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Help jackjack fine tune The (EE)Keepers of The Dale!

jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
So…. I have a rough idea for an initial run party in mind, but most of my ideas have been roleplay influenced. Having said that, my current setup actually limits certain RP opportunities, and additionally, may not be as practically effective as I'd like.
Now then, without further ado, I present the Keepers of The Dale (EEKeeper required):

Sid - The Bard. Face of the party and wandering Gypsy minstrel. She has seen much of Faerun, but not The Dale. She wields a Crossbow which she only fires when her voice gives out and she's fresh out of apple cider vinegar to restore it. Plays a mean lute. Also carries a Dagger and Long Sword.
Chaotic Good Human

Tess al'Gruz - The Barbarian. A wildfire trapped in a beautiful, hulking frame, she is the party's sole native to Icewind Dale. Primary damage dealer and a textbook risk taker. She brandishes a mighty two-handed sword and whirls into the fray with abandon whenever she sees or smells a foe.
Chaotic Neutral Half-Orc

Stonebeard - here my troubles begin. A surly, bearded (duh), metal-clad tank. He is on a quest he doesn't talk much about until he's 12 pints deep into the ale. Initially I conceived of him as a Fighter/Cleric, but am now leaning Dwarven Defender. I love the idea, but I don't know if I can afford to lose a Divine caster. Axes or Maces, also Flails.
Lawful Neutral Dwarf

Rinadrel - A lonely, aloof man of the wilderness, this dude is in total flux. First I thought he was Ranger/Cleric. Long story short, that's out. I would like a Druid, either single or multiclass, but if Stonebeard goes DD, I'm left without a Cleric. Is such a setup viable? This is where I need the most help.
Neutral Good or True Neutral Elf

Jerrol - the utility man and either charismatic former smuggler or reserved grim reaper who lets his blades do all the talking. He was either stranded in or exiled to The Frozen North. A powerful and vital ally, but quite unpredictable. He's a Fighter/Thief with a twist: he's either a kind-hearted, lovable Swashbuckler or a vile Assassin (EEKeeper will provide the kitted multiclass). Scimitars and Short Swords. Tell me your thoughts.
Chaotic Good or Lawful Evil Halfling

Anduina - the lunatic Wild Mage. Most of the party keeps a safe distance, but they all respect her power. A hungry vortex of chaos, destruction, and ill fortune, she's the primary source of danger for her own party. Wields a quarterstaff just for laughs.
Chaotic Evil Gnome.

Roleplay is my favorite part of Icewind Dale, but powergaming suggestions are welcome—as I said, I need some practical effectiveness advice. Character-specific, total party, anything that comes to mind, I'm interested. Except for spoilers, try to keep them to a minimum.
So anyhoo… fire away.

Edit: For the purposes of this thread, go ahead and disregard Heart of Fury (HoF) mode. I won't be touching it.
Post edited by jackjack on

Comments

  • FrogmanFrogman Member Posts: 153
    Hey jack jack! Party looks great. I saw you say that the druid/cleric issue was your main concern. Well that was my party's main concern as well! Check out my thread that starts with 'need help!' On this forum. As usual, the awesome veterans turned up and gave me great advice. Hope it helps you too
  • FinellachFinellach Member Posts: 36
    Looks good but I am not sure if I would dare to play without at least one trueclass healer (Druid or Cleric). Might be diffucult...it was some time since I played the good ol' IWD.

    If they add Tempus kit for Clerics I would make Stonbeard one of those. ;)
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    @Gate70‌ Is right on the money with his advice.
    jackjack said:

    I am considering a Limburger level of cheese by making Stonebeard a DD/Cleric…

    I just threw up in my mouth a little...
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    Yeah, I don't think I can justify it at all. Plus, I really want him wielding an axe.
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    Btw, I love your description of Tess. Lovely half-orc lasses are the best lasses. Bonus points for a name that does not end in 'a.'

    I also have some advice as to Tess' build. I'd recommend her starting proficiencies be ** Two-Handed Sword, * Axe, and * Two-Handed Weapon Style. This setup lends her some ranged ability with throwing axes, and also keeps her options open for when an inevitably awesome two-handed axe drops from the random loot table.

