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Inquisidor x Wizard Slayer

So, who's the ultimate wizard killing machine?

We won't add Carsomyr or Bala's Axe into this thrend, because it would be unfair with the WS to say the least.

Inquisitor have bonus in saving thrown (for being a Paladin), a very effective Dispel Magic, True Sight (for naughty Mislead and Improved Invisibility and Shadow Door), and can wear tons of gears.

Wizard Slayer have a natural MR, natural Miscast Magic at will (and with ranged weapons), can achieve Grandmastery in every weapon, have all the ready-to-go gear (helmet, shield, boots, weapons and armors), can be of any alignment (may not be a big deal if you're more a power player then a roleplayer), can be of any race (gaining shorty save throws or starting with 19 Strenght/Constitution), don't need to spend stat-points in Charisma and Wisdom, advance level faster and are able to Dual-Class.

A little help? :)

IMHO the best of both world would be a Dwarf Inquisitor. But it is not an allowed combination.

Comments

  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,714
    edited February 2016
    But hit is different of damage, no?

    The wizard may be protected by PfMW, Improved Mantle, Stoneskin, Mirror Image, if you "hit" him, you apply the miscast.

    A WS using Darts can work wonders from BGEE to ToB IMO.

    But, yeah, the Dispel Magic is a nice card to have in the sleeve. If the WS had something like this there would be no point in this thread.

    The way I see it, the best leverage of the Inquisitor isn't the Dispel Magic, but the True Seeing. Mislead can be a big problem for an opponent.

    PS: If I dualed a WS into Thief the only thing I would pursue with UAI is Carsomyr (mix it with lots of points in Detect Illusion). Best of both worlds.
  • Lord_TansheronLord_Tansheron Member Posts: 4,211
    Raduziel said:

    But hit is different of damage, no?

    The wizard may be protected by PfMW, Improved Mantle, Stoneskin, Mirror Image, if you "hit" him, you apply the miscast.

    AFAIK Stoneskin does allow for Miscast application, but the others do not.

    There's also the issue that if you play with SCS, many spells are scripted to ignore spell failure, making WS a whole lot worse.
    RaduzielFinneousPJ
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    Every "on hit effects" like elemental damages, Level Drain from Vampires, Miscast from Wizards Slayers and so forth are applied as long as you don't see the "Weapon ineffective" message. This means that a Vampire can drain you through Mirror Image, and that Miscast also goes through Stoneskin / Mirror Image.
    RaduzielsemiticgoddessJuliusBorisov
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    Inquisitor no question.
    Empyrial
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,714
    @FinneousPJ , can you tell exactly why?
    sarevok57
  • OsigoldOsigold Member Posts: 117
    I would submit that the ultimate wizard killing machine is another wizard, but sure, Inquisitor... if you like that sort of thing.
    semiticgoddessYgramul
  • sarevok57sarevok57 Member Posts: 5,975
    I think I would have to agree with @Raduziel on this one, first of all if we are talking about " the ultimate wizard KILLING machine" we are talking about how fast can we kill a wizard

    so if you just have a WS vs wizard and an INQ vs wizard, the INQ will do it much faster

    yes its nice that the WS provides spell failure on each hit, but once the INQ hits level 10 more than likely his DM will dispel all the wizard spell protections and in a round or so the wizard will be mince meat

    while the WS on the other hand still has to fight through protections ( stoneskin, mirror image and the like)

    and INQ have true seeing, which is very very important because if an enemy is invisible, the WS cant do squat against it, if it cant see it

    now with this all being said, you will more than likely have team combinations that can counter all this good stuff, but if you were to have a play through with WS and then one with INQ you will notice that the INQ definitely gets the job done faster, and also that dispel magic works on your team as well, to help get rid of all that whacky charm/confusion/ paralyze load of nonsense

    and even when it comes to "who can survive better" I would still say its the INQ, mostly because the INQ can kill the enemy spell caster so fast that the spell caster will not become a problem, and WS take AGES to gain enough MR to make it worth while that its not really all that great

    the irony is, there are other classes who can survive mages better like monks ( with their noticeable MR and good saves) and even the berserker/barbarian because of their rage abilities that make them immune to charm effects which are very common amongst enemy casters

    in my opinion INQ survive better than WS also because they can wear way more beneficial items that either make them immune to certain effects or can give them considerable MR without a hitch

    WS is just a neat concept if you want to try something a little different ( in fact it was the very first class I played, the first time I played SoA back in 2000) but when it comes to enemy spell caster crushing, the INQ will do it better every time
    RaduzielFinneousPJEmpyrial
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    @Raduziel What @Lord_Tansheron said. And @sarevok57 offered even more info.
    Raduziel
  • GoturalGotural Member Posts: 1,229
    If we are talking about Mages controlled by the AI, then Inquisitor is the best in my opinion. By far.

