@Grammarsalad I honestly have never played 3rd Edition P&P, and the only video game I played with 3/3.5 rules was Neverwinter Nights 2 (which was an average to below-average game). What team was handling the conversion from BG to Icewind Dale 2?
@Schneidend I agree 100% with this, this seems like something simple to do (for the devs or the modders). Additionally I'd like to see some interesting non-weapon magical items that could affect dialogue and ways to end quests. For instance in my P&P campaigns players loved the non weapon magical items more than weapons due to their unique nature and novel uses to solve problems.
@NineCoronas For some god awful reason I can't view that link while I'm in Afghanistan. Boooo crappy internet in a warzone.
@Paladyn If no one makes a mod for strongholds/PC safe havens I will when I'm no longer deployed. This is a genuine good idea and I had just discussed this with a friend two days ago.
I would add an epic atmosphere to the game... wait, it has epic atmosphere. Well then, I'll add some interesting dialogs and speeches... naaah, the game already has interesting dialogs and speeches. I guess I'll put in a bunch of fascinating quest... BG has that already, too...
I won't change anything, instead I will wait for the enchanced edition. Long live Baldur's Gate!
I didn't really like nwn either. I did like how out was done in iwd though.
Weimer created a beta version before he moved on to other things. It is my understanding that somebody else updated it but it's still pretty buggy.
I wouldn't mind a 2nd edition "players option" mod. I have a number of ideas on how something like that might be implemented but it depends heavily on a number of things I don't really understand like "softcoding attribute bonuses and weapon proficiencies" stop there's that...
@paheej Looking through the workroom threads, I've found some interesting things that I wonder, will they ever be finished? I know UB already has a lot of restored content and I am very thankful for it, but can you blame me for wanting more?
Looking through the 'research' threads alone, I've found quite a few things that at least warrant considering re-implementation. (I wish I could code Sad)
Game Quests A Hole in the Wall - Whatever involved all of the references to Squirrel's and turning into one. Removing the Slayer - The Spirit in Small Teeth Pass? (What became of that) The Final Slayer Dream - What was this about? Rhynn Lanthorn Lenses - What happened to this? The Rune's Web - "the Twisted Rune/Slavers/Roenall/Skin dancer interaction" as listed in a quest list... would show the full scale of the Twisted Rune's operation.
NPC Quests Deril the Lych (Cernd) - He returns as a Lich? Haer'Dalis the Murderer (The cut NPC Quest for Haer'Dalis, centered around an NPC named Quataris) Viconia's Lycanthropy Problem - I can see why nothing was done with it... Viconia has quite a bit of content as it is already Keldorn's Old Friend
Restored Encounters The Privateers/Executioner Becky and Diane Very Minor Restorations - Mithrest Inn Lovebirds, Iron Golem Brain, Minsc and Dryads/Yoshi and Nymphs, etc Mook the Vampire - Instead of dying, she was vampirised? Kurtulmak's True Avatar - Instead of the usual Kobold Shaman, originally he was different? More than target practice?
Restored Dialogs Imoen's Chateau Dialogs Suldanessellar Civilians - Cut dialog's for civilians during the Siege of Suldanessellar. Dace Sontan (The Builder) - Added WAY more depth to the Vampire underneath Spellhold. Ust Natha dialogs - Drow Spelljammer's extra lines and the Drow Cooks? Gaelyn Bayle/Bodhi - Gaelyn confronting the PC after meeting with Bodhi
Miscellaneous Vampire Blood Item - Could you elaborate what that was about?? Wild Apprentices - The option to "cut loose" your Planar Sphere Apprenti and let them make their own decisions? Losing Final Fighter Stronghold Battle - Losing to the Roenall's? Unfinished Spells Guarded Compound - Apparently Ketta's Thief ally was supposed to backstab the party (or a member of) and run up the stairs, instead of (as a UB dev stated).
