The BG1 character models are better in most ways--unmirrored, greater detail, more animation frames--but in the one way that matters for BG:EE, they fall perilously short: they don't support dual-wielding.
and there's no way for beamdog to be able to add dual wielding animations to the bg1 models?
To be honest I don't view the hurdle of having to create original artwork as a good excuse for that. They created bomb-ass shields that quite possibly fit the BG1 art style better than the original shields did, no? So why can they not add dual-wielding animations? Sure, character animations are a little more difficult than shields, but I don't think it's *that* big of a stretch.
I really just think almost everyone at Overhaul didn't care about preserving the spirit of Baldur's Gate 1. The new NPCs make it extremely clear that they have been playing TuTu far too long and have forgotten what BG1 was like in spirit. They captured BGII's feel very well, but it's BG1, not BGII...
Ummm, could any moderator save this topic from its apparent derailment? I am quite interested in news or tidbits about when BG2:EE might be released. I have zero interest in arguments about whether EE is better than the original, as such discussions have been done to death.
My apologies to the debaters. But I really think you should start your own topic, and leave a simple topic about BG2:EE news alone.
To be honest I don't view the hurdle of having to create original artwork as a good excuse for that. They created bomb-ass shields that quite possibly fit the BG1 art style better than the original shields did, no? So why can they not add dual-wielding animations? Sure, character animations are a little more difficult than shields, but I don't think it's *that* big of a stretch.
I tweeted Trent Oster about this (BG2:EE release) the other day and he seemed confident that it would be on all platforms (PC, iPad, and Android) this year. Considering that the tablet versions will probably be released after the PC version hits, maybe end of summer isn't that far off of an estimate.
I for sure look forward to BGII:EE. I was quite content with playing a whole lot of BG:EE, then I managed to create a character that I *really* liked and he's done with BG:EE now, so ... =P
To be honest I don't view the hurdle of having to create original artwork as a good excuse for that. They created bomb-ass shields that quite possibly fit the BG1 art style better than the original shields did, no? So why can they not add dual-wielding animations? Sure, character animations are a little more difficult than shields, but I don't think it's *that* big of a stretch.
Are you talking about the 1PP shields?
I thought 1PP only affected inventory paper dolls?
If I'm mistaken, then yes, I probably mean the 1PP shields.
To change the character animations there are two options: 1) Hand draw every single frame (This is how the shield were added and its a massive effort) 2) Redo all character animation from scratch
I don't see either of these happening. After all, Baldur's Gate games are not really that much about graphics. The effort simply is not worth it. It doesn't add anything significant for the game.
To be honest I don't view the hurdle of having to create original artwork as a good excuse for that. They created bomb-ass shields that quite possibly fit the BG1 art style better than the original shields did, no? So why can they not add dual-wielding animations? Sure, character animations are a little more difficult than shields, but I don't think it's *that* big of a stretch.
I really just think almost everyone at Overhaul didn't care about preserving the spirit of Baldur's Gate 1. The new NPCs make it extremely clear that they have been playing TuTu far too long and have forgotten what BG1 was like in spirit. They captured BGII's feel very well, but it's BG1, not BGII...
I'm hoping theres more to come as far as "preserving the BG1 spirit (as opposed to 2)" is concerned, in the form of mods or patches. I dont think theyve done a bad job and Im at least glad they managed to get BG1 style shields and helmets in there.
Though as coriander says, this is actually from 1pp as opposed to the devs themselves.
I assume no, because the art assets were all lost and BG's art was 3D modelled and then cast into 2D, so with the loss of the 3D assets they're kinda floating in the water.
The BG1 character models are better in most ways--unmirrored, greater detail, more animation frames
How exactly do the old BG1 models have more animation frames? At most, I could discern 3 frames per animation sequence which made certain attacks look clunky, while BG2 models look like they have smoother animations, perhaps only lacking in some "oomph" but definitely not lacking in frames.
hey @Coriander, are you guys looking at improving the spell icon graphics in the spell book? long story short- they're pixelated and ugly. more than that, if you pick up a spell scroll in your inventory (click it and let it float), you're treated to a spell icon that is the same size as the one in the spell book, but much higher resolution.
Except for the bustiness and stature of the female Fighter and the way elf and half-elf Clerics looked in plate mail, I could not stand the BG1 vanilla sprites, especially human male fighters in plate. Tell me about more animation frames and "more detail" all you want, but BG2's character sprites are infinitely superior in my book. I didn't like shields, chain/splint mail, and helmets in BG2, so as far as I'm concerned they combined the best of both worlds then sprinkled in some 1PP.
Except for the bustiness and stature of the female Fighter and the way elf and half-elf Clerics looked in plate mail, I could not stand the BG1 vanilla sprites, especially human male fighters in plate. Tell me about more animation frames and "more detail" all you want, but BG2's character sprites are infinitely superior in my book. I didn't like shields, chain/splint mail, and helmets in BG2, so as far as I'm concerned they combined the best of both worlds then sprinkled in some 1PP.
