuguese, the other guy use Japanese.... the forum will become to much chaotic.
Way too overpowered. Think of how difficult killing any dragon in BG2 was. It was an accomplishment! If they added watered down dragons to BG:EE, it destroy that awesome feeling you got from killing one.
Soz, can't say I would support a dragon in BG 1, way too epic for the level. Perhaps an ancient wyvern? But not a dragon, there are too many of them already, any more would cheapen their grandure and feeling of accomplishment when you defeated one.
Soz, can't say I would support a dragon in BG 1, way too epic for the level. Perhaps an ancient wyvern? But not a dragon, there are too many of them already, any more would cheapen their grandure and feeling of accomplishment when you defeated one.
What about a green dragon young adult (according to P&P rules) somewhere in one of the Cloakwood forest areas? Green Dragons breath poison fumes and a young adult would have 10d6+5 hit points- easily doable for characters of a level to hit the Cloakwood forest and mine. That would be a maximum of 65 hit points.
My thought is the monsters you encounter trend to your level. If you are high level (as in BG2), the weaker creatures avoid you like the plague. As well, your party seeks adventure and challenge so as a 15th level party you won't go to an orc cave, but a tale of a Beholder complex holds much greater interest, and reward.
-Trent
I disagree, the monsters in an area go after 'everyone' unless they know they can't handle them. Adventurer's don't wear a placard saying that they're carrying seven +3 weapons and know how to use them. Because if they did, then the thieves would be all over them trying to get at those weapons. Weaker critters by extension would simply try to find more of their own kind in an effort to overwhelm you.
Otherwise, villagers would never have problems. In the end, it's only a matter of how much risk the adventurer wants to go through. A 15th level character who wants to stop a raid and put food on the table will deal with the orcs, while the ones who want TREASURE go after the beholders and the risk of death that comes with them. Scaling is a crappy game-play mechanic IMO, that takes away from the game itself.
No more dragon spam please, the poor buggers must be near extinction. It's so overused. I wouldn't necessarily mind a non-killable dragon (quest giver).
I would like for Firkraag to make an appearance in BG1, but to refuse to fight CHARNAME - it wouldn't be worth his time. After all, he claims to be very interested in your heritage and bears a particular grudge against you for your association with Gorion. It would be neat for you to encounter him on the Sword Coast and then conclude the relationship several months later in Amn.
What about a green dragon young adult (according to P&P rules) somewhere in one of the Cloakwood forest areas? Green Dragons breath poison fumes and a young adult would have 10d6+5 hit points- easily doable for characters of a level to hit the Cloakwood forest and mine. That would be a maximum of 65 hit points.
Of all the dragon Ideas this is probably the only one I agree with. It is within the rules and as it is not a full fledged dragon, would not impair the satisfaction of killing the dragons later on.
@IchigoRXC- There could be a variety of small dragons added to places. You'd want to put them not too close to each other- because otherwise, they'd be fighting each other for territory (although that gives me an idea to do a quest *for* a dragon. Say there are two dragons of a specific type, each relatively small). Whichever one you encounter first gives you a quest to kill the other- but if you kill the first and come back expecting a reward, being evil, it tries to kill you (Not all Dragons are geniuses, and it doesn't always know that if you could kill the rival it couldn't, you could probably take it out as well)). The Dragon types are limited by what places are on the Sword Coast- Blue Dragons like Deserts, so that's out. Black Dragons and Green Dragons like Swamps and Forests, so you could do those easily. White Dragons like ice and tundra, so that's out... Red Dragons like Hills and Mountains, so that's doable as well. But as for other places- Deep Dragon in the Underdark- or a Shadow Dragon... Deep Dragons breathe "flesh-corrosive gas" and Shadow Dragons breathe Darkness, literally blinding their foes...
Maybe there should be more Good Dragons as well. Copper Dragons are incorrigable pranksters and love to laugh (imagine meeting one as a Bard CHARNAME!) and Bronze Dragons are inquisitive and fond of humans. All Dragons can take human form, much like Jierdan Firkraag did and was revealed as a Red Dragon later on. Why set up all Dragons as antagonists? Why not make some allies, like the Silver Dragon is in the Underdark? (admittedly, evil parties are gonna want to kill them anyway, but for good parties, you could have a mentor. You could even set one of them up as a mentor for a Dragonkiller kit- slaying evil dragons or something. How best to learn to slay another Dragon than *from* a Dragon?)