That's a good portion, I neglected individually listing a lot of small things however... so if anyone can shed any light on to the status' of these "components", if they are still planned or canceled (and if so, why?), I'm all eyes!
Here ya go Soldier!
I bolded the worthwhile seeming stuff. They redundantly put the mithrest inn lovebirds (those romeo and juliet wannabe's in the gate district)
@Paheej It's fun to give players things like Immovable Rods, put the campaign on hiatus for a few weeks, then give them a problem that could easily be solved by said item...if only they remembered they had it!
@NineCoronas Dude, you're the man! I have never heard of some of those quests - I'd be interested in doing the NPC encounters . . . Deril the Lych (Cernd); Haer'Dalis the Murderer; Viconia's Lycanthropy Problem; Viconia's Betrayal in the Underdark; Keldorn's Old Friend - all of those look like solid winners. They would require adding a significant amount of dialogue to current NPC's it looks like but I've seen solid results with the de'Arnise mod (using music, or just a short exclamation from original voiceover when dialogue is started).
@Schneidend Hah I like that idea of the hiatus and then giving a simple solution with something they already have. I feel that puzzle solving does a wonderful job of breaking up pacing and keeping the game novel. They don't have a ton of replay value . . . but you always remember them - the prince is 30 and the princess is 40, even if they don't require an item.
As was already stated, I'd like to have all weapon categories with powerful, meaningful weapons to use - it's a bit silly for example that, as far as I remember, the best, end-game bows in BG2 were short bows, not long or composite long bows. Also, the ability to switch easily from dual-wielding weapons / 1-handed wpn + shield to bows / crossbows. The above are minor grievances but would be nice to have them fixed, not that I'm expecting to see it. What I'd love would be expanded NPC banter and romance options for original NPCs in BG1 (which will not happen without mods) and implementation of a Valygar and/or Haer'Dalis romance for BG2 (which again most likely will not happen as it would change the original content of the old game).
@Koson The whole reason behind the short bows was the ability to give them to classes such as thieves that could not use full size bows so it only really added to the versatility of the item instead of going oh great, another weapon I can't use that's good.
Meaningful weapons? A weapon is only as good as the encounter allows aka bonuses to undead, chance to stun.etc .etc there is only a small few do all weapons.
I do agree with you on the weapon changing though - I always used the AI scripts so I never really had to worry about switching over to melee unless it was pre-iniatated by the enemy.
This topic is all just one giant big wish list so don't feel too bad I am sure a lot of changes will occur both offical and mod, I know however mine will never come true.
@Synergetic I know that those powerful short bows were implemented so any class able to shoot a bow would have access to them, but it still causes a minor problem for those with access to long bows, as willy-nilly they would have to restrict themselves to short bows in order to make the most of their favored weapon. And if you don't have previous knowledge of the games and start in BG1 as a bow-using fighter / archer, you'd place points in long bow proficiency as these are the best and most damaging bows you can acquire (you find the composite long bow +1 early in Beregost iirc) only to realize later on in BG2 that you've "wasted" those proficiency points.
@Koson I know what you mean by that, my first play through was far from perfect and I did the exact same thing you did actually. xD I was a bit let down but then again I was liek that when I found the Cromsyr or whatever and looked at its stats.
That in the end credits, your real name would appear, as one of thousands who played the game through, and your name would be listed in the Great Libary in Candlekeep
1° - I would make evil an option, not an punishment.
2° - Make class specialization a quest based option inside the game, not a choice on character creation table.
2.1° - in addition i would link some quests in Dragon Age 2/Mass Effect serie style, so a choice made on the begin of the game would be prerequisites to some quests later in the game (or to get some NPCs, items...etc...)
3° - Give serious consequences to good and evil acts pretty much in "the witcher 2" style.
4° - would change the behavior of some NPCs based on main char actions in a more intense way, changing their status/alignments, turning them hostiles or killing them based on main character choices or other companions on the party. (this should really be done in EE).
