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Why I didn't buy Baldur's Gate:EE

FoamheadFoamhead Member Posts: 2
edited January 2013 in Archive (Feature Requests)
I was pretty excited when this game was first announced. I own the entire series and have beaten the game many times. Unfortunately after the features were announced my enthusiasm was sucked away. Here are some of the main reasons:

Barely any changes to the story:

- You aren't allowed to touch existing content. Personally I don't understand why you would agree to a contract like this, nor why Atari would restrict you in this way. I really hope you guys renegotiate with Atari to give yourself the needed freedoms to enhance existing content.

New NPC's are not interesting to me:

- I would rather see existing characters expanded but you aren't allowed. I was MILDLY interested in new a new romanceable NPC however as soon as I saw it was yet another magic slinging elf I immediately dismissed it. I don't know why the devs of this game have such a hard on for elves but enough is enough. Please think of new ideas.

Hardly any new quests or game play features:

- How about adding new kits or sub-races...anything. Yes I am aware of the blackguard but Baldur's Gate isn't exactly friendly to evil aligned players so why bother?

No enhanced graphics. I get it, assets were lost and you didn't want to create new models because they would clash with the old ones. I am also baffled why you went to the trouble to add a zooming option...nothing in this game requires this from a game play perspective.

If you guys go ahead with Baldur's Gate II than please consider the following:

If you can't alter the story or characters than just update the graphics. I would love new 3d models and such.

Please expand on game play:

- Make the strongholds more interesting/more involved.
- Add assassination/bounty hunting quests.
- Let the bard perform in plays.
- Make familiars more useful.
- Make playing Paladins stricter
- Selectable paper dolls...I hate the Monk paper doll. I'm sure other players have paper dolls they hate.

I'm not interested in modes such as the Black Pit's or anything that does not affect the main game. I would rather that time be used to enhance the existing game I already love. If you cannot change anything significantly due to contracts or such than personally I would rather see a straight graphics update.

Anyway this is my two cents and all the above are just suggestions. I welcome any feedback.
Post edited by Foamhead on

Comments

  • JalilyJalily Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2013
    Just to clear something up, Dorn and Rasaad are also romanceable. Their character pages really need to be updated...

    Most of your suggestions would make good feature requests if you add some more detail about what you want (what would make the strongholds more interesting for you, what abilities would make the familiars more useful, etc.).

    Unfortunately, a graphics overhaul on any significant scale just isn't feasible; check out this post from a developer for why.

    I suggest checking back after a few months; Overhaul has stated they plan to address kits and subraces post-ship, as well as make at least one expansion-pack scale add-on. Perhaps once the additional content is out, you'll find BG:EE worth a try. :)
    Cerevant
  • CoutelierCoutelier Member Posts: 1,282
    It's a classic game; I can understand not wanting to have any established quests or character development messed around with. It would have been nice to have some more dialogue and quests for some of the original NPC's, so long as it was done in such a way it didn't affect anything else. But what can you do? I'm just happy to have another excuse to still play the game.

    I like zooming. I tried widescreen mods and the like, but they make everything too small for my liking. That said, I would have enjoyed some more detailed character models. Maybe even just a few different hairstyles to choose from or some such thing, so you can add a little more variety to the NPC's.

  • CuvCuv Member, Developer Posts: 2,535
    @Jalily Good call. Will move this to Feature Requests and see what can be done.
  • FoamheadFoamhead Member Posts: 2
    edited January 2013
    Jalily said:

    Just to clear something up, Dorn and Rasaad are also romanceable. Their character pages really need to be updated...

    Most of your suggestions would make good feature requests if you add some more detail about what you want (what would make the strongholds more interesting for you, what abilities would make the familiars more useful, etc.).

    Unfortunately, a graphics overhaul on any significant scale just isn't feasible; check out this post from a developer for why.

