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Why some people suck at this game ( not the reason you think)

SharguildSharguild Member Posts: 186
Main reason;
They have no idea what the hell they are playing.

By suck, I don't mean they can't win battles or can't finish the game, I mean they pinball through and haphazardly come to a successful conclusion.

That's fine, DnD is not everyone's cup of tea and giving a fair trial at it is commendable.
But why do people SUCK at this game ?

I suggest, it's because It's not just that it is difficult, it is emotionally draining and mentally challenging as well and some folk don't like to have both their emotions stoked and efforts trialed at the same time.

I'll give you an example, the Irenicus fight in Spellhold.
Did ANYONE win that fight without reloading?
Of course not. Why? Because you were overwhelmed with the unexpected. Now for some folk, that is an instant challenge to reload and kick-ass.
For some others however it was an excuse to call it a day and move on to other games.

Playing a DnD game creates a mindset in an individual that is unique to other games;
- they become cognizant of how to allocate proficiencies to an individual
- They learn how to develop and cultivate a team that will assist their endeavours
- they learn leadership as the game progresses
- they learn the weaknesses of individuals and how they can be supported by the strengths of a team effort
- they learn how progressing, as opposed to being stagnant in abilities can prove worthwhile
- they learn how acquisition of special items can be but toward the betterment of the team as opposed to hoarding.
- they learn loss, not as much as I think there should be but that's me.
- they learn how to exploit an enemies weaknesses.

So why do people suck?

- don't care about outcome. If you have no interest or divestment then it won't matter if you lose.
- won't learn the rules; of which there are many. Call of Duty asks you to pick up a weapon and get good at killing. Mission accomplished. In BG you best know that most enemies are stronger than you and if you do not vary your weapon strategy you will not proceed.
- Can't make use of a gimped player; I swear that visiting Faerun would instantly make us misfits. 18 stats in 3 or 4 abilities with an intelligence below parakeet (4) or Charisma below 5 ( hated troglodyte). Really?
Is that how we want to play?
In pnp, if you gimped your stats, the DM made your death quick and unremarkable. Usually you rolled well rounded stats next game.
- Re-rollitis. Some folk just are not faithful to their character and feel their game will be MUCH better with a high powered character. Very first game I played with BG 1, I was so excited that I took the first role that came up and it was certainly not pretty. Won the game though because I persevered and played to the characters strengths.
- influence by external means, including this forum, heh. Some folk spend HOURS reading the crap we write and try to digest and develop best strategies that serve their purpose. Better to spend those HOURS playing the game and see what works FOR YOU.
- won't learn from others; opposite from above. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is well obsessive/compulsive sure, but signs of a good Dnd player as well. And not necessarily a sign of insanity. Unless you don't bloody well LEARN from it. Damn it, if you throw a fireball at an effretti and discover he LIKES them, why do it again?
- Complex spell menus and/or complex spells. Two words - pause button. Believe it or not, your computer will fry itself and die before that pause button releases you characters. You can read War & Peace while on pause.
Maybe you could pull out the chapter on spells from the menu while on pause and give it a cursory glance?
- Hate your character; opposite of re-rollitis. Hellm and damnation will take me before this character fails! But you have no love for that character so of course they will fail.
- Won't read the spell book or rule book as they advance. Figures all will be revealed in-game. Too sad for words.

Well, sucking isn't always a game killer but it will suggest your time is best spent elsewhere. On the other hand, you could try to become BETTER.

Post edited by Sharguild on
lunarBenjaminkcwiseBelgarathMTHBlackravenDJKajurujscohen
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Comments

  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 2,069
    Have you considered that maybe they just like the taste?

    SymphonyofSwordsBlackravenDJKajuruOgaburan
  • BenjaminBenjamin Member Posts: 39
    Sharguild said:


    I'll give you an example, the Irenicus fight in Spellhold.
    Did ANYONE win that fight without reloading?
    Of course not. Why? Because you were overwhelmed with the unexpected. Now for some folk, that is an instant challenge to reload and kick-ass.
    For some others however it was an excuse to call it a day and move on to other games.

    I agree with most of your post, but I strongly dislike some of the battles that require knowledge of what's going to happen in order for you to be able to beat them.
    For example the battle against Aec'Letec in Ulgoth's Beard, I simply cannot win this battle unless I buy magic blocking spells & potions prior to my character even knowing that the battle is going to happen.

    kcwiseBelgarathMTHwigglesgBlackraven
  • SharguildSharguild Member Posts: 186
    Hmm;
    Well personally I didn't use a magic blocking potion first time or others;
    After he waxed my ass the first time, and I realized his minions were providing him the life he needed, I put an Otiluke's sphere on him, killed the priests and devastated him with every spell and weapon I had when the spell released.
    Knowing what will take place in some battles first play is virtually impossible, but instead of finding it aggravating, I use it as an incentive to discover how I can utilize different strategies for later battles.
    Being a game, we have that luxury.