5° - give the game a use for gold, cos gold in Baldur's Gate is totally useless.
6° - Add achievements to the game that should give a set of medals (or upgrade them) in the forum, besides the fact achievments give us more reasons to replay a game, link it to forum medals is also another way to discourage piracy.
Besides those 6 points, anything else is an client request, to the like of each person.
Edit:
@g314 i believe that in BG2 release a link to join both games WILL BE DONE, at least I HOPE FOR THAT. If not BGT will finsh as a better choice than BG EE.
Edit 2: as some ppl raised changes for BG2 too, there's my list to BG2 only changes (while the list above serves for the entire serie):
7° - give us a fucking decent thief (pure class for god's sake, no more multi/dual crap thieves).
8° - A spell sequence button where we can configure/set an auto cast macro that would be launched if we have all the requisites for it and press a specific button. This would be pretty much alike the gamble/tactics feature request i did in "http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/766", but would not take so much time from the team to be done and would help us in avoid the 10 minutes of buff for every fight in BG2. (at least we could reduce to 2 min and avoid to make every cast).
9° - Give a deep plot for the strongholds, i always think on them as pretty weak quests to be called stronghold, i don't even like NWN2, but the crossroad keep beat in 10 x 0 any stronghold made in Baldur's Gate. After that, rewrite the time delay between the events of a stronghold would be nice... so we can finsh them BEFORE SoA saga ends... a complicated problem, no?.
If you are a good magic user, make CHARNAME able to be Minsc's new witch, as opposed to Aerie.
Make Solaufein a joinable party member. He can have that same -2 to party Rep that Viconia has, but why not a male Drow? We have a female one. Imagine the dialogue between them if you have them both in your party!
If you choose to become a god, offering to make members of your party your servants/agents in the Planes/The Realms. Who better than the people who you sweated, bled and fought alongside? Why do you have to abandon your friends/lover if you become a god? And make it possible for clerics to become a follower of you as a God/dess (like Adon at the end of the Time of Troubles did with Midnight/Mystra).
Restore the lost female romances cut during BG2. And please, make these male characters not be flaming assholes.
@LadyRhian Totally agree, Soulafien was one of my favorite characters, I was really hoping he would join the party when I first ran through BG2. There are mods to add him though, and they give him some interesting dialogs as well.
Also, Anomen as the only romance for female characters was pretty limiting.
I'd like a dialogue system similar to that of Planescape Torment. I'd like to be able to strike up a conversation with Minsc and Jaheira whenever the mood strikes, as-opposed to every 30 minutes of game time.
@Dannen6272 Limiting and disappointing. I wanted to slap his ass into next week when he's being condescending at the start of the romance dialogues. "You couldn't have done that, you're just a woman!" (I seethe with rage). Not a good start to a possible romance. And as I recall, he never really apologizes for those remarks. My character is not so desperate for a man that she would settle for such a condescending ass as Anomen.
One thing?... and let's say it's a feasible wish for BG/BG2:EE (versus something that realistically could only happen in a brand new game, BG3)...
Mods already take care of a lot of things I find lacking, particularly SCS/CSC II... So AI improvements to enemy combat is already fulfilled, basically, via that excellent mod...
And I guess it ain't gonna happen contractually that we get further development of BG1 NPCs (not necessarily romances but a more professional version of what BG1 NPC project did; although romances would be great too), as much as we would all love that...
...Okay, I have it!:
I would love it if the source code for EE is released to the modding community, a toolset is designed for the Enhanced Infinity engine (ideally by Beamdog), and that modders can get compensated financially for their work somehow via DLCs. But if nothing else, I want a toolset. And, yes, I would pay for it.
If the devs can make it relatively painless for modders to cobble together area artwork via a toolset, then that opens the door for new adventures of all kinds.
