What bugs me about rpg romances
ajwz
Member Posts: 4,122
Is how they have evolved into time to take over the games they are in.
I mean, bg2 romances (which were the first ones I have encountered) were done subtly, meaning that you might not even notice they were there for the first through playthroughs. Whereas nowadays, all the bioware games make romances the be all and end all of character development.
Some really bad design decisions can mean that
1. You are not roleplaying your character in the way they would act, you are just choosing a personality that is most compatible with your love interests opinion on the situation
2. If really badly done, like in DA2, then virtually every other line of dialogue in the game is some discussion or analogy about sex, which gets really tiresome and grating.
I do like romances if they are nicely written in game as interesting diversions, but they have to be implemented correctly, and some games in the past have made me wish that a lot of the work put in to making a million romance options was actually used to increase the quality of the game instead.
Oh, and FFS if you are going to make a gay, straight or bi character to romance, make sure the writer you hire for this is of the corresponding sexual orientation. It is pretty obvious if this is not the case.
I mean, bg2 romances (which were the first ones I have encountered) were done subtly, meaning that you might not even notice they were there for the first through playthroughs. Whereas nowadays, all the bioware games make romances the be all and end all of character development.
Some really bad design decisions can mean that
1. You are not roleplaying your character in the way they would act, you are just choosing a personality that is most compatible with your love interests opinion on the situation
2. If really badly done, like in DA2, then virtually every other line of dialogue in the game is some discussion or analogy about sex, which gets really tiresome and grating.
I do like romances if they are nicely written in game as interesting diversions, but they have to be implemented correctly, and some games in the past have made me wish that a lot of the work put in to making a million romance options was actually used to increase the quality of the game instead.
Oh, and FFS if you are going to make a gay, straight or bi character to romance, make sure the writer you hire for this is of the corresponding sexual orientation. It is pretty obvious if this is not the case.
12
Comments
I agree with ajwz, in-game romances (particularly from BioWare) have gone too far these days. If I wanted to play a dating sim, there's plenty available from Japan. I don't. I want a quality RPG experience.
Baldur's Gate delivers on the RPG while still having it's characters feel personable and alive. And that's why it's the best, even today.
Still, while I agree DA2 is horrible, I don't think the DAO romances, or the ME ones for that matter, are handled poorly, as in I didn't get a feeling that they took over the game.
As for the gay/straight/bi part, I don't know. I'd like to think a skilled writer could overcome this. Or is it similarly impossible for a female to write a romance from a male perspective? In my opinion the way people think and feel about love/romance differs enough between individuals that orientation won't be the deciding factor. What one straight guy might find super sweet, another might find cheesy and lame, and so on.
Same for Steve Cortez romance: written by Dusty Everman, another straight man, but people fell in love with the character nonetheless.
"blah, blah, blah, but I can do men too if you prefer that."
1) Statistifying them. Get 80+ approval/affection/influence, say the right thing and bam, romance activated and you get +4 Str/Int/Mag/Wis because of their love. This makes it a powergamer's tool, you're handicapping yourself (usually mildly but still) if you don't shag someone.
2) Making every NPC bisexual. I love me some gay romances, as well as bisexual ones but making every NPC swing both ways without acknowledging it is sloppy. Going back and changing the sexual orientation of NPC's from previous games also falls under this.
3) In most games, every NPC is automaticly interested if you meet X requirement and you're not a total jackass. There's no challenge involved. I've not seen a conversation option that goes "I'd totally go for you Drugar, but...you're a freakin' dwarf.". The subject is simply avoided, my character can't acknowledge feelings or even hint in this direction. If you're not eligible, you have no feelings. Likewise, if I just hit the really obvious romance buttons, I get laid (if I AM the proper race).
4) There's never a dwarven lady to romance, it's always elves and humans in fantasy. Mass Effect included the very stylish Garrus and Thane, as well as the mysteeeerious Tali as aliens, but all are fairly attractive. Let me shag a Krogan! Let me step beyond appearances!
I don't believe you have to be gay or straight or whatever to write the corresponding romance. As long as the person has felt actual love and heartbreak, they probably understand the way it goes.
Doesn't mean all romances are well written, of course. But I don't believe the writer's orientation factors a lot into it (lesbian romance written by the average heterosexual male writer may be up for debate).
@Tanthalas
What I meant - and I think it is CLEARLY written in my previous post- is that you don't need to be gay or lesbian for writing s/s romances. If you state the contrary, it would mean that gay man/woman could not write straight romances, but PLEASE... These are awful stereotypes.
I'm not disagreeing with that since its also an opinion that I share.
I just don't agree that Zevran is a good example.
You clearly do not understand writing and creativity if you think one must actually experience that which one is writing about.
like it has been pointed out- making a game achievement or rewards out of "relationship" or turning them into predetermined chats on predetermined places, really kills it. not to mention that those flirty pixels have no problem claiming they will love you forever after what- telling you they had difficult childhood, reason for the choice of career and one shag.
even now i feel like a nerd when i say i really care about viconia when i romance her. i'm not after her ass or boobs (i'm gay if that was not clear by now) i just think the relationship is so well written i can believe she is a real character (she also has great voice). maybe i just like the unnecessary drama.
what i LOVE about bg2 system is how talks are so subtle at first you don't even know what is going on. in my first playthrough i had no idea i was romancing anyone until jaheira and aerie had an open fight and demand i choose, in the middle of adalons lair. well, that explained pretty music whenever they spoke... you never know when exactly will they speak (i like that, even if sometimes seems a bit inappropriate), they have their conflicts and the relationship takes it's TIME to develop. by the tob you actually had the feeling you are in the serious relationship, so i'm really looking forward to new addition of characters.
I took care of it.
Amen to everything you said, brother.
However to this: My evil halfling lady says: "YOU! Oy, YOU! You step away from my man this instant you filthy man-snatcher, or I'll put a dart through your eye faster than you can blink!!"
;D
@recklessheart: I personally don't get all the fangirl-swooning over Mass Effect's Garrus. I could never date someone like him. I think I'm just not into aliens, lol.
Further, this is simply a limitation of game writing. They cannot provide for the infinite set of possibilities that a player could imagine. It's simply not possible. Like it or not, sex is pretty thoroughly tied to fantasy romance, and DA2 takes place in a morally bankrupt urban hell, so talking about getting down and dirty suits the gritty setting. What did you expect? You could always not choose the dialogue options with the golden hearts.
Ok, never mind, I'm gonna wash my brain after that mental image.