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I personally think expansions should focus on BG2 and not BG1 because...

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  • Dev6,

    Vampire The Masquerade Redemption, I just could never get through it was it was mindless combat. Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines is very replayable as there's stories and moral choices. The first half of Bloodlines is more interesting than the end and there's a guy who keeps developing it for free long after the game company went out of business. http://www.moddb.com/mods/vtmb-unofficial-patch
    The vampire stories are good for games. Also the game has faery/changeling story stuff in it that were never made into games.

    For BG2, well I guess yeah I don't think much plots can be added then. Though I do enjoy playing where there's a high-level mage battle. It's basically where combat is basically a whole tactical battle of this spell followed by that and such instead of hack and slash. Now real actual fighting with a melee weapon is extremely complex but you need specialized equipment to even try to put the actual movements into a game (Nintendo Wii, Microsoft Kinect stuff) and even then a person who is skilled can be really good at simply level 1 by their own fencing ability.


    I played Icewind Dale and got bored of it as too much mindless combat. The most interesting bit was the priestess of Auril part and later I just got bored. Then Icewind Dale 2 was even more mindless combat and even worse monks even at level 20 (or whatever it was) and beyond should be immune to normal weapons but the game just made it only subtract 20 (or something) off the damage. Well 3rd edition rules changed things.



    Dev6
  • Oh and Bloodlines had the famous Santa Monica pier done realistically in the game in a big area you go through and you return there at several points. Whenever I see a pic of that famous pier such as on TV I am reminded of it in the game. The game didn't quite get it right as they have a parking garage when in reality there's an open area parking lot but otherwise they spent a lot of time doing very detailed fancy decorations.

    Dev6
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,181
    We NEED something in BG2 to close the lingering plot threads of SoD. I would also love some quest expansions for ToB. Maybe something giving a personal quest to all the npcs, or a TotSC like expansion. BG1 and SoA are packed so full that there isn't much that can be added without ruining the level and loot curve even more.

    Dev6
  • Dev6Dev6 Member Posts: 719
    ThacoBell said:

    We NEED something in BG2 to close the lingering plot threads of SoD.

    I momentarily forgot about that.
    LET'S RESCUE CAELAR FROM HELL GUYS! (Screw Skie being stuck in the soultaker dagger, noone cares about Skie :P )

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,181
    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    We NEED something in BG2 to close the lingering plot threads of SoD.

    I momentarily forgot about that.
    LET'S RESCUE CAELAR FROM HELL GUYS! (Screw Skie being stuck in the soultaker dagger, noone cares about Skie :P )
    Lets drag Caelar from hell to bring her to task for her villainy.

  • Dev6Dev6 Member Posts: 719
    ThacoBell said:

    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    We NEED something in BG2 to close the lingering plot threads of SoD.

    I momentarily forgot about that.
    LET'S RESCUE CAELAR FROM HELL GUYS! (Screw Skie being stuck in the soultaker dagger, noone cares about Skie :P )
    Lets drag Caelar from hell to bring her to task for her villainy.
    Caelar was merely misguided. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" as they say.
    If you think Sarevok can be redeemed then I fail to see why Caelar can't.

  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,181
    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    We NEED something in BG2 to close the lingering plot threads of SoD.

    I momentarily forgot about that.
    LET'S RESCUE CAELAR FROM HELL GUYS! (Screw Skie being stuck in the soultaker dagger, noone cares about Skie :P )
    Lets drag Caelar from hell to bring her to task for her villainy.
    Caelar was merely misguided. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" as they say.
    If you think Sarevok can be redeemed then I fail to see why Caelar can't.
    She can, but first she needs to recognize that her actions were unambiguously WRONG. Even at the end of SoD, she plays the self righteous card and has no care for the large scale murder and destruction she caused. She was never made to own her actions. SHE KILLED MORE PEOPLE THAN SAREVOK DID DURING THE MAIN STORY.

  • Dev6Dev6 Member Posts: 719
    ThacoBell said:

    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    We NEED something in BG2 to close the lingering plot threads of SoD.

    I momentarily forgot about that.
    LET'S RESCUE CAELAR FROM HELL GUYS! (Screw Skie being stuck in the soultaker dagger, noone cares about Skie :P )
    Lets drag Caelar from hell to bring her to task for her villainy.
    Caelar was merely misguided. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" as they say.
    If you think Sarevok can be redeemed then I fail to see why Caelar can't.
    She can, but first she needs to recognize that her actions were unambiguously WRONG. Even at the end of SoD, she plays the self righteous card and has no care for the large scale murder and destruction she caused. She was never made to own her actions. SHE KILLED MORE PEOPLE THAN SAREVOK DID DURING THE MAIN STORY.
    Charname killed more people than Sarevok did during the main story!

    Fardragon
  • Dev6 said:

    Charname killed more people than Sarevok did during the main story!


    Which is why the player character got to take over the lord of murder's place. Though I wonder how The Lord of Murder would be as a Good-aligned god. Perhaps helping to solve murder? Assisted suicide, intruding on Ilmater's domain?

  • UnderstandMouseMagicUnderstandMouseMagic Member Posts: 2,147
    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    Dev6 said:

    ThacoBell said:

    We NEED something in BG2 to close the lingering plot threads of SoD.

