If impossible, they don't even need to be in irenicus dungeon (what would be a shame, cos that is one of the main discrepancies on BG / BG2 transition.
But at least a way for those NPCs reach Amn, and a game memory, so BG2 would remember how the NPCs where raised (prof. points we chose, vital speechs as if we killed or not Dinaheir for Edwin as an example among other things).
Personally, I like the little loophole they placed in for Xzar and Montaron.
1. Hey Xzar where's Montaron? 2. Who are you? 3. Didn't I kill you?
Regardless, I think some of the non-canon npc's should return in BG2 and they all(non canon and canon) definitely should be able to be summoned in ToB.
@Shadow, they killed Dynaheir, she is done. I could see Eldoth and Skie, Shar-Teel, Branwen, Alora, Kivan, Yeslick, Xan, and Kagain as possibly following you to Amn. Some of them have very good reasons not to.
As far as I can remember; the only "proof" that Dynaheir is dead is Minsc telling us he saw it happen. I can easily imagine a scenario where it turns out that he missunderstood something - that Minsc wrongly but sincerly BELIVES Dynaheir to be dead.
Perhaps she could be reintroduced AFTER Minsc has taken Aerie as his witch? Perhaps it wouldn't even count as messing with original content?
As far as I can remember; the only "proof" that Dynaheir is dead is Minsc telling us he saw it happen. I can easily imagine a scenario where it turns out that he missunderstood something - that Minsc wrongly but sincerly BELIVES Dynaheir to be dead.
Perhaps she could be reintroduced AFTER Minsc has taken Aerie as his witch? Perhaps it wouldn't even count as messing with original content?
@Grimfold Then again, they did it with Sarevok not once, but twice!
definately a nice addition to BG2,after all why would your former party members leave you? they need a serious plot reason to leave the main character after all they've been through,the promise of fame and wealth and the fact that they probably have nothing better to do than adventuring...
@GemHound i feel that the death of Dynaheir was somehow final and satisfatory, her death fit well the changes on minsc behavior, but you know, we can always bring her back as a deathbringer, why not !
@kamuizin I agree. Just commenting on the only way they could bring Dynaheir back. It would be strange though for Minsc's story if Dynaheir randomly appeared again. I myself, wouldn't want to see Dynaheir come back. She was killed off, deal with it.
I'm really wary of having Dynhaeir alive. Though the I suppose it would be entertaining to say she wasn't really killed, but actually enslaved by Irenicus and have her as a boss fight and give you the chance to save her and reunite her with Minsc (and Boo). But I think many fans would find that a slap in the face to what was already established.
Though I'm not sure if it's possible, I too wouldn't mind some sort of carry over from BG1 to BG2 and not just an assumption that you played with a certain party, but even if you could change it I would still have it so Jaheira, Imoen and Minsc are in the dungeon with you. I wouldn't say no to seeing excuses as to whey they are with you if they weren't part of your party when you fought Sarevok.
However I wouldn't say no to changing it so that either some NPC's from BG1 cross over to BG2. Some could end up in the dungeon too and others could wind up in the main game (whether they are looking for you or if appropriate to their character they don't care, but are just in the area coincidently). NPC's like Edwin I think should remain unchanged and left where they are (since it's not said if you were in the same party when ambushed or if all of them were captured).
Though I don't want to see all the possibly new NPC's in BG2 being the ones who didn't carry over from BG1. I'd hope to see a few new recruitable NPC's in BG2 and ToB as well.
Hopefully at least the new NPC's could at least carry over into BG2 (especially if they're possible love interests). Though again, I don't think they need to be found in the dungeon with you (but maybe that shouldn't be out of the question for all some of them).
I also wouldn't mind if some of your gear actually carried over. I think some things do change if you've imported from BG1, but you seem to lose the vast majority of stuff. I think it would be great if you could find some more of your old gear as loot throughout the dungeon.
The NPC's id like to see be added to BG 2 EE are Delaney/Male counterpart (c'mon i wanted her to join me so bad on werewolf island! Her and her hinted romantic flirting ) and also Xan, (whom never died.) I loved his depressive, dismal attitude, and I can only imagine the interjections he'd have with everyone in BG2. Best part is, it can be done since neither alter BG 2 content, they simply add to it.
Am I the only one who thinks that it would be pretty lame to have the same characters throughout the entire BG trilogy? I embrace the idea of adding new content to BG1 and BG2, especially new (created from scratch) characters. As much as I like the old BG1 characters, I feel that some of them are not en par to the quality of the BG2 characters. Also, I feel that some permanent deaths for story reasons should not be changed, like Dynaheir or Khalid.
I'd rather explore new, unique personalities instead of recycling old BG1 content in BG2.
Also, I feel that it makes sense that your starting party in BG2 consists of Jaheira, Minsc, Imoen, Khalid and Dynaheir, as someone mentioned above: There is an uncertain time span between the events of BG1 and BG2, which will probably make you leave (or your companions to leave) the group to go on their own adventure or whatever they want to do with life. There is no more reason to stay with you after the problems of Baldur's Gate have been solved - ESPECIALLY for those evil characters. It makes sense for Jaheira, Minsc, Dynaheir, Khalid and Imoen, who are the characters that have the most ties to the PC, to follow with you after the events of BG1, no matter what your final party consists of.
