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Ranged Weapon Prof. and extra Attacks bugged?

BerengarBerengar Member Posts: 8
edited February 2013 in Fixed
Heya,

I was wondering whether I'm mixing something up or if there's a new bug in the game, introduced by the new patch.

If you create an archer and give him two pips in longbow, shouldn't that mean, that he now has 5/2 attacks at level 1, with a longbow or composite longbow plus arrows equipped and no other buffs active/items equipped?

From what I know, it should be the regular 1 APR which every character has, +1 APR because it's a bow and +1/2 APR because of weapon specialisation. If you just equip a longbow/comp bow without any arrows the char screen states 3/2 APR, but as soon as you equip some arrows it changes to 2 APR. Am I missing something?
Post edited by Jalily on
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Comments

  • seawiedseawied Member Posts: 24
    edited January 2013
    wrong section, sorry.
    Post edited by Jalily on
  • HeroicSpurHeroicSpur Member Posts: 907
    @Seawied: ranged weapons have rate of fire limitations. I believe crossbows only fire once per round (bows 2x per round, darts 3x). That would however conflict with the grandmastery description.
  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,853
    edited January 2013
    I'm having a very similar problem. 4 pips in Long Bows and 2 APR. I even tried equipping a Short Bow (which I'm entirely unproficient in) for comparison. Sure enough, same 2 APR. Seems like a new bug.

    And this guy is having the same problem with Crossbows: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/14536/new-bug-grand-mastery-of-crossbows-does-not-add-any-attacks
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    Bugs like this should not be getting introduced in patches, this isn't something small that can go unnoticed.
  • WanderonWanderon Member Posts: 1,418
    Same here - level 5 archer with 3 pips in longbow - 2 attacks with composite longbow +1
  • SharnSharn Member Posts: 188
    edited January 2013
    I am going to check in on this later and hope there is some kind of official answer as to if this is a bug or intentional as some seem to think, some kind of confirmation would be nice.

    If this is intentional then the archer kits usefulness gets bumped down from marginally useful to completely useless. A change this large should have appeared in the patch notes if it was not a bug, and if its a bug it should be fixed quickly, as in not a month from now, as it severely diminishes the usefulness of several classes and destroys the archer kit as a viable choice for a player.
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 8,268
    edited January 2013
    I just noticed this too. I made a fighter with 4 pips in sling and he had a measly 1 attack per round :(
    This is the kind of bug that needs an IMMEDIATE fix! Like, a patch needs to be made ASAP just to fix this critical bug.

    Edit: Yeah. This bug kinda ruins the whole game for me. I'm going to play BG2 until it is fixed. Don't get me wrong. I appreciate the hard work and love BG:EE and all, but until a fix I just can't play it.
    Post edited by Tresset on
  • JuliusBorisovJuliusBorisov Member, Administrator, Moderator, Developer Posts: 22,758
    Well if you don't play an archer of a fighter with a bow this bug doesn't affect your gameplay at all.
  • TressetTresset Member, Moderator Posts: 8,268
    @bengoshi I worry it may affect my enemies as well. That would make the game less fun. Besides, I always have some ranged attacking warriors with me. Considering how many times I have seen ranged combat referenced on these forums as a major part of BG1; I imagine that there are a lot of people who this affects quite heavily.
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    bengoshi said:

    Well if you don't play an archer of a fighter with a bow this bug doesn't affect your gameplay at all.

    It affects sling users too (e.g. Montaron)

  • CerevantCerevant Member Posts: 2,314
    I can confirm that this changed between 2011 and 2012. I'll report this in the tracker and see if I can find out if the change was intentional (and if so, why).
  • James_MJames_M Member Posts: 145
    Hey man, Update 6 has reduced Attacks per round with Slings for Jaheira who has 2 pips in Slings (**). Prior to Update 6 she had 1½ att/rnd and now only has 1 att/rnd. I don't like that ;-( (In BG1 she had 1½ att/rnd, too, with Slings**.) Please revert for this point. Cheers
  • CerevantCerevant Member Posts: 2,314
    This has been confirmed and reported in the tracker.
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    James_M said:

    Hey man, Update 6 has reduced Attacks per round with Slings for Jaheira who has 2 pips in Slings (**). Prior to Update 6 she had 1½ att/rnd and now only has 1 att/rnd. I don't like that ;-( (In BG1 she had 1½ att/rnd, too, with Slings**.) Please revert for this point. Cheers

    It's not just slings, it seems the latest patch has nerfed (whether deliberately, or otherwise) most, if not all, missile weapons, see: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/14559/ranged-weapon-prof-and-extra-attacks-bugged#latest
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    BTW it seems that hasted ranged weapons don't currently receive and extra attack now either, but melee weapons do, if still not the right amount (see: http://forum.baldursgate.com/discussion/comment/235847#Comment_235847 ), now that definitely *is* a bug and makes me think that the lack of extra ranged attacks from proficiency/fighter levels in the current patch may be linked to a common problem which prevents ranged weapons getting extra attacks
  • WilburWilbur Member Posts: 1,173
    I really wish someone would quickly confirm if this was an intentional change or a bug.
  • ZanathKariashiZanathKariashi Member Posts: 2,869
    You can't even say it's an attempt to bring things closer to PnP since slings benefit from both specialization and warrior level extra attacks.

    Technically only bows shouldn't get any extra attacks, and crossbows should only get the the warrior level based ones (total of 2 for light, 1.5 for heavy).

    And throwing daggers and darts are supposed to get a full extra attack for specialization, GM, and warrior levels 7 and 13. (total of 6 and 7 respectively), they've been screwed for years. And the current state makes it worse.
  • pakbgeepakbgee Member Posts: 31
    Please fix the damn thing, haste won't even work on range attack.
  • AntverpiaAntverpia Member Posts: 5
    Devs, please give us an answer....
  • DalrykDalryk Member Posts: 35
    Come on, what's the story here?