That way I might one day see the realization of a prequel mod (or series of mods) to the Bhaalspawn saga set in the Time of Troubles. I now know that this won't come via BG3. But, honestly, I would rather see it created using the Enhanced Infinity engine anyway! I would just hope that the means exist eventually to create a high quality product that modders can actually get paid for.
In a nutshell, even if the source code isn't released (and I would imagine it probably won't be), a toolset that gives non-coders an opportunity to develop mods would be awesome. Naturally, this would include the option to code as well for the more sophisticated user.
The toolset would be a DLC, of course. So there is money to be made there for Beamdog. If there was a way for a modder to at least get a percentage of the profits for custom mod DLCs, then Beamdog can basically let modders go to town and profit from their efforts.
Comments
I honestly have never played 3rd Edition P&P, and the only video game I played with 3/3.5 rules was Neverwinter Nights 2 (which was an average to below-average game). What team was handling the conversion from BG to Icewind Dale 2?
@Schneidend
I agree 100% with this, this seems like something simple to do (for the devs or the modders). Additionally I'd like to see some interesting non-weapon magical items that could affect dialogue and ways to end quests. For instance in my P&P campaigns players loved the non weapon magical items more than weapons due to their unique nature and novel uses to solve problems.
@NineCoronas
For some god awful reason I can't view that link while I'm in Afghanistan. Boooo crappy internet in a warzone.
@Paladyn
If no one makes a mod for strongholds/PC safe havens I will when I'm no longer deployed. This is a genuine good idea and I had just discussed this with a friend two days ago.
I won't change anything, instead I will wait for the enchanced edition. Long live Baldur's Gate!
I didn't really like nwn either. I did like how out was done in iwd though.
Weimer created a beta version before he moved on to other things. It is my understanding that somebody else updated it but it's still pretty buggy.
I wouldn't mind a 2nd edition "players option" mod. I have a number of ideas on how something like that might be implemented but it depends heavily on a number of things I don't really understand like "softcoding attribute bonuses and weapon proficiencies" stop there's that...
Looking through the workroom threads, I've found some interesting things that I wonder, will they ever be finished? I know UB already has a lot of restored content and I am very thankful for it, but can you blame me for wanting more?
Looking through the 'research' threads alone, I've found quite a few things that at least warrant considering re-implementation. (I wish I could code Sad)
Game Quests
A Hole in the Wall - Whatever involved all of the references to Squirrel's and turning into one.
Removing the Slayer - The Spirit in Small Teeth Pass? (What became of that)
The Final Slayer Dream - What was this about?
Rhynn Lanthorn Lenses - What happened to this?
The Rune's Web - "the Twisted Rune/Slavers/Roenall/Skin dancer interaction" as listed in a quest list... would show the full scale of the Twisted Rune's operation.
NPC Quests
Deril the Lych (Cernd) - He returns as a Lich?
Haer'Dalis the Murderer (The cut NPC Quest for Haer'Dalis, centered around an NPC named Quataris)
Viconia's Lycanthropy Problem - I can see why nothing was done with it... Viconia has quite a bit of content as it is already Keldorn's Old Friend
Restored Encounters
The Privateers/Executioner
Becky and Diane
Very Minor Restorations - Mithrest Inn Lovebirds, Iron Golem Brain, Minsc and Dryads/Yoshi and Nymphs, etc
Mook the Vampire - Instead of dying, she was vampirised?
Kurtulmak's True Avatar - Instead of the usual Kobold Shaman, originally he was different? More than target practice?
Restored Dialogs
Imoen's Chateau Dialogs
Suldanessellar Civilians - Cut dialog's for civilians during the Siege of Suldanessellar.
Dace Sontan (The Builder) - Added WAY more depth to the Vampire underneath Spellhold.
Ust Natha dialogs - Drow Spelljammer's extra lines and the Drow Cooks?
Gaelyn Bayle/Bodhi - Gaelyn confronting the PC after meeting with Bodhi
Miscellaneous
Vampire Blood Item - Could you elaborate what that was about??