    I momentarily forgot about that.
    LET'S RESCUE CAELAR FROM HELL GUYS! (Screw Skie being stuck in the soultaker dagger, noone cares about Skie :P )
    Lets drag Caelar from hell to bring her to task for her villainy.
    Caelar was merely misguided. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" as they say.
    If you think Sarevok can be redeemed then I fail to see why Caelar can't.
    She can, but first she needs to recognize that her actions were unambiguously WRONG. Even at the end of SoD, she plays the self righteous card and has no care for the large scale murder and destruction she caused. She was never made to own her actions. SHE KILLED MORE PEOPLE THAN SAREVOK DID DURING THE MAIN STORY.
    Charname killed more people than Sarevok did during the main story!
    Did they?

    Sarevok was responsible for a lot of deaths.

    All those killed by the bandit raids, the miners, the slaves, all those taken over by dopplegangers. It's a pretty long list and that's before a war.

  • Yes, well, all those xvarts add up, you know.

    Pantalion
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,181
    @Dev6 Well, my charname didn't kill anyone that didn't attack them first. They fought for survival and to protect others. Caelar didn't care who died in her fervor to rescue one man.

    @UnderstandMouseMagic He sure was, but as many people were killed by bandits hired by him etc. Caelar depopulated entire towns and actually enacted a war (which was Sarevok's unfulfilled wish). Caelar's crusade killed many more people than a couple dozen bandit raids and some missing miners.

  • UnderstandMouseMagicUnderstandMouseMagic Member Posts: 2,147
    edited November 2017
    ThacoBell said:

    @Dev6 Well, my charname didn't kill anyone that didn't attack them first. They fought for survival and to protect others. Caelar didn't care who died in her fervor to rescue one man.

    @UnderstandMouseMagic He sure was, but as many people were killed by bandits hired by him etc. Caelar depopulated entire towns and actually enacted a war (which was Sarevok's unfulfilled wish). Caelar's crusade killed many more people than a couple dozen bandit raids and some missing miners.

    CA is so goddamm awful I pretend she never existed. :)

    It's been hard but rinsing that dreadful character, (bad voice acting, bad writing, stupid motivations, boring, boring, boring self aggrandisment speeches) out of my brain has been a long and difficult task.

    If they dare to import that travesty to BG2 they had better make it optional. >:)

    MakeAthkatlaGrtAgain
  • PantalionPantalion Member Posts: 2,137
    CHARNAME was so effective at murder that Doppelgangers only changed to have a "Very Rare" encounter rate after the events of BG1.

    ThacoBelltbone1
  • unavailableunavailable Member Posts: 265
    No. Real time with pause and high level shenannigans do not mix. It's okay to have a million tactical decisions per minute if the game is turn based and is named xcom, but stutter stepping 6 characters around as they fight 6 or more enemies with aoes all over the place with their weapons, and wands and scrolls and potions and magic is fucking boring.

  • RedrakeRedrake Member Posts: 424
    About 15 years ago, back on the days of BIS and Interplay boards there was a rumor of BG3 being in connection with the other dead three gods, especially Bane. At that point there was a setting books that told a short story about the son of Bane, Yachtu Xvim and his ascension to take his father's place as God of Hate.

    The rumors circulated around this possible avenue for a plot in BG3.

  • Dev6Dev6 Member Posts: 719
    @ThacoBell One could argue how many of those deaths should actually be attributed to Hephernaan's influence. Was Caelar entirely aware of the evil she was causing in her quest for good? And if she wasn't, then is she really to blame? I think Caelar is a bit of a gray character, which is why I enjoy her.
    As for charname, at the very least you killed many many bandits. We could argue back and forth if killing bandits is good or bad, but it's still a human life that's being taken which was my point.

    @UnderstandMouseMagic I can do nothing but disagree with you. But I guess that's the beauty of BG games, people enjoy them for entirely different reasons.

  • @Dev6

    Caelar is supposed to be good-aligned. Not that alignment as a concept is without issues. Helping others means that you help some others but not all others. It's like if you're in a primitive human village far north and it's a freezing winter, you will destroy a forest for firewood to save them from freezing and that's supposed to be good because you helped others but you harmed one group of beings to save another even if you did it for no personal gain.

    Dev6ThacoBell
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,181
    The thing that I took away from Caelar, was that she was a mirror to charname in a way similar to Sarevok. But while Sarevok was a dark mirror, Caelar was a light one. Not in the sense that she pursued a good end, but that even a good charname can fall. She had divine blood and belonged to a paladin order, her fatal flaw was arrogance. She thought that because of her ties to the order, and her celestial blood, that she MUST be right and just. Whatever she desired, it was right, and she could not be wrong. Because she was, by nature, just, then she could justify any action to herself. And she did. Whole towns burned, hundreds slaughtered, and she was manipulated by a major devil/demon (I honestly can't keep them straight), but she didn't care. None of it mattered, because all she cared about was her end goal.

    SoD was a commentary on nature vs. individual action. Caelar, despite being good, caused evil and great pain. Yet even at the very end, she refused to acknowledge it. Even to the end, she believed she was RIGHT.

    Dev6PantalionArctodus
  • Dev6Dev6 Member Posts: 719
    edited November 2017
    Well at the very least we can both agree that Caelar should be brought back in BG2, even if for different reasons. :) I really enjoyed reading that post btw.

    ThacoBell
  • ThacoBellThacoBell Member Posts: 12,181
    She is for sure a VERY interesting character.

    Dev6
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