No more dragon spam please, the poor buggers must be near extinction. It's so overused. I wouldn't necessarily mind a non-killable dragon (quest giver).
Scales is murder!
I hate critters that are hard-coded as unkillable. It's one thing to make a scene play out like in a movie and during that scene you can't change anything (Gorion's Death), it's quite another to make a character immortal. It has always detracted from my gaming experience.
Why not make some allies, like the Silver Dragon is in the Underdark? (admittedly, evil parties are gonna want to kill them anyway, but for good parties, you could have a mentor. You could even set one of them up as a mentor for a Dragonkiller kit- slaying evil dragons or something. How best to learn to slay another Dragon than *from* a Dragon?)
Funnily enough, I wanted to make a dragonslayer kit, with Dragon based mentors and stuff like that, but I was a bit off in my initial idea of it and it got shot down by other members of the forum when I presented it and kinda went off the idea. However, if done right it could be incredible I am sure and I totally agree that the dragons need not be enemies, or of the same strength as the ones seen later in the game.
Maybe, if BG2EE works a bit lik BGT we could travel back to these dragons and slay them if they were strong?
I would hate to see a full-grown dragon be slain in BG1.. even if it was a sickly failure to be honest. I expect a dragon to eat my face when I challenge it.
TC no, it would have to be a fledling, and personally it would lower the dragons that are in BG 2. You shouldn't fight dragons until you are VERY experienced. Even most veteran warriors die against dragons in the books, in BG 1 you are barely able to take on an Elder Wyvern.
We are getting some Beholder, it's enough!. Believe me with the max level you will get in BG:EE, you will not be able to kill a single quarter of a dragon....
I wouln'd mind a "metal" dragon for a quest in the Cloud Peaks. (It was done in NWN Sword coast chronicals) Let it give a quest. Make it killable, but as difficult as Adalon. So no players can kill it whitout cheating/modding.
There was nothing like killing a few dragons in BG2. Maybe it's just me. But I don't want to wait till BG2EE just to slay a few! Add one or two side quest dragons! I'd be jumping for joy. Don't know if anyone agrees with me.
What about a green dragon young adult (according to P&P rules) somewhere in one of the Cloakwood forest areas? Green Dragons breath poison fumes and a young adult would have 10d6+5 hit points- easily doable for characters of a level to hit the Cloakwood forest and mine. That would be a maximum of 65 hit points.
I don't think that having dragons in BG1 would be a good idea. BG1 (at least in my opinion) is more "down-to-earth" series of adventures similar to tabletop sessions, where you start as no-one and slowly develop your character. Dragons are meant to be powerful, even mythical. If dragon were to be met in BG1, it should be unkillable, more as a plot-device than an actual enemy. Dragons are epic and thus their place is in BG2, which is more epic.
Now, the reason I am typing this post is not actually arguing whether there should be dragons or not. I just thought of our poor Cavalier who (as a kit) will be almost unusable in BG1 (there is one demon in the entire game!), so I just think, that kits should be either selectable during the later portions of the game (maybe even in BG2 or towards the end of BG1 - this has already been suggested in one of the threads) or some kits should be replaced with something more useful. Personally I will always be a proponent of the first as it is hard for me to imagine Gorion's ward getting first lessons in career of an Assassin or a Demon Hunter while in Candleekeep - unless if this's something like becoming a firefighter due to childhood dreams in our world
Honestly I'll be perfectly content if the mod Dark Side of the Sword Coast is compatible with BG:EE uses a BG2 dragon. Or includes that option in addition to the original's modified wyvern. (Does anyone know if that mod uses a BG2 dragon these days?)
I want my dragon fights to be epic. So I would want to engage at least an older juvenille or younger adult dragon, somewhere in that age range. A green dragon would be fine.
