Adding kits to multi-class and 2nd-choice-class dual?

mashedtaters

Is it at all possible?

For example, I start out as a fighter in BG. Then I decide to dual to a mage. However, I cannot dual to a wild mage because that is a kit. However, if I started out as a wild mage, and dualed to a fighter, that would work.

Another example: multi-class characters cannot gain any kit, even though dual class characters can (if they choose a kit at the beginning.) So I cannot be an assassin/cleric, or a wizard/priest of helm.

Is there any way to give the option to a multi-class character to choose a kit, ONLY 1, from either class?

Is it possible to allow dualed characters, who have NOT selected a kit for their first class, to choose a kit for their second class upon dualing?

Edvin

There is already dozen topics about that...
But it is really problem.

Only humans can have two profession and kit at same time.
So everyone play humans and making OP combinations.
With this advantage humans rule supreme... ( Drow cry )

ZanathKariashi

I wouldn't mind them restoring the ability to dual into mage specialists (they're actually a completely separate class from a vanilla mage, in the core books, which is why a single class PnP gnome can be a mage or an illusionist, but a multi-class gnome can only be an illusionist, not a plain mage (it takes more effort to be a normal mage for them since illusion magic comes so easily to them and splitting their attention between two paths of study prevents it)) (there are no actual mage Kits currently in the game...all of them, even the wild mage are specializations, not kits and could be taken in addition to a kit if done at creation, and otherwise meet the requirements of kit. (Most mage kits require access to certain schools, though not all)), like in original BG1.

Though the only multi-class kits allowed are the demi-human specific ones (none of which are in game), and are usually only accessible to one race (though elves and half-elves have shared access of a few).

smeagolheart

To revisit this thread, I'll throw out there again that in BG1 you could dual into a mage kit (ie necromancer or whatever from fighter).

mashedtaters

Does anyone know of a mod that makes it possible to take a Kit for your 2nd class, or multi-class?

smeagolheart

mashedtaters said:

Does anyone know of a mod that makes it possible to take a Kit for your 2nd class, or multi-class?

*Think* it's locked down from modding, game engine mechanics and whatnot. Shadowkeeper seems to be the only way.

Eudaemonium

You can use Shadowkeeper or NI to add a kit to the second class, but yeah, I think the interface is locked so it's not something mods can do at present.

Iecerint

Eudaemonium said:

You can use Shadowkeeper or NI to add a kit to the second class, but yeah, I think the interface is locked so it's not something mods can do at present.

mashedtaters

smeagolheart said:

mashedtaters said:

Does anyone know of a mod that makes it possible to take a Kit for your 2nd class, or multi-class?

*Think* it's locked down from modding, game engine mechanics and whatnot. Shadowkeeper seems to be the only way.

We're both mentioned in a movie???????? I feel so famous!!!!

pkmn

I'd hope they wouldn't do this. It would ruin the game's balance.

ZanathKariashi

Ok...after some more detailed reading, pg 52 of Complete Fighter (Complete fighter and complete mage are the only ones to mention this) says you can in fact take a kit when dual-classing (but not multi-classing, unless a race-specific kit says otherwise), but only if your first class was kit-less. (the creation part at the beginning of kit section meant you couldn't make a Fighter, and then decide a couple levels in you wanted to be a Berserker instead).

But yes, I do agree that allow multicass or double-kits is NOT the way things should go (the game is already too overpowered as is, and is in DIRE need of some "corrective" nerfs across the board) (multiclasses are already broken and either need to have their racial level caps reinstated (I wouldn't mind using the single class unlimited advancement optional rule for demi-humans) and/or un-nerf dual-classing (any combination of classes, so long as you meet the requirements but only one of each class pool (you'd still lose all abilities save for your newest class until it was your highest class as normal for dual-classing).

I would however like to see specialist mages become a distinct class (as they are in the core books and BG1 (original)), some actual mage kits added (even the wild mage is actually a specialist instead of a kit, just not a core book specialist), and dual-classes able to dual into a kit, if their original class was True-class. (that last one can be done in Shadow-keeper, but can be tricky getting the proper bonuses and penalties for certain classes till you play around with it a while)

Nifft

pkmn said:

I'd hope they wouldn't do this. It would ruin the game's balance.

Nah, it wouldn't be any worse than the Kensai > Mage, which already exists.

mashedtaters

I just think it would be awesome to have a fighter dualed to wild mage. That way if you blew yourself up, your odds of survival would be a little higher.

Eudaemonium

ZanathKariashi said:

Ok...after some more detailed reading, pg 52 of Complete Fighter (Complete fighter and complete mage are the only ones to mention this) says you can in fact take a kit when dual-classing (but not multi-classing, unless a race-specific kit says otherwise), but only if your first class was kit-less. (the creation part at the beginning of kit section meant you couldn't make a Fighter, and then decide a couple levels in you wanted to be a Berserker instead).

The Complete Thief book has this too, as does the Ninja one (since ninja appear to be a Thief type), according to my pdf files of the 2nd Edition books). I noticed that the Priest and Druid books don't mention this at all. The books also say that you have to RP it thoroughly.

But yeah, as far as I can tell you are legally permitted to dual into a kit in 2E, at least with certain classes (and Cleric is a bit odd, since the BG kits don't really seem to be 'kits' per se).

smeagolheart

Eudaemonium said:

ZanathKariashi said:

Ok...after some more detailed reading, pg 52 of Complete Fighter (Complete fighter and complete mage are the only ones to mention this) says you can in fact take a kit when dual-classing (but not multi-classing, unless a race-specific kit says otherwise), but only if your first class was kit-less. (the creation part at the beginning of kit section meant you couldn't make a Fighter, and then decide a couple levels in you wanted to be a Berserker instead).

The Complete Thief book has this too, as does the Ninja one (since ninja appear to be a Thief type), according to my pdf files of the 2nd Edition books). I noticed that the Priest and Druid books don't mention this at all. The books also say that you have to RP it thoroughly.

But yeah, as far as I can tell you are legally permitted to dual into a kit in 2E, at least with certain classes (and Cleric is a bit odd, since the BG kits don't really seem to be 'kits' per se).

@Eudaemonium

This got me thinking that maybe something like how in PST you can talk to people and run certain quests and attain classes that way would work for dual classed folks.

Hmmm... Kits attainable by quests..... It could be a similar thing like in BG2 how you do a quest you get a stronghold. In BG1 it could be do a quest, you could get offered a kit. That sounds pretty badass to me.

For example, a monk could meet a grand master monk or whatever and learn the art of the sun soul monk or whatever by fedexing a package to Nashkel or something. (haha low level quests are fedex type quests or rat hunting). So after three minor quests you are offered the option to pick a kit - if you don't have one already.

A fighter could meet a higher level dwarven battlerager in the the Jovial Juggler and eventually master the art of berserking.

I wish I could mod..

If overhaul had implemented something like that it would definitely be something to point to as an enhanced edition feature instead of just plopping the kits on top of BG1. Instead they could have offered the same classes as BG1 with optional quests to gain the BG2 kits.