Wild Apprentices - The option to "cut loose" your Planar Sphere Apprenti and let them make their own decisions?
Losing Final Fighter Stronghold Battle - Losing to the Roenall's?
Unfinished Spells
Guarded Compound - Apparently Ketta's Thief ally was supposed to backstab the party (or a member of) and run up the stairs, instead of (as a UB dev stated).
That's a good portion, I neglected individually listing a lot of small things however... so if anyone can shed any light on to the status' of these "components", if they are still planned or canceled (and if so, why?), I'm all eyes!
Here ya go Soldier!
I bolded the worthwhile seeming stuff. They redundantly put the mithrest inn lovebirds (those romeo and juliet wannabe's in the gate district)
It's fun to give players things like Immovable Rods, put the campaign on hiatus for a few weeks, then give them a problem that could easily be solved by said item...if only they remembered they had it!
Dude, you're the man! I have never heard of some of those quests - I'd be interested in doing the NPC encounters . . . Deril the Lych (Cernd); Haer'Dalis the Murderer; Viconia's Lycanthropy Problem; Viconia's Betrayal in the Underdark; Keldorn's Old Friend - all of those look like solid winners. They would require adding a significant amount of dialogue to current NPC's it looks like but I've seen solid results with the de'Arnise mod (using music, or just a short exclamation from original voiceover when dialogue is started).
@Schneidend
Hah I like that idea of the hiatus and then giving a simple solution with something they already have. I feel that puzzle solving does a wonderful job of breaking up pacing and keeping the game novel. They don't have a ton of replay value . . . but you always remember them - the prince is 30 and the princess is 40, even if they don't require an item.
Every line of dialogue as well as giving the MAINCHAR a voice for his responses.
It would be Guybrush Threepwood all over with the smart ass replies! ;D
Also, the ability to switch easily from dual-wielding weapons / 1-handed wpn + shield to bows / crossbows.
The above are minor grievances but would be nice to have them fixed, not that I'm expecting to see it. What I'd love would be expanded NPC banter and romance options for original NPCs in BG1 (which will not happen without mods) and implementation of a Valygar and/or Haer'Dalis romance for BG2 (which again most likely will not happen as it would change the original content of the old game).
The whole reason behind the short bows was the ability to give them to classes such as thieves that could not use full size bows so it only really added to the versatility of the item instead of going oh great, another weapon I can't use that's good.
Meaningful weapons? A weapon is only as good as the encounter allows aka bonuses to undead, chance to stun.etc .etc there is only a small few do all weapons.
I do agree with you on the weapon changing though - I always used the AI scripts so I never really had to worry about switching over to melee unless it was pre-iniatated by the enemy.
This topic is all just one giant big wish list so don't feel too bad I am sure a lot of changes will occur both offical and mod, I know however mine will never come true.
I know that those powerful short bows were implemented so any class able to shoot a bow would have access to them, but it still causes a minor problem for those with access to long bows, as willy-nilly they would have to restrict themselves to short bows in order to make the most of their favored weapon. And if you don't have previous knowledge of the games and start in BG1 as a bow-using fighter / archer, you'd place points in long bow proficiency as these are the best and most damaging bows you can acquire (you find the composite long bow +1 early in Beregost iirc) only to realize later on in BG2 that you've "wasted" those proficiency points.
I know what you mean by that, my first play through was far from perfect and I did the exact same thing you did actually. xD I was a bit let down but then again I was liek that when I found the Cromsyr or whatever and looked at its stats.
Now serious:
1° - I would make evil an option, not an punishment.
2° - Make class specialization a quest based option inside the game, not a choice on character creation table.
2.1° - in addition i would link some quests in Dragon Age 2/Mass Effect serie style, so a choice made on the begin of the game would be prerequisites to some quests later in the game (or to get some NPCs, items...etc...)
3° - Give serious consequences to good and evil acts pretty much in "the witcher 2" style.