This was one damned tough fight in the original DSotSC which used a wyvern animation. With a BG2 dragon it would be harder still.
Generally speaking, this is the sort of fight that with the XP cap removed plus the additional XP that can be earned from new BG:EE content and various custom mods, can be undertaken by a party just powerful enough to prevail. It should take many reloads even for a very advanced player. If many players, or even most, can't get the win that just reinforces how powerful dragons are! (I.e., that's appropriate.) A dragon encounter at this stage of the saga should include an option to hand over all your loot--including the entire party's armor and gear--to avoid the fight. And it would be nifty if a script could autofile an archived game save for you just prior to the choice.
Comments
Or maybe i made a mistake and forget one dragon in my list, if so, please be kind and add the missing dragon here please
Ci sono tipologie di mostri di tipo draconico anche per personaggi di basso livello (come ad esempio uno pseudodrago).
I would not mind to fight against "new" types of draconic creatures in BG1.
There are types of draconic monsters for low level characters (such as a pseudodrago).
So, for me: "yes we need more dragons"
If you're gonna say that any draconic being will count as a dragon, the wyrms in the game will be suffice to fulfill the game quota
Try to use english here please, cos if everytime that an answer is given, you use Italian, i use Portuguese, the other guy use Japanese.... the forum will become to much chaotic.
Otherwise, villagers would never have problems. In the end, it's only a matter of how much risk the adventurer wants to go through. A 15th level character who wants to stop a raid and put food on the table will deal with the orcs, while the ones who want TREASURE go after the beholders and the risk of death that comes with them. Scaling is a crappy game-play mechanic IMO, that takes away from the game itself.
Scales is murder!
Maybe there should be more Good Dragons as well. Copper Dragons are incorrigable pranksters and love to laugh (imagine meeting one as a Bard CHARNAME!) and Bronze Dragons are inquisitive and fond of humans. All Dragons can take human form, much like Jierdan Firkraag did and was revealed as a Red Dragon later on. Why set up all Dragons as antagonists? Why not make some allies, like the Silver Dragon is in the Underdark? (admittedly, evil parties are gonna want to kill them anyway, but for good parties, you could have a mentor. You could even set one of them up as a mentor for a Dragonkiller kit- slaying evil dragons or something. How best to learn to slay another Dragon than *from* a Dragon?)
Maybe, if BG2EE works a bit lik BGT we could travel back to these dragons and slay them if they were strong?
I expect a dragon to eat my face when I challenge it.
Nerf Spike Traps later on too ^^
Let it give a quest. Make it killable, but as difficult as Adalon. So no players can kill it whitout cheating/modding.
i expect to earn my right to face enemies of this magnitude and i do in bg2. besides, i like bg1 being a bit toned down on a fantasy element.
Now, the reason I am typing this post is not actually arguing whether there should be dragons or not. I just thought of our poor Cavalier who (as a kit) will be almost unusable in BG1 (there is one demon in the entire game!), so I just think, that kits should be either selectable during the later portions of the game (maybe even in BG2 or towards the end of BG1 - this has already been suggested in one of the threads) or some kits should be replaced with something more useful. Personally I will always be a proponent of the first as it is hard for me to imagine Gorion's ward getting first lessons in career of an Assassin or a Demon Hunter while in Candleekeep - unless if this's something like becoming a firefighter due to childhood dreams in our world
I want my dragon fights to be epic. So I would want to engage at least an older juvenille or younger adult dragon, somewhere in that age range. A green dragon would be fine.
This was one damned tough fight in the original DSotSC which used a wyvern animation. With a BG2 dragon it would be harder still.
Generally speaking, this is the sort of fight that with the XP cap removed plus the additional XP that can be earned from new BG:EE content and various custom mods, can be undertaken by a party just powerful enough to prevail. It should take many reloads even for a very advanced player. If many players, or even most, can't get the win that just reinforces how powerful dragons are! (I.e., that's appropriate.) A dragon encounter at this stage of the saga should include an option to hand over all your loot--including the entire party's armor and gear--to avoid the fight. And it would be nifty if a script could autofile an archived game save for you just prior to the choice.