    I suggest checking back after a few months; Overhaul has stated they plan to address kits and subraces post-ship, as well as make at least one expansion-pack scale add-on. Perhaps once the additional content is out, you'll find BG:EE worth a try. :)

    I know my post sounded requesty and perhaps it was but I just didn't want to make a vague "I didn't buy is cuz it didn't have stuff" post. I'm not saying "I want these features before I buy" they were just ideas of what kind of content I'd want to see. I guess what I was really saying is I don't see a significant difference between this edition and the old one.

    Believe me I am on their side and want this project to work out for them. I hope Baldur's Gate 2 has far more in terms of new content, enough to justify another run.

    If I have one feature I dearly want it would be a non-typical romance. I always thought Mazzy would have made an interesting choice for a love interest given her sweet personality and her strength of character. I wonder if their are such things as half-halflings? I would also like to see evil made a more viable path.
  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
    CuvAristillius
  • EdvinEdvin Member, Translator (NDA) Posts: 3,244
    @Foamhead

    This is Baldurs Gate : Enchanced Edition not " Baldurs Gate : Extended Editon "
    You can´t expect much new stuff.
    Enchanced = Game look better, nothing more.
  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited January 2013
    Foamhead said:

    Barely any changes to the story:

    - You aren't allowed to touch existing content. Personally I don't understand why you would agree to a contract like this, nor why Atari would restrict you in this way. I really hope you guys renegotiate with Atari to give yourself the needed freedoms to enhance existing content.

    Baldur's Gate is an Intellectual Property of another company, which means they have the right to restrict it's usage in any way. I don't like the restrictions either but understand why Atari has them as they don't want the product drastically changed.

    New NPC's are not interesting to me:

    - I would rather see existing characters expanded but you aren't allowed. I was MILDLY interested in new a new romanceable NPC however as soon as I saw it was yet another magic slinging elf I immediately dismissed it. I don't know why the devs of this game have such a hard on for elves but enough is enough. Please think of new ideas.
    I will agree with you about the elfs, but the other two NPC's have a lot of personality.

    Hardly any new quests or game play features:

    - How about adding new kits or sub-races...anything. Yes I am aware of the blackguard but Baldur's Gate isn't exactly friendly to evil aligned players so why bother?
    Overhaul did chop out (or at least talked about chopping out) some of the overly negative reactions by guards towards evil aligned parties. I don't play evil characters, though, I don't know if the changes made the cut.

    As for more kits... stay tuned.

    No enhanced graphics. I get it, assets were lost and you didn't want to create new models because they would clash with the old ones. I am also baffled why you went to the trouble to add a zooming option...nothing in this game requires this from a game play perspective.
    I like the zoom, but I agree it's pretty pointless on PC. I think the primary reason to add it was for iPad or other small screen devices.

    I'm not interested in modes such as the Black Pit's or anything that does not affect the main game. I would rather that time be used to enhance the existing game I already love. If you cannot change anything significantly due to contracts or such than personally I would rather see a straight graphics update.

    Anyway this is my two cents and all the above are just suggestions. I welcome any feedback.
    I'm not interested in The Black Pits either, but I absolutely love the tie-in to the main game play that they did.

  • LMTR14LMTR14 Member Posts: 165
    edited January 2013
    I didn't buy it because it doesn't come on disc. I would've gladly paid 100$ for a collector's edition.

    yeah and Faketari limiting the devs of course is BULLSHIT
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    Foamhead said:



    If I have one feature I dearly want it would be a non-typical romance. I always thought Mazzy would have made an interesting choice for a love interest given her sweet personality and her strength of character. I wonder if their are such things as half-halflings? I would also like to see evil made a more viable path.

    A bisexual half-orc blackguard isn't atypical enough for you?
    SirK8toanwrathelminster
  • LoremasterLoremaster Member Posts: 212
    edited January 2013
    I can understand the OPs critique, I also felt some dissapointment when the game came out in just a "repacked" shape. The Black Pits was a waste of time and efford, if you ask me; and added contents to existing characters are better than new characters. It is easy to have high expectetions, especially if we look at all mods that tries to enhance the game in their own ways.

