Underdark Architecture, Logistics and Building Materials
Buttercheese
Member Posts: 3,766
First things first: This thread is not specifically about BG, IWD & Co. but rather about general Forgotten Realms lore.
I have been doing some research about the Underdark lately, specifically trying to fill in the gaps that most books/games seem to leave out, barely touch upon or are plainly badly designed. As you can tell from the title, I am refering to the more mundain aspects of life in the Underdark.
Upon re-reading the Drizzt comic books, I specifically got hung up on the design of the Svirfneblin town of Blingdenstone, as shown in book 2: Exile. Let's see:
Now, the discription of a "typical" Svirfneblin town from "The Complete Book of Gnomes & Halflings":
Here's another interesting tidbit about Svirfneblin and rubies, from the same book:
Have another snippet (this time about gnomes in general):
Also, in the pictures above you can tell that the doors and such seem to be made of wood.
Now, uhm, this is the Underdark and Svirfneblin are notorious for their reclusive behaviour.
Where in the nine Hells would they get this much wood?
I don't think trees are a common sight in the depths below and I also doubt that trading with surfacers is common enough to have wood in large enough quantities to warrant it as a common building material.
This leads to the next question: What type of building materials would they actually have available and how would these materials influence the architecture and the interior designs?
Unlike the Drow, Svirfneblin don't seem to have powerful transmutation magics that allows them to just form materials based on their will, instead they seem to build things by hand. Which makes sense, given that they are known for their craftiness.
Now, with my very limited knowledge of geology and speleology, I am gonna guess that the only building materials they actually have are different types of stone, limited amounts of metals (the book indicates that gnomes are more into gem mining rather than ore mining, so I doubt it would be enough metal to actually warant entire structures or furnitures made of mostly or even all metal), types of cement/ clay (I think) and certain wood like types of mushroom. I would also think glass and certain types of crystals could be utilised beyond just looking pretty. Bone and chitin are also a possibility. Also maybe certain body parts of fish can be used as building materials?
These materials of course vastly limit the types of furniture, especially the lack of wood.
I mean, try moving around a chair made of massive rock. Not happening.
So here is what I am immagining: There is barely any movable furniture. Shelves, Tables, chairs, etc. are cut directly into the stone and immovable. Since gnomes don't create fabric in general (which is also based on the books, they only trade it) only the richest svirfneblin have curtains, pillows and such made from spider silk fabric (traded from drow). Most other things that would be typically made of fabric are instead made of leather and furs. (At first I thought that maybe Svirfneblin also herd Rothe and maybe could use their fur to make fabric, but I couldn't find anything on that so I guess not.)
As for tools and weapons, I believe these would be mainly made of metal (duh), ceramics, bone, chitin and the afformentioned wood-like mushrooms. For example, pottery and bottles with corks made from mushroom seem likely. Also hilts for pickaxes and swords made of shroom or bone.
For comparision: Granitehome in BG2
See all those beds, barrels, tables, chairs, chests and whatnot?
I really don't think these are probable for this culture.
Also, what does the lack of wood mean for the mining?
What do they use for beams to keep mining tunnels from caving in on them?
____________________________________
Well, those are my thoughts & observations so far.
I would love to hear your ideas on this, not just on Svirfneblin but on other Underdark civilisations in general (though I guess Drow are a bit lame in this topic, because they can just do anything by magic :V)
However, and I have to be adamant on this:
Please make absolutely sure to source the information you share here, to proof that they are reliable.
Headcanons/ speculations are also very welcome, but please make it clear that this is not official information
I have been doing some research about the Underdark lately, specifically trying to fill in the gaps that most books/games seem to leave out, barely touch upon or are plainly badly designed. As you can tell from the title, I am refering to the more mundain aspects of life in the Underdark.
Upon re-reading the Drizzt comic books, I specifically got hung up on the design of the Svirfneblin town of Blingdenstone, as shown in book 2: Exile. Let's see:
Now, the discription of a "typical" Svirfneblin town from "The Complete Book of Gnomes & Halflings":
The cities of the Deep Gnomes are vast and complex places. Many layers of caverns, tunnels, and buildings are connected by narrow corridors and spiraling staircases. Generally, however, at least the central part of the city will occupy a single large cavern, with narrow streets winding among tall stone buildings. If large stalagmites are present, high-ranking Svirfneblin will claim these and excavate the interiors for the private homes; most residences, however, are carved into the natural bedrock of the earth.That doesn't particularly match up.
Here's another interesting tidbit about Svirfneblin and rubies, from the same book:
The gem that most draws the interest and devotion of the Svirfneblin is the ruby, which is the predominant symbol of the race. The Deep Gnomes view these crimson stones with reverence approaching awe-so much so that they are never used for mundane practices such as ornamentation of garments, weapons, or armor. Rubies are reserved for sacred purposes and are often employed to decorate artifacts that are dedicated to the Svirfneblin gods. They are also favored by Deep Gnome monarchs, so much so that a Svirfneblin king or queen might have a full ring of rubies around his or her crown, with others of the precious stone set in the throne and sceptre.I find this part worth mentioning because A. neither King Schicktick's garments nor his throne room feature any rubies and B. it implies that other gems tend to be worked into decorations and such.
Have another snippet (this time about gnomes in general):
Carpentry is another skill that demonstrates the gnomish penchant for elaboration. Whereas dwarves will hew timbers to shore up a mine shaft and at need can make rough tables, beds, and chairs for their own use, gnomes have a compulsion to cover every available inch with decoration which goes far beyond utility. Thus gnome miners will often use their breaks to carve delicate designs into the support timbers (taking care not to weaken the beams!), often having friendly contests between different shifts as each continues the other’s work. Gnomish furniture is a marvel of fine woodcarving, with a multitude of baroque detail.So, based on these descriptions alone, the visual presentation of Blingdenstone in that book seems to be way off. Of course different towns and settlements feature different layouts and quirks and I am not sure how the town is discribed in the novel it's based on, but yeah. My point is, trying to get a good idea of what these towns should look like appears to be rather difficult.