4° - would change the behavior of some NPCs based on main char actions in a more intense way, changing their status/alignments, turning them hostiles or killing them based on main character choices or other companions on the party. (this should really be done in EE).
5° - give the game a use for gold, cos gold in Baldur's Gate is totally useless.
6° - Add achievements to the game that should give a set of medals (or upgrade them) in the forum, besides the fact achievments give us more reasons to replay a game, link it to forum medals is also another way to discourage piracy.
Besides those 6 points, anything else is an client request, to the like of each person.
Edit:
@g314 i believe that in BG2 release a link to join both games WILL BE DONE, at least I HOPE FOR THAT. If not BGT will finsh as a better choice than BG EE.
Edit 2: as some ppl raised changes for BG2 too, there's my list to BG2 only changes (while the list above serves for the entire serie):
7° - give us a fucking decent thief (pure class for god's sake, no more multi/dual crap thieves).
8° - A spell sequence button where we can configure/set an auto cast macro that would be launched if we have all the requisites for it and press a specific button. This would be pretty much alike the gamble/tactics feature request i did in "http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/766", but would not take so much time from the team to be done and would help us in avoid the 10 minutes of buff for every fight in BG2. (at least we could reduce to 2 min and avoid to make every cast).
9° - Give a deep plot for the strongholds, i always think on them as pretty weak quests to be called stronghold, i don't even like NWN2, but the crossroad keep beat in 10 x 0 any stronghold made in Baldur's Gate. After that, rewrite the time delay between the events of a stronghold would be nice... so we can finsh them BEFORE SoA saga ends... a complicated problem, no?.
Gold is pretty useless apart from say buying stuff and donating do temples to increase your reputation.
If you are a good magic user, make CHARNAME able to be Minsc's new witch, as opposed to Aerie.
Make Solaufein a joinable party member. He can have that same -2 to party Rep that Viconia has, but why not a male Drow? We have a female one. Imagine the dialogue between them if you have them both in your party!
If you choose to become a god, offering to make members of your party your servants/agents in the Planes/The Realms. Who better than the people who you sweated, bled and fought alongside? Why do you have to abandon your friends/lover if you become a god? And make it possible for clerics to become a follower of you as a God/dess (like Adon at the end of the Time of Troubles did with Midnight/Mystra).
Restore the lost female romances cut during BG2. And please, make these male characters not be flaming assholes.
Also, Anomen as the only romance for female characters was pretty limiting.
Mods already take care of a lot of things I find lacking, particularly SCS/CSC II... So AI improvements to enemy combat is already fulfilled, basically, via that excellent mod...
And I guess it ain't gonna happen contractually that we get further development of BG1 NPCs (not necessarily romances but a more professional version of what BG1 NPC project did; although romances would be great too), as much as we would all love that...
...Okay, I have it!:
I would love it if the source code for EE is released to the modding community, a toolset is designed for the Enhanced Infinity engine (ideally by Beamdog), and that modders can get compensated financially for their work somehow via DLCs. But if nothing else, I want a toolset. And, yes, I would pay for it.
If the devs can make it relatively painless for modders to cobble together area artwork via a toolset, then that opens the door for new adventures of all kinds.
That way I might one day see the realization of a prequel mod (or series of mods) to the Bhaalspawn saga set in the Time of Troubles. I now know that this won't come via BG3. But, honestly, I would rather see it created using the Enhanced Infinity engine anyway! I would just hope that the means exist eventually to create a high quality product that modders can actually get paid for.
The toolset would be a DLC, of course. So there is money to be made there for Beamdog. If there was a way for a modder to at least get a percentage of the profits for custom mod DLCs, then Beamdog can basically let modders go to town and profit from their efforts.
Less 1 coin in 1 barrel -loot.
And a Tiax rules ending for the series.
5° - give the game a use for gold, cos gold in Baldur's Gate is totally useless.
Ill second that !
Ohh and more content.. always more content!