    But still, BGEE is better than BG, having more features and runs on more platforms. As I understand it, the devs have also made it more moddable than the original. BGEE is an ongoing project and more features are added with every update. Hopefully the devs have time to implement many more of the requested features from this forum. Number one on my personal wishlist is leafs for 10th level and quest level spells. But we shall not forget that the team behind this game is small and with limited resources.

    When negotiating a contract, one can not expect to get it all, at least not for a resonable price. I believe the devs are doing the best they can.
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    The biggest benefit to buying EE is continued support of the developers. If you get BG1 off of GOG, you can likely patch it to roughly the same quality level as BGEE. But when you hit a bug, good luck finding someone to patch your game for you.

    BGEE is dropping patches constantly, and we recently got a brand-new party NPC that nobody was even asking for. The game is still old, but the support is new, which is a godsend.
    SirK8ermoRnRClown
  • LugeLuge Member Posts: 90
    Madhax said:

    The biggest benefit to buying EE is continued support of the developers. If you get BG1 off of GOG, you can likely patch it to roughly the same quality level as BGEE. But when you hit a bug, good luck finding someone to patch your game for you.

    Think again. There's TEN YEARS of forums and expert players/modders who can help you. People like Ascension know about as much as anyone can know about the Infinity Engine, and they've been extremely supportive to the BG community over the years. The Big World mod package has been used by hundreds if not thousands of people, all on different machines with different configurations. You can'tsay there isn't support available.

    L.
    Dazzu
  • MessiMessi Member Posts: 738

    I can understand the OPs critique, I also felt some dissapointment when the game came out in just a "repacked" shape. The Black Pits was a waste of time and efford, if you ask me; and added contents to existing characters are better than new characters. It is easy to have high expectetions, especially if we look at all mods that tries to enhance the game in their own ways.

    But still, BGEE is better than BG, having more features and runs on more platforms. As I understand it, the devs have also made it more moddable than the original. BGEE is an ongoing project and more features are added with every update. Hopefully the devs have time to implement many more of the requested features from this forum. Number one on my personal wishlist is leafs for 10th level and quest level spells. But we shall not forget that the team behind this game is small and with limited resources.

    When negotiating a contract, one can not expect to get it all, at least not for a resonable price. I believe the devs are doing the best they can.

    I agree. I really liked what they did with BGEE and the new characters do add quite a bit new content with their questlines and new areas. But the Black Pits thing was a huge disappointment, when I first heard about it I thought it would be kinda Durlag's Tower, ie. a new dungeon to explore and loot, WITH Minsc, et al. Not something completely seperate, I still haven't done it even though I've finished BGEE almost twice now.

    What you say about it being waste of time and resources is my major problem with it as well. It may be great for all I know but it's not part of BG, and I kinda thought enhancing that was the point of all of this. Not using the limited man hours available to do something completely different.

    That's pretty much my only major complaint though. Sure there still bugs and UI improvements and such I'd like to see, but the main thing is that after 10 years there is professional development work being done on these awesome games again, and that is definitely worth supporting.

    @Foamhead those are valid points and I'd suggest checking back in years time when BG2EE is hopefully out. There were new kits datamined from the most patch and they have said BG2EE will have more new areas than BGEE did, more new NPCs, etc. There are also DLC coming, but all that will take some time.
  • KaltzorKaltzor Member Posts: 1,050
    Foamhead said:

    - Make playing Paladins stricter

    How about no?

    The rest might be good though.

    Aristillius
  • tomty89tomty89 Member Posts: 47
    edited January 2013
    I just wonder why no one keep the precious assets well. Especially those in BG2, every one of them is a piece of art. (Now you should look at my avatar and think LOL)

    Just like what @moopy said, it's a matter of expectation. Personally I don't even want the devs to use the BG2 engine for the part of gameplay or rules. Higher resolution, support for tablet platforms / Linux...purely technical enhancement would be fine for me.