I still say fix the continuity, and maybe the name dropping. The fact that a decent majority of the NPC's that you could have traveled with end up in Amn for no other reason kind of bothered me. I didn't see why Gharrik was there, or Xzar and Montaron, and even VIconia and Edwin (I still want them to be there, but still). It's very silly, and it sucks that they've become intricate parts of BG2 that they can't just be removed because for the Veterans, they'll be expecting it, and when it doesn't come, it'll be an issue.
I just think that the canon for different alignments should be changed. Jaheira being there makes sense for all alignments, but Minsc being there makes like... only half sense for Neutral parties, and little sense for evil parties. I really think that if your alignment is different, then the NPCs that appear with you should be different. Maybe a different NPC in place of Minsc for different alignments. I couldn't see someone roleplaying as neutral or evil and still bringing Minsc with them the entire way.
Also let us use Tiax when we encounter him in Spellhold. Sure it's somewhat overkill for the NPCs that we can pick up in Spellhold, but Tiax was pretty awesome, had a very interesting multiclass, and it would give some more shortie love in the second game
I think there should be a connection between BG2 and the characters you travelled with in the first campaign. That makes sense. I also think that Dynaheir should be allowed to come back, the story can easily be squared by Minsc having thought she was dead, and a few lines from Dynaheir telling Minsc that he must now follow his own path. She could have gone through a Gandalf-esque rebirth. She may well be stunning in white robes. Khalid is more problematic, because Jaheira sees his body. But, it could be made optional, there were doppelgangers in the area, after all. There are so many triggers to knock out the Jaheira romance, that one more (Khalid being alive) would hardly be noticed. Or you may just find out that they split up before your trip to Amn. Or, as was mentioned in another post, there could be a doppelganger character that the player can make into anyone they want. So they're bringing back the character, without altering the storyline.
And why not find the little Yeslick! We saved his life in BGI, a dwarf honor would command him to help CHARNAME back if he heard the news about CHARNAME disparition!
I would really like to have both Yeslick and Minsc in my team, 7 and 8 int would induce some epic conversations between them! (Well you add Biff the understudy, and you have one hell of a party!)
I don't think these changes would be good at all. Khalid and Dynaheir are dead, bringing them back would be silly. I definitely understand the desire to have all the BG1 characters in BG2 (I'd like Kivan and Yeslick), but again, having every single NPC in BG1 end up in Amn would be implausible... better to keep it as is with a mix of old and new characters.
Having the characters in Irenicus's dungeon match your party from BG1 would be a nice touch, but I think the number of changes it would require to the game is probably not worth it.
One of the main flaws in BG2 to me was always starting off with the cannon party members.
I know it's early to think about, but since there will be a BG2 EE..
If you were evil in BG1 for instance you're not going to be hanging out with Minsc.
I get that you need to have Imoen, but at least you grew up with her. I feel like you should be able to choose the other characters that cross over with you when you import.
My question is how complicated is this to really think about? And does anyone else feel this way?
I feel. But it's preety complicated and I think impossible since they can't change original content because "The contract prevents Beamdog / Overhaul to alter the original game contents heavy handedly. "
@Sikorsky...Well, you wouldn't have to do much, just put Jaheria and Minsc in an Inn as joinable PC's...same dialog trees essentially, and at least give you the option of choosing from the new NPC's instead. Maybe you couldn't choose from EVERYONE...but you could pick a few that are closer to your alignment.
Personally I played BG2 before I played BG1 so starting with Minsc and Jaheira and Imoen in BG2 is just right for me. I don't want that to change.
If you want other companions you should probably go for the new ones that is bound to come with the enhanced edition, just like there is 3 new companions in the BG1:EE
This request gets brought up every few days... honestly I'd love to see it properly implemented, but it'd be very difficult to do so because being captured/tortured/seeing loved ones die at Irenicus' hands really changes the personalities of the characters. Jaheria wouldn't be the same if Khalid wasn't dead, same with Minsc and Dynaheir. They would have to completely redo most of the dialogue or else it just wouldn't make any sense.
Now, adding old NPCs after the dungeon? I see no problem with that, I think that's really the best way to get BG1 party members into BG2 (maybe they came searching for you?). I mean, it's not like you needed to be traveling with the canon party for them to be captured too, they would all be of interest to Irenicus for various reasons.
I think that probably the most effective solution here would be to include some kind of BG2 prologue describing why each of your party members left you between the first and second game. The amount of time between adventures is unclear, so it could have been months or even years.
@Aosaw and @harvman11 I think both of your ideas are great, but I wonder what they'll be willing to explore, the prologues idea between stories is especially good because it would make SENSE.
I think that depending on the party you had in BG:EE, importing it to BG:EE2 could broke few quests.
Edwin in Ma'evar quest? Viconia caught by fanatics? Coran's side quest in BG2?
Besides, as anyone said either, contract limiatations. And again, I saw already treads like this. Why people are so concerned with starting party, anyway? It doesn't matter for the long, since right after beating Irenicus' dungeon you are free to choose any party combination you wish. Seriously...