    Rinadrel could go Ranger/Cleric if you don't mind missing out on poison immunity and shape changing. If the 'bug' continues to function as it does in BGEE, Rinadrel will have access to Druid spells. Although, for most of his career he won't level up as quickly as a Druid (both because of his multi-class and the slower Cleric XP table), reducing his number of spell slots and upper-tier spell access.
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    I had originally envisioned Rinadrel as a R/C to take advantage of the Druid spell bug, but apparently that won't be present in IWDEE D:
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    We've been told ranger/druids are working as in the original IWD, so ranger/cleric is gonna be pretty limited on the druid spells. Personally, I'm a huge fan of the totem druid, so I'd just go with that.

    As for running without a cleric, I say go for it. I like clerics as much as the next guy, but I don't think they're as necessary as some folks around here will make them out to be. Yeah, there's a lot of undead in IWD, but there's also a lot of other stuff. If you can beat the other stuff, you can beat the undead without a cleric. If you can't, you're in for a bad time either way.
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    !
    Interesting, to say the least, regarding Ranger/Cleric being a bit more evened out. And, yeah, I keep forgetting about Druid kits. Depending on how Overhaul reconciles HoW Druid features with the Druid kits, that could change a LOT of people's minds about Druid kits and Druids in general. HoW Druids already have improved shapeshifting over previous Infinity Engine games, so how will this affect the Avenger and Shapeshifter?
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    I would tend to agree with @subtledoctor‌. Keepering a strong melee kit into a multi-class combo that makes it even better at melee is pretty terrible. Why use Keeper to destroy the only advantage that humans have by making multi-class combos that can normally only be achieved by dual-classing? A human Fighter 3/Swashbuckler would be a bit much for me to use in one of my parties, but at least it isn't wholly broken.

    I feel like Keeper should be used to let shorties be Paladins, not let shorties be superhumans. Hell, I'd even accept Keepering a halfling into a Dwarven Defender to represent a halfling with specialized dwarf training or something.
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  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029

    A human Fighter 3/Swashbuckler would be a bit much for me to use in one of my parties, but at least it isn't wholly broken.

    I would actually debate this. I've run some numbers on a fighter 7/swashbuckler dual (which, notably, is impossible in EE without keeper-use), and it feels pretty broken. You get grandmastery earlier than a fighter (only by a about a level, but still), more proficiencies, full thief traps and detect illusion, full thief support abilities, and substantial bonuses to damage and AC. In comparison, a fighter/swashbuckler multiclass loses out on hit points, damage bonus, AC, thief skills, and proficiencies. The multi might win out in THAC0 (I haven't crunched the numbers on that) but it's not gonna be by that much. Now, a fighter 3/swashbuckler isn't as good as the fighter 7 for a number of reasons, but even so, my money's on the dual.
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    Oh, right, you can't dual to a kit. I forgot about that.
  • JarrakulJarrakul Member Posts: 2,029
    It was possible in vanilla days, because you could dual in BG1 and then select a kit for your second class when importing to BG2. You just have to dual within the BG1 level cap. So it's arguably fair game under those circumstances, but... yeah. It's stupid strong.

    Actually, one of the things that's so absurdly good about the fighter 7 dual is that it hits thief 8 by the BG1 level cap. Which means you get your fighter abilities back and can grandmaster in BG1. Which is kind of nuts.
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    Yeah, I think the Fighter/Swashbuckler is something I came up with because I so enjoyed a Fighter/Shadowdancer in BG2. But as both classes are melee-oriented, it makes little sense here.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511

    !
    Interesting, to say the least, regarding Ranger/Cleric being a bit more evened out. And, yeah, I keep forgetting about Druid kits. Depending on how Overhaul reconciles HoW Druid features with the Druid kits, that could change a LOT of people's minds about Druid kits and Druids in general. HoW Druids already have improved shapeshifting over previous Infinity Engine games, so how will this affect the Avenger and Shapeshifter?

    If it follows the kit descriptions, Shapeshifter and Totemic druids loose out, but Avengers should benefit.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    jackjack said:

    Yeah, I think the Fighter/Swashbuckler is something I came up with because I so enjoyed a Fighter/Shadowdancer in BG2. But as both classes are melee-oriented, it makes little sense here.

    I think it a case of vanilla thieves are dull, single class thieves are redundant in IWD, and Assassin dualed to fighter would be low on thief skills unless they dualed very late in the game.

    I'm planning on Swashbucker(6) -> Cleric.
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    Fardragon said:



    If it follows the kit descriptions, Shapeshifter and Totemic druids loose out, but Avengers should benefit.

    That's unfortunate. Avengers are kind of already the best Druid kit. Then again, the Totemic's summons could be handy in IWD, especially in Kresselack's Tomb to help keep the party out of reach of the undead with diseased and paralyzing attacks.
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