    kcwise
  • SharguildSharguild Member Posts: 186
    edited January 2015
    Ah;
    My dear Nonnahswriter:
    You recognize the affliction for what it is, a weakness, a disparaging affliction that inhibits your capability for completing a successful game.
    A Pity.
    There are methods, I haven't attempted them myself for I do not suffer so, that will inhibit the affliction and assist you toward recovery.
    First off, I've heard, spending time with reflection toward previous incarnations. With respect, there may have been attributes that seem less than they did first appearance due to diligence in understanding first what confrontations merited specific attributes.
    Second, recognizing a false sense of security thinking that changes in an avatars's persona or methodologies would improve upon your capability or play-style.
    Last, dealing with your incompetence.
    I do not doubt that you have fun, re-creating, like a mini-god, new people doing new things, right up until the point they prove difficult.
    But the point at which we are challenged is the point of determination. Of whether the person we have created, with all foibles and insecurities, faults and dilemmas can see through to completion.
    A gnome barbarian can win this game, given the support and nurture they deserve to see them through.
    Not to be abandoned on the waste-pile of your insecurities, nor led to believe for chapters that they stand a chance, only to discover there was no love, no support, no belief. Only despair.
    To be abandoned.
    To be left, to die.
    Mary Shelly provided more succor than that.

    Post edited by Sharguild on
  • SharguildSharguild Member Posts: 186
    edited January 2015
  • SharguildSharguild Member Posts: 186
    edited January 2015
    I think, you know, that I know, you mean't nothing of the sort. It was all in fun.
    Be cognizant of the fact however, when you use my name 3 times within a rebuttal, there will be a response. Not always the one you wish.

    NonnahswriterjackjackRavenslight
  • RooksxRooksx Member Posts: 57
    Benjamin said:


    I agree with most of your post, but I strongly dislike some of the battles that require knowledge of what's going to happen in order for you to be able to beat them.

    The importance of foreknowledge is a general problem with BG combat. A lot of fights are very difficult if you're not properly prepared, but very easy if you are. The best fights in the IE games are those when you're up against a well-balanced party that's similar to yours, eg a mix of melee characters and spellcasters, as there are a lot of strategic options available and the battles are quite fluid. Fights against enemies with powerful, party-wrecking abilities like Beholders and Illithids tend to be less interesting because they demand specialised counter-tactics.

    AHFdunbar
  • SamuelSamuel Member Posts: 12
    Gaining 15 levels in real life since the first playthrough should be reflected in game somehow

    If I had known about mages "needing" dexterity or condition, I'd probably have rerolled as a kid as well. Having high int/wis/char stats worked out just fine though.

    There are plenty of comments telling new players to "play how they want", so what's the issue with power gaming again? They did buy into one of the most epic rpgs, seems adequate to play a character like this.

    It's not exactly a PnP game, you reach lvl 40ish by the end, playing a god child, whereas you (both character and actual person) might just die of old age before reaching half that.

    Just stumbled upon this thread and expected something funny reading the title....maybe I don't get it though

    jackjack
  • DarkcloudDarkcloud Member Posts: 302
    I think the Irenicus Spellhold fight is a bad example. It mostly boils down to abusing his AI especially with SCS.

  • Tomato9999Tomato9999 Member Posts: 30
    Why do fans of every game I play claim their game is the most difficult? Iam so sick of this. And why does everyone compare their game to Call of Duty?

    And the whole logic behind the OP is very limited. I expected more from someone who plays such a difficult game.

    For example, it'd be easy to argue that even Call of Duty is harder than BG1, BG2. To become a good call of duty player, simply learning and reading and spending time is not enough. In shooters you really have to have talent if you want to be better than the majority.

    You know who sucks? The OP. Because hes unhappy with his gameplay experience, and instead of cutting his own yard, hes crying about other people's yards. He wants to tell us how the game is supposed to be played in order to have fun

    If players quit after losing a fight and play a different game, it doesnt make them suck, it makes them " adaptable".

    The OP reminds me of that Harper you see in one jaheiras quest who interprets everything negatively regardless what you say/do and attacks you

    also this game is suuuuuper easy I played it since I was 10. I dont know many of the rules and other stuff but you dont need to lmao. Best and most effective teacher is just-try-and-see-how-it-goes. If people wanted to learn all the rules and tricks they would, but this is a game not a job. People do what they want, and everyone wants smth different

    TommyKnox777
  • YannirYannir Member Posts: 595
    Why the f*** is everybody getting so offended? Sucking at a game doesnt make anyone worse. I suck at basketball, but I don't go around whining about it. I just don't play basketball.

    @Sharguild was making an observation about the kind of people that generally play this game. Some things said might not have been entirely appropriate but there was a valid point there. Not to mention the humor intended.

    @Tomato9999 Those people may be adaptable, as you put it, but they DO also suck at THIS GAME. As people they are probably great.

  • MestarMestar Member Posts: 78
    This is just a giant attempt to troll. Please don't feed into it.

