Xzar and Montaron
Bombur
Member Posts: 7
I picked them up early because without them that assassin at friendly arm inn would slaughter me.
Since my char is good, I should really dump them at some point. However question is when? Montaron is great with his sling and xzar is a Mage. My main concern is losing a Mage. I currently building up my party before we hit the Nashkel Mines and I've seen quite a few recruitable NPCs, but any recommendations to replace Xzar?
Since my char is good, I should really dump them at some point. However question is when? Montaron is great with his sling and xzar is a Mage. My main concern is losing a Mage. I currently building up my party before we hit the Nashkel Mines and I've seen quite a few recruitable NPCs, but any recommendations to replace Xzar?
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Pre-Nashkel, you'll have the option of grabbing Neera, or teaming up with Minsc and getting Dynaheir. Edwin is also available and noticeably more powerful than Xzar, but he's also evil. You could also simply do Nashke Mines without a Mage, it's not like they're powerful enough at such a low level to really matter much.
Montaron is a solid NPC, but hardly unique. There are TONS of thieves throughout the game, and unless you ditched Imoen, Montaron brings nothing unique to the table.
Wut? Mages are great in BG1! If what you are doing is comparing them to what they can do in BG2 then I can see why you would think that. But they have plenty of pluses in BG1. Such as having 75% of the offensive spells in the game and 95% of the good offensive spells in the game. They also have about 30% of the defensive spells in the game but about 75% of the really good defensive spells in the game. Sure they may not be as powerful as warrior classes but they certainly have the advantage over all the other classes in BG1. Clerics and, even more so, druids on the other hand have very little to offer other than healing.
it's incredibly effective
I was planning to get Minsc as he seems to be popular, so sounds like I should seek out Dynaheir as well.
Neera is useless, sorry but its right, with low HP and Inteligence 17 is not so good, and also 5% chance that spell what she used will be disaster(trust me 99% is) like enemy demons, or kill all of your parry or slow you ect.
Second best choice is Dynatheir, int 17, con 16 and bonus Minsc with Boo. And I have to disagree with OP mages in BG1. 1 good archer with magic arrows(fire or frost enough) and your mage go to hell.
Also, Dynaheir has Slow Potion. That frees a spell slot for the cleric, which makes up a bit for having fewer spells than Edwin. She can cast the most important things at that level, unlike Xan. And let's face it, for a pretty long time, it doesn't really matter if Edwin has 1 magic missile more or less; he will run out of spells like every other mage before a longer battle is over and has to use sling or quarterstaff. His high con is the real advantage on lower levels (compared to the squishies Xzar and Xan). And Dynaheir has the same con, so nothing is lost.
Take Xzar, just for banter, also he can be useful as mage/cleric (tome of wisdom) ...also clerics can wear helmets
(beware, tvtropes! you only have yourself to blame if after clicking, few hours of your life suddenly disappear)
for added fun, bring Jaheira and Khalid with 'em [diabolical laughter]
(no, don't. it'll end... badly, and carrying around those two useless sacks of meat makes no sense)
mages are also buttclenchingly powerful all throughout the Baldur's Gate saga, and you're best off with 2 on them - Edwin is a nice addition, so is Neera. powerwise, it looks something like this: Edwin > Neera > Xzar > anyone else > retarded gibberling > Dynaheir.
translation: no sleep. no emotion. no chaos. (and that sounded like some bullshit movie slogan) to a lesser degree, no charm person, dire charm, or domination. basically all the best spells in BGEE *are enchantment spells*.
long story short, Dynaheir is fucking useless.
another major problem is the fact that lvl 4 has two good offensive spells, confusion and emotion, and both are - you guessed it, enchantment. same goes for lvl 5.
I'm sorry, but with her opposition school and ye olde butcherede englishe, there is little that can be done for poor little Dynaheir.
Xan is actually pretty easy to use imho, he has all the important stuff (skull trap instead fireball... or, y'know, use slow), only thing missing is chromatic orb. for a good aligned party, I'd also stick to Imoen as a mage, though the lack of specialization for dual classes (at least in BGEE) is a shame.
That said, I usually play evil, so there is no question what mages I use. I don't think I ever completed a game with Dynaheir or Xan, so I can only speak in theory and from looking at their schools and abilities. (Neera sounds pretty unreliable in theory, though entertaining.) I just know that I wouldn't recommend a beginner to play a mixed alignment party because managing reputation is something that does spoil the first run. I remember how frustrated I was when Kagain just left in my first game somewhere in chapter 5 and I had no clue why, if I could get him back or where to get a new tank.
I believe it is just a matter of play style.
For instance, I don't rely so much on enchantment spells. Actually never liked the school and the only reason I use enchantment spells at all is that they are insanely overpowered in BG, but even so I mostly use just sleep at the lower levels.
About the 4th level spells, I think there are so many good alternatives (Stoneskin, Fireshield, Polymorph Self, Improved Invisibility, etc.) and too few spell slots to memorise all of them. Yes, they are all defensive spells, but I don't see anything wrong with that, you will still have plenty of offensive spells from the other levels to choose from.
That's not to say mages are useless. Far from it, and I would never consider running a party without one. I'm mostly speaking to the OP's apparent feelings that mages are some sort of overpowering force that should never be left behind. Xzar is a perfectly serviceable party member, but he's nothing uniquely special, especially since you get him at level 1.
She is your only choice of good alignet vanilla mages. (Edwin and Xzar are the best mages in the game and both evil...)
And if you're new to the game, I highly DON'T recommend to take Xan - you will probably be dissapointed in mages, he has no magic missile, fireballs, chrom orbs and more MAIN attacking spells. It doesn't meant that he is a bad or weak npc - he is a debuffer. No pew pew!
My comment was not to be taken too seriously.
Nevertheless, I still believe that you're largely underestimating the mage potential in BG1/BGEE, especially, as you say, in ending contest.
Don't let fool yourself by how weak are the enemy mages, at least in vanilla BG1 or BGEE. That's because of limitations in the AI scripts. There are mods that make fighting mages much more challenging even in BG1. Moreover, a mage controlled by an experienced user that knows when and how to use the appropriate spells, that's a totally different matter.
However, it would be pointless, and even a bit childish, to discuss the outcome of a hypothetical challenge between a mage and a archer, because it will depend on too many factors (build, gear, etc.), the most important being imho the chance related to the roll of the dices.