    But if we are talking about Mages in general, then I think the Wizard Slayer is a lot better then it's Paladin counterpart.

    Dispel Magic? Spell Immunity : Abjuration.
    True Sight? Spell Immunity : Divination.
    Physical attacks? PfMW which prevents most elemental damages and Carsomyr's dispel.

    Technically, a Mage can render himself immune to everything an Inquisitor can do, it's just that the AI isn't good enough to do it. Sure you could use mundane bolts with Firetooth to disrupt the Mage's spellcasting through PfMW, but the Mage could PW : Blind you instantly.

    The Wizard Slayer on the other hand has more Magic Resistance, better saves by 3 points if he is a Shorty, and he can applies his Miscast Magic reliably. If the Mage casts PfMW, switch to a mundane weapon and apply 100% spell failure in a round, or if he casts Mantle / Improved Mantle / Absolute Immunity use a better weapon and apply 100% spell failure in a round.

    The Wizard Slayer's Miscast ability is 25% per application, not 10%. I think it was @semiticgod who discovered this.

    Still I totally agree that if you are doing a Baldur's Gate playthrough, the Inquisitor will be a lot better than the Wizard Slayer but I think it's related to the game and not the classes.
    RaduzielsemiticgoddessGrumjesterdesu
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,714
    edited February 2016
    Does Arrow of Detonation apply spell failure as an area effect too?
    Post edited by Raduziel on
  • BelgarathMTHBelgarathMTH Member Posts: 5,653
    @semiticgod , Thanks for making an actually relevant post to this topic, which has potential as long as only people who are actually interested in it post in it.
    semiticgoddessGotural
  • RaduzielRaduziel Member Posts: 4,714
    @semiticgod Thanks for your feedback :smile:

    AoD being rare is not a problem. For what I remember, it's not crucial to give this effect in area, only in a few battles.

    But it's good to know that I can hold this card under my sleeve.
    semiticgoddessGotural
  • PantalionPantalion Member Posts: 2,137

    Arrows of Detonation are non-party friendly, but availability is a problem. In BG1, you can get tons of them, but in BG2, you're basically limited to a single Arrow of Detonation, as a random drop. If you have Item Revisions installed, however, you can buy a small number from several vendors, and there are 5 of them in Spellhold.

    Actually you can pick pocket infinite Arrows of Detonation from our very good friend Malchor:

    https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/45838/the-revenge-on-harpell


    As for the topic, trick question. The ultimate mage slayer is another mage.

    That said, between the two, the Wizard Slayer cannot kill mages as efficiently as the Inquisitor, because the Inquisitor can wear the cloak of reflection, become imp. invisible with a ring, and generally use all the other methods to survive to actually cause harm to the target, can use Wands of Spell Striking to breach PfMW, potions of firebreath to disrupt them, cloaks of Melf's to tear through their wards, and rings of fire resistance to survive MR ignoring dragon's breaths.

    The Wizard Slayer 9 -> Thief, on the other hand, can not only do all of those things and more, they can also wear Human Leather, Purifier, Hinjo's Doom, Ring of Gaxx, Seldarine Amulet, and with 5% Lum's and 10% Hell Trials get 104% MR, have timestop traps, and can wear a cloak of non-detection to hide undetectably nearby. The only thing necessary to beat mages is time, and a whole lot of those buffs last less than a few minutes each, so it's simple and effective to wait them out while they can do nothing but wait for their own demise.
    RaduzielJuliusBorisov
  • jesterdesujesterdesu Member Posts: 373
    My money is on the wiz slayer. He is innately immune to magic meaning he stands the best chance at surviving the longest. His passive spell disruption is also going to rock it as 1 x gww means gimped mage. All that said, if mage had a couple of time stops then no warrior is going to bother them
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