    For the content / storyline part, I think it's WotC's decision and it might not be something evil or commercial this time. To some extent they are obligated to make sure things have certain level of consistency in the same campaign setting.
  • NWN_babaYagaNWN_babaYaga Member Posts: 732
    edited January 2013
    To expand the gnoll stronghold would have been the easiest and most interesting thing imo. But thats their decission, not the best one i have to say. We had a great discussion about it and many ideas were just perfect but all for nothing in the end. That is something I dont understand. Having such a cool and wasted place again in BG:EE is weird... but whatever:D

    I´m not disapointed with BG:EE at all just this one bothers me much! When I wander there now i just think of a missed chance to do something great!!!
  • PeteAtomsPeteAtoms Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 140
    I'm cautiously optimistic about BGEE. In its current state, I don't regret my purchase, but I'm a little disappointed. But I need to remember the reason I did buy it in the first place, potential. I'm really hoping that we get lots of quality DLC, modding tools, fan-made modules, etc.
  • moopymoopy Member Posts: 938
    Luge said:



    Think again. There's TEN YEARS of forums and expert players/modders who can help you. People like Ascension know about as much as anyone can know about the Infinity Engine, and they've been extremely supportive to the BG community over the years. The Big World mod package has been used by hundreds if not thousands of people, all on different machines with different configurations. You can'tsay there isn't support available.

    L.

    I work in software development, and my CEO has taken on a few minor clients for free or next to nothing out of kindness.

    The clients we make money from end up with MUCH better and timely support.

    Look at the support / enhancements that took place between Nov 28th and Jan 14th. Free modders do not move at that speed.
    mlneveseAristilliuselminster
  • LugeLuge Member Posts: 90
    moopy said:

    Look at the support / enhancements that took place between Nov 28th and Jan 14th. Free modders do not move at that speed.

    I'm sure that's true, but that wasn't the point of my reply. A lot of the BG bugs and glitches from unofficial patches have been sorted out over the years, to the point that there's no need to do further development on them or provide more than basic support via forums.

    L.
  • ArchaosArchaos Member Posts: 1,421
    edited February 2013
    Edvin said:

    @Foamhead

    This is Baldurs Gate : Enchanced Edition not " Baldurs Gate : Extended Editon "
    You can´t expect much new stuff.
    Enchanced = Game look better, nothing more.

    Um, not really.
    "en·hance (n-hns)
    tr.v. en·hanced, en·hanc·ing, en·hanc·es
    1. To make greater, as in value, beauty, or effectiveness; augment.
    2. To provide with improved, advanced, or sophisticated features"

    It's also called Enhanced Edition, not Prettier or Fixed/Updated Edition.

    @Kaltzor
    Paladins don't need to be stricter but once your reputation drops enough, you should turn into a Blackguard, that's irredeemable. Paladins can ascend again if they make the Paladin Stronghold quest.

    There should be three stages:
    High Reputation - Paladin
    Lower Reputation - Fallen Paladin
    Very Low Reputation - Blackguard.

    Then, when you fall, it would be actually a fun RP-experience. Instead of "lol sucks to be you, reload".
  • CorianderCoriander Member Posts: 1,667
    @Archos Blackguards are not the same thing as a fallen Palladin.
  • ArchaosArchaos Member Posts: 1,421
    edited February 2013
    @Coriander
    I know that but the Blackguard comes from 3E DnD.

    There, Fallen Paladins could turn into Blackguards if they wished, or they could atone.

    Right now, being a Fallen Paladin serves no purpose at all. It's pointless.
    Having a script or quest or something, that turns you into a Blackguard, would be really fun, I think.

    The Stronghold quest atones you, so why not having the reverse one?
  • bigdogchrisbigdogchris Member Posts: 1,336
    edited February 2013
    Coriander said:

    @Archos Blackguards are not the same thing as a fallen Palladin.

    Are they the same (or inspired to be the same) as Anti-paladins? i.e. BG2?

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