PS. I don't know anything about importing new NPC's. I think they are nor limited by contract Overhaul made.
Comments
But at least a way for those NPCs reach Amn, and a game memory, so BG2 would remember how the NPCs where raised (prof. points we chose, vital speechs as if we killed or not Dinaheir for Edwin as an example among other things).
1. Hey Xzar where's Montaron?
2. Who are you?
3. Didn't I kill you?
Regardless, I think some of the non-canon npc's should return in BG2 and they all(non canon and canon) definitely should be able to be summoned in ToB.
Perhaps she could be reintroduced AFTER Minsc has taken Aerie as his witch? Perhaps it wouldn't even count as messing with original content?
Then again, they did it with Sarevok not once, but twice!
Though I'm not sure if it's possible, I too wouldn't mind some sort of carry over from BG1 to BG2 and not just an assumption that you played with a certain party, but even if you could change it I would still have it so Jaheira, Imoen and Minsc are in the dungeon with you. I wouldn't say no to seeing excuses as to whey they are with you if they weren't part of your party when you fought Sarevok.
However I wouldn't say no to changing it so that either some NPC's from BG1 cross over to BG2. Some could end up in the dungeon too and others could wind up in the main game (whether they are looking for you or if appropriate to their character they don't care, but are just in the area coincidently). NPC's like Edwin I think should remain unchanged and left where they are (since it's not said if you were in the same party when ambushed or if all of them were captured).
Though I don't want to see all the possibly new NPC's in BG2 being the ones who didn't carry over from BG1. I'd hope to see a few new recruitable NPC's in BG2 and ToB as well.
Hopefully at least the new NPC's could at least carry over into BG2 (especially if they're possible love interests). Though again, I don't think they need to be found in the dungeon with you (but maybe that shouldn't be out of the question for all some of them).
I also wouldn't mind if some of your gear actually carried over. I think some things do change if you've imported from BG1, but you seem to lose the vast majority of stuff. I think it would be great if you could find some more of your old gear as loot throughout the dungeon.
I'd rather explore new, unique personalities instead of recycling old BG1 content in BG2.
Also, I feel that it makes sense that your starting party in BG2 consists of Jaheira, Minsc, Imoen, Khalid and Dynaheir, as someone mentioned above: There is an uncertain time span between the events of BG1 and BG2, which will probably make you leave (or your companions to leave) the group to go on their own adventure or whatever they want to do with life. There is no more reason to stay with you after the problems of Baldur's Gate have been solved - ESPECIALLY for those evil characters.
It makes sense for Jaheira, Minsc, Dynaheir, Khalid and Imoen, who are the characters that have the most ties to the PC, to follow with you after the events of BG1, no matter what your final party consists of.
I just think that the canon for different alignments should be changed. Jaheira being there makes sense for all alignments, but Minsc being there makes like... only half sense for Neutral parties, and little sense for evil parties. I really think that if your alignment is different, then the NPCs that appear with you should be different. Maybe a different NPC in place of Minsc for different alignments. I couldn't see someone roleplaying as neutral or evil and still bringing Minsc with them the entire way.
Also let us use Tiax when we encounter him in Spellhold. Sure it's somewhat overkill for the NPCs that we can pick up in Spellhold, but Tiax was pretty awesome, had a very interesting multiclass, and it would give some more shortie love in the second game
Khalid is more problematic, because Jaheira sees his body. But, it could be made optional, there were doppelgangers in the area, after all. There are so many triggers to knock out the Jaheira romance, that one more (Khalid being alive) would hardly be noticed. Or you may just find out that they split up before your trip to Amn.
Or, as was mentioned in another post, there could be a doppelganger character that the player can make into anyone they want. So they're bringing back the character, without altering the storyline.
I would really like to have both Yeslick and Minsc in my team, 7 and 8 int would induce some epic conversations between them!
(Well you add Biff the understudy, and you have one hell of a party!)
Having the characters in Irenicus's dungeon match your party from BG1 would be a nice touch, but I think the number of changes it would require to the game is probably not worth it.
I know it's early to think about, but since there will be a BG2 EE..
If you were evil in BG1 for instance you're not going to be hanging out with Minsc.
I get that you need to have Imoen, but at least you grew up with her. I feel like you should be able to choose the other characters that cross over with you when you import.
My question is how complicated is this to really think about? And does anyone else feel this way?
If you want other companions you should probably go for the new ones that is bound to come with the enhanced edition, just like there is 3 new companions in the BG1:EE
Now, adding old NPCs after the dungeon? I see no problem with that, I think that's really the best way to get BG1 party members into BG2 (maybe they came searching for you?). I mean, it's not like you needed to be traveling with the canon party for them to be captured too, they would all be of interest to Irenicus for various reasons.
Besides, as anyone said either, contract limiatations. And again, I saw already treads like this. Why people are so concerned with starting party, anyway? It doesn't matter for the long, since right after beating Irenicus' dungeon you are free to choose any party combination you wish. Seriously...
PS. I don't know anything about importing new NPC's. I think they are nor limited by contract Overhaul made.