    Ogaburan
  • OurQuestIsVainOurQuestIsVain Member Posts: 201
    I wouldn't necessarily "blame" people for not being good at this game. When this game first came out it was a different time. I remember having to draw my own maps for some games, figure out where to go without arrows and exclamation points, solve puzzles, figure out the game mechanics through trial and error, and just pay attention to what's going on in general.

    Times are faster now and I think games are a reflection of that. Most people probably can't spend hours in one sitting playing games but they still want to feel like they are progressing in the game so there needs to be a certain amount of hand holding from the game designers.

    To go from that to a game that offers almost no assistance at all (the tutorial is a joke) would be jarring and probably extremely frustrating for most people.

    jackjackwubble
  • Tomato9999Tomato9999 Member Posts: 30

    I wouldn't necessarily "blame" people for not being good at this game. When this game first came out it was a different time. I remember having to draw my own maps for some games, figure out where to go without arrows and exclamation points, solve puzzles, figure out the game mechanics through trial and error, and just pay attention to what's going on in general.

    Times are faster now and I think games are a reflection of that. Most people probably can't spend hours in one sitting playing games but they still want to feel like they are progressing in the game so there needs to be a certain amount of hand holding from the game designers.

    To go from that to a game that offers almost no assistance at all (the tutorial is a joke) would be jarring and probably extremely frustrating for most people.


    and where do you get this evidence from on these supposed "most people"?

    alot of games are hard to catch, BG series is not nearly hard to catch as some others I play which have thousands (if not hundred of thousands) of dedicated players

    again, as the OP, you make the mistake of assuming you are smart whereas others are dumb. Assuming this in the first place, is what makes you dumb tho, at least in my eyes

    and the OP is not a troll. OP may be getting a laugh out of what hes writing, and it may be comical/contradicting, but blaming everything you dislike a "troll" on the internet is retarded.

    The whole concept of "trolling" is retarded. I mean, we are all trolls one could argue. And if you think youre not a troll just bcuz you are always serious and straight-up-facts on the internet then you are worse than a troll (prolly retarded)

    so please lets not put a troll badge on everything we dislike

  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 21,476
    Dear participants!

    Let's not go into a discussion about trolls.


    Also, please, have a look at the forum rules: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/10852/site-rules-mind-the-gap and try to stay from going personal in your comments.

    jackjackwubbleNonnahswriterNukeface
  • OurQuestIsVainOurQuestIsVain Member Posts: 201
    edited January 2015

    I wouldn't necessarily "blame" people for not being good at this game. When this game first came out it was a different time. I remember having to draw my own maps for some games, figure out where to go without arrows and exclamation points, solve puzzles, figure out the game mechanics through trial and error, and just pay attention to what's going on in general.

    Times are faster now and I think games are a reflection of that. Most people probably can't spend hours in one sitting playing games but they still want to feel like they are progressing in the game so there needs to be a certain amount of hand holding from the game designers.

    To go from that to a game that offers almost no assistance at all (the tutorial is a joke) would be jarring and probably extremely frustrating for most people.


    and where do you get this evidence from on these supposed "most people"?

    alot of games are hard to catch, BG series is not nearly hard to catch as some others I play which have thousands (if not hundred of thousands) of dedicated players

    again, as the OP, you make the mistake of assuming you are smart whereas others are dumb. Assuming this in the first place, is what makes you dumb tho, at least in my eyes

    and the OP is not a troll. OP may be getting a laugh out of what hes writing, and it may be comical/contradicting, but blaming everything you dislike a "troll" on the internet is retarded.

    The whole concept of "trolling" is retarded. I mean, we are all trolls one could argue. And if you think youre not a troll just bcuz you are always serious and straight-up-facts on the internet then you are worse than a troll (prolly retarded)

    so please lets not put a troll badge on everything we dislike
    You clearly missed the point of what I was saying. I am not calling anybody stupid and if you read through my original post you will be able to see that. I am saying that people don't have time to put as much effort into games as they used to.

    If you look at any statistical analysis of gamers you will find that a majority of them play games on their cell phones and tablets. This suggests that they don't have the time for a more immersive game play experience (think game like farmville, bejeweled, etc).

    The fact that you would falsely accuse me of calling people stupid only to turn around and call me a retard is hypocritical and sad, I won't waste any more time on you.

    elminster
  • Tomato9999Tomato9999 Member Posts: 30
    edited January 2015



    If you look at any statistical analysis of gamers you will find that a majority of them play games on their cell phones and tablets. This suggests that they don't have the time for a more immersive game play experience (think game like farmville, bejeweled, etc).

    where do you get your info or data or where do you read up on these supposed statistical analysis results?
    Care to link at least one of those biased non-scholarly internet article "studies" you might be referring to?

    You cant imagine how funny your claim to me is, because analyzing empirical research is what we do in higher economics courses. Theres probably a million things wrong with whatever you read or whatever "statistical analysis" was done in what you read.

    And there's also probably hundreds other research studies on the same topic proving otherwise

    also I doubt (althoough one can never be sure) a majority of ppl these days use mobile devices to play games. And I dont think you'd need to do "statistical analysis" to find out. Unless by "statistical analysis" you mean an online poll.

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