    Anybody with any sort of ranged character is waiting the outcome of this discussion. Have they been deliberately nerfed to the point that we might as well give em up and start again, or is this an inadvertent error that's going to be fixed???
  • hansolohansolo Member Posts: 136
    edited January 2013
    It would be a very strange move if overhaul would put such an uncalled for balance change into the game without even mentioning it in the patch notes.
    I hope it gets fixed soon.
  • TheCoffeeGodTheCoffeeGod Member Posts: 618
    I'll repost this, since it was posted in another thread.
    Aosaw said:

    Sorry, everyone; there were...other issues that required my attention. I may have lost a bet with an eleven-year-old, and may have to wear a dress and ride an imaginary unicorn a week from Sunday in front of the whole school.

    The answer from the team is that this is in fact a bug, which means it should be fixed in the next patch. There's no need to report it any more than has already been done; the developers are aware of it and working on a fix.

    There was some good speculation in this thread, though, about why it might have been the case, and some good theories about whether or not it was a good thing. But anyway, there's the answer. Only a day and a half late; that's mostly my own fault.

    Well. Mine, and a certain eleven-year-old.


  • WilburWilbur Member Posts: 1,173
    It looks like my archer will take some time off drinking in Feldepost's Inn.
    Time to start my first bard MC. :)
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    Wilbur said:

    It looks like my archer will take some time off drinking in Feldepost's Inn.
    Time to start my first bard MC. :)

    Yeah, go Bard! So - which kit? Am having lots of fun with my Jester...

  • WilburWilbur Member Posts: 1,173
    Oxford_Guy said:

    Wilbur said:

    It looks like my archer will take some time off drinking in Feldepost's Inn.
    Time to start my first bard MC. :)

    Yeah, go Bard! So - which kit? Am having lots of fun with my Jester...

    I haven't decided yet actually. How good is the Jester's song in BG:EE?
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    edited January 2013
    Wilbur said:

    Oxford_Guy said:

    Wilbur said:

    It looks like my archer will take some time off drinking in Feldepost's Inn.
    Time to start my first bard MC. :)

    Yeah, go Bard! So - which kit? Am having lots of fun with my Jester...

    I haven't decided yet actually. How good is the Jester's song in BG:EE?
    It depends how you use it, making the Jester Invisible makes a big difference to it's usefulness - walk him/her around a bunch of red-circles and watch them beat the crap out of each other... Also confused spell-casters don't cast.

    "Softening-up" potential difficult targets with Save-reducing spells like Doom (and later the awesome Greater Malison) can help as does Glitterdust, for enemies that fail that save (as it reduces future saves by -4, I think), which incidentally the Dust Mephit Familiar that Neutral Evil gets can cast once a day (plus Glass Dust twice a day) - guess which alignment my Jester is? :-)

    BTW Jester Song ignores magic resistance (which is great!) and improves with levels like this:

    The Jester's song does not help allies. Instead, every opponent within 30 feet must save once per round to avoid falling under its effects:

    1st level: Enemies must save vs. Spell with a +2 bonus or be confused.
    15th level: Enemies must save vs. Spell with a +2 bonus or be confused, and must save vs. Spell or be slowed.
    20th level: Enemies must save vs. Spell with a +2 bonus or be confused, Spell with a +2 bonus or be knocked unconscious, and must save vs. Spell or be slowed.

    i.e. at 15th level there's two things each enemy has to make a save against each round, three things at level 20. BTW the Enhanced Bard Song HLA (which is more like "Enhanced Skald Song") which becomes available at 3 million XP (24th level) replaces the Jester's Song, if chosen as an HLA

    Jester does not have Lore or Pickpockets nerfed at all, unlike Skald and Blade, "which is nice", though is less melee capable than either. I gave my Jester Scimitars and Darts as starting proficiencies.
    Post edited by Oxford_Guy on
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    pakbgee said:

    Please fix the damn thing, haste won't even work on range attack.

    and since launch it's only *partially* worked for melee attacks 3/2 or 5/2 attacks gets rounded up to 2 attacks and 3 attacks, respectively, instead of the correct 5/2 and 7/2 attacks...
  • WilburWilbur Member Posts: 1,173
    edited January 2013
    @Oxford_Guy

    That sound pretty cool, maybe I'll give it a try. Are the saving throws with a +2 bonus? In the manual it says:

    "The Jester's song does not help allies. Instead, it affects every opponent within 30 feet, and they must save vs. spell with a -4 penalty once per round or be confused."

    That does sound a bit too powerful.
  • Oxford_GuyOxford_Guy Member Posts: 3,729
    Wilbur said:

    @Oxford_Guy

    That sound pretty cool, maybe I'll give it a try. Are the saving throws with a +2 bonus? In the manual it says:

    "The Jester's song does not help allies. Instead, it affects every opponent within 30 feet, and they must save vs. spell with a -4 penalty once per round or be confused."

    That does sound a bit too powerful.

    The current manual is wrong, it's +2. The in-game text is now correct, though.
  • WilburWilbur Member Posts: 1,173
    Oxford_Guy said:

    Wilbur said:

    @Oxford_Guy

    That sound pretty cool, maybe I'll give it a try. Are the saving throws with a +2 bonus? In the manual it says:

    "The Jester's song does not help allies. Instead, it affects every opponent within 30 feet, and they must save vs. spell with a -4 penalty once per round or be confused."

    That does sound a bit too powerful.

    The current manual is wrong, it's +2. The in-game text is now correct, though.
    Yes, that does make more sense :)

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