I think we're making way too big a thing of this. Its fine the way the game works. It simplifies many details for playability, and that's fine.
But seriously, the Gold Box games (26 years ago) had a completely workable system for coinage that included encumbrance and multiple denominations of coin that worked with pretty minimal fuss. It was NOT that tedious or burdensome for the players. It was never a big deal. I thought it was worth a little complexity for the detail and atmosphere.
When you have the mule, you can carry far more than the party can normally and you won't have to worry much about encumbrance or roleplaying whether you can carry excess gold, equipment, or party members who may have died. When there is a melee and it is wounded, it runs off. But, you can signal it to come back afterwards. I don't view it as cheese because you have to haggle to buy the mule from its owner at the FAI, and it is expensive enough so a level 1 or 2 party is not likely to afford it. For adventurers, a packmule makes some sense and may add to the fun.
Of course not. I'm already being weighed down from the loot I collect off the dead. I can't be bothered by gold weight, not to mention that gold is a heavy metal.
I normally like this kind of idea, but theres no reason why the party should only be able to buy things with gold. Introducing Platinum currency, holdboxes, banks, gems as a portion of held wealth...
Basically, forcing me to only use gold and making me carry it around isn't more realistic, because it draws attention to the simplified economy. Not having a simplified economy would require a similar amount of work to say, a new Durlags Tower size level, and I know which I'd rather have.
Edit: And reasonably, I do most of my trading with like, 3 shops at most. Presumably when I sell them things I could just ask for credit. The shopkeep would be fine with that, because if I go and die hes quids in. Its not really possible to realistically model economic dealings in a game unless its central to the gameplay, so all this adds is busywork which doesn't actually add realism compared to me just imagining such explanations happening.
In PnP gold could be carried on the back of animals (mules, horses) we don't have any here, also gold would have to use a large amount of space to be kept, what can't be simulated in BG without compromising the game playability. Henchmans doesn't exist in the game and we can't trade items for items, only for gold (otherwise every party would try to trade gold for