Also, in the pictures above you can tell that the doors and such seem to be made of wood.
Now, uhm, this is the Underdark and Svirfneblin are notorious for their reclusive behaviour.
Where in the nine Hells would they get this much wood?
I don't think trees are a common sight in the depths below and I also doubt that trading with surfacers is common enough to have wood in large enough quantities to warrant it as a common building material.
This leads to the next question: What type of building materials would they actually have available and how would these materials influence the architecture and the interior designs?
Unlike the Drow, Svirfneblin don't seem to have powerful transmutation magics that allows them to just form materials based on their will, instead they seem to build things by hand. Which makes sense, given that they are known for their craftiness.
Now, with my very limited knowledge of geology and speleology, I am gonna guess that the only building materials they actually have are different types of stone, limited amounts of metals (the book indicates that gnomes are more into gem mining rather than ore mining, so I doubt it would be enough metal to actually warant entire structures or furnitures made of mostly or even all metal), types of cement/ clay (I think) and certain wood like types of mushroom. I would also think glass and certain types of crystals could be utilised beyond just looking pretty. Bone and chitin are also a possibility. Also maybe certain body parts of fish can be used as building materials?
These materials of course vastly limit the types of furniture, especially the lack of wood.
I mean, try moving around a chair made of massive rock. Not happening.
So here is what I am immagining: There is barely any movable furniture. Shelves, Tables, chairs, etc. are cut directly into the stone and immovable. Since gnomes don't create fabric in general (which is also based on the books, they only trade it) only the richest svirfneblin have curtains, pillows and such made from spider silk fabric (traded from drow). Most other things that would be typically made of fabric are instead made of leather and furs. (At first I thought that maybe Svirfneblin also herd Rothe and maybe could use their fur to make fabric, but I couldn't find anything on that so I guess not.)
As for tools and weapons, I believe these would be mainly made of metal (duh), ceramics, bone, chitin and the afformentioned wood-like mushrooms. For example, pottery and bottles with corks made from mushroom seem likely. Also hilts for pickaxes and swords made of shroom or bone.
For comparision: Granitehome in BG2
See all those beds, barrels, tables, chairs, chests and whatnot?
I really don't think these are probable for this culture.
Also, what does the lack of wood mean for the mining?
What do they use for beams to keep mining tunnels from caving in on them?
____________________________________
Well, those are my thoughts & observations so far.
I would love to hear your ideas on this, not just on Svirfneblin but on other Underdark civilisations in general (though I guess Drow are a bit lame in this topic, because they can just do anything by magic :V)
However, and I have to be adamant on this:
Please make absolutely sure to source the information you share here, to proof that they are reliable.
Headcanons/ speculations are also very welcome, but please make it clear that this is not official information
Post edited by Buttercheese on
6
Comments
As for weapon and tool hilts, maybe some sort of super light alloy could work, but Gnomes don't seem that big on metals. Might make sense for Duegar and Drow though.
Wood would (haha) rot away rather quickly underground, given the funky climate often leading to high air moisture. So even if wood was readily available, unless they have ways to properly preserve it (either chemically or magically) it wouldn't even be feasable as a building material.
Then we have mycelium as a substitute (which fascinates me more and more the more I think about it). Immagine having furniture made of that stuff. Now, if I didn't misread anything, that stuff actually keeps growing no matter what. So immagine having your average Svirfneblin household with some mycelium furniture, maybe the doors made out of that stuff, too. So as part of the regular housework that stuff would have to be cut back regularly. There might be a clay pot in some corner of the kitchen where all the cut off material is stored. And when the pot is full again, it's brought to the local mycelium craftsman who will make new building material from it.
You could literally grow building materials within your home.
Now immagine this: A long abandoned Svirfneblin settlement. Out of every window and doorway grow mushrooms of varying sizes and shapes because no one there was able to cut them back. That would make for a great dungeon to explore. The players might have to find a certain item that is somewhere in the town. And they have to cut their way through the doorways. Maybe there is a wizard's lair somewhere in that town, too. Maybe he had stored some funky magical potions. Maybe the ever growing fungi broke some of the bottles and reacted with them. Maybe they turned into some cool mushroom mutant monsters that the players have to battle. Maybe the entire town has become one large mushroom mutant monster and the players now have to fight their way out of the settlement, being literally attacked by the doorways and windows.
I guess the forgotten realms has better courses in construction than the courses I took. Concrete 5 was of course glorious to take.
Guess they must get a lot of adventurers coming there way?
You can come up with potentially plausible explanations, but it's very hard to make them consistent, internally coherent, practicable, and not overly contrived. "It's magic" (or the appropriate equivalent superpower) is a convenient excuse all too often employed there, though it does make sense in certain spots - particularly for races that are notoriously arrogant about their superior abilities, magical or otherwise; e.g. Beholders, Mind Flayers, Aboleths, etc.
Mundane-seeming problems like 'where does the wood come from' find far too little recognition in fiction in general. I love details like that, but I can see how many people just don't care and would find a two-page passage about the difficulties of surface-wood trading boring and irrelevant. Sometimes you can weave it in casually, like e.g. mentioning things that would 'ordinarily' be wood be something else, but that's often too veiled and/or not detailed enough. Tough writing!