It's not about which you prefer, it's about respecting the art style of the respective games ... BG1 sprites would look awful in BGII, and vice versa.
I like BG1 human fighter sprites more than BG2, they look more beefier and have shoulder plates, the BG2 ones look like they have somekind of spacesuit on and the helmets look like crap !
This is, quite true, you won't play BG for the graphics, but if you see how painful it was to create the graphics for this game, and how time consuming it is to even alter them a bit, you'd have to think "why is it so damn hard if graphics don't matter?"
Yeah it's not about the graphics for sure. But BG, instead of hand drawn graphics, used 3D models made into 2D with the dreaded "BAMing", i am sure some people still have nightmares over the procedure.
@Schneidend i like human male fighters in BG2 graphics as well, but i think that, although they look fine from the waist up, their legs look really weird in some angles. With good enough imagination and some nice armor colors though, i can take it.
BG1 models can't dual wield anyway. The time it would take if it was possible to make them dual wield, would be much longer than "cleaning" up the sprites of BG2 so they look better.
Well, if someone (officially) was able to "clean up" the BG2 sprites in some areas, like the 1pp mod did, it would be ace. 1PP didn't touch human male fighters, and they could use some touches from the waist down.
Also, @Luigirules, i'll try to be more elaborate so you don't feel "Abused" -_-
So, the game cannot look better because the art assets were lost and thus, art is the same. Believing it looks better is ok, fine even, but BG2 looking like "an absolute pile of garbage next to bg:ee", must be the most absurd comment i ever read in here.
This is, quite true, you won't play BG for the graphics, but if you see how painful it was to create the graphics for this game, and how time consuming it is to even alter them a bit, you'd have to think "why is it so damn hard if graphics don't matter?"
Yeah it's not about the graphics for sure. But BG, instead of hand drawn graphics, used 3D models made into 2D with the dreaded "BAMing", i am sure some people still have nightmares over the procedure.
@Schneidend i like human male fighters in BG2 graphics as well, but i think that, although they look fine from the waist up, their legs look really weird in some angles. With good enough imagination and some nice armor colors though, i can take it.
BG1 models can't dual wield anyway. The time it would take if it was possible to make them dual wield, would be much greater than "cleaning" up the sprites of BG2 so they look better.
Well, if someone (officially) was able to "clean up" the BG2 sprites in some areas, like the 1pp mod did, it would be ace. 1PP didn't touch human male fighters, and they could use some touches from the waist down.
Also, @Luigirules, i'll try to be more elaborate so you don't feel "Abused" -_-
So, the game cannot look better because the art assets were lost and thus, art is the same. Believing it looks better is ok, fine even, but BG2 looking like "an absolute pile of garbage next to bg:ee", must be the most absurd comment i ever read in here.
The 3rd party widescreen mods while adequate before bg:ee, hurt my eyes by comparrison. The colours are amazing in bg:ee, I don't know what filtering they did but things look nice and clean and bright. Did they not improve the sound as well? No loading screens etc ... it's much better if you take the time and compare.
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I really just think almost everyone at Overhaul didn't care about preserving the spirit of Baldur's Gate 1. The new NPCs make it extremely clear that they have been playing TuTu far too long and have forgotten what BG1 was like in spirit. They captured BGII's feel very well, but it's BG1, not BGII...
My apologies to the debaters. But I really think you should start your own topic, and leave a simple topic about BG2:EE news alone.
I dunno, maybe it's too late.
@Coridander I thought 1PP only affected inventory paper dolls?
If I'm mistaken, then yes, I probably mean the 1PP shields.
1) Hand draw every single frame (This is how the shield were added and its a massive effort)
2) Redo all character animation from scratch
I don't see either of these happening. After all, Baldur's Gate games are not really that much about graphics. The effort simply is not worth it. It doesn't add anything significant for the game.
Though as coriander says, this is actually from 1pp as opposed to the devs themselves.
toss us a bone!
Yeah it's not about the graphics for sure. But BG, instead of hand drawn graphics, used 3D models made into 2D with the dreaded "BAMing", i am sure some people still have nightmares over the procedure.
@Schneidend i like human male fighters in BG2 graphics as well, but i think that, although they look fine from the waist up, their legs look really weird in some angles. With good enough imagination and some nice armor colors though, i can take it.
BG1 models can't dual wield anyway. The time it would take if it was possible to make them dual wield, would be much longer than "cleaning" up the sprites of BG2 so they look better.
Well, if someone (officially) was able to "clean up" the BG2 sprites in some areas, like the 1pp mod did, it would be ace. 1PP didn't touch human male fighters, and they could use some touches from the waist down.
Also, @Luigirules, i'll try to be more elaborate so you don't feel "Abused" -_-
So, the game cannot look better because the art assets were lost and thus, art is the same. Believing it looks better is ok, fine even, but BG2 looking like "an absolute pile of garbage next to bg:ee", must be the most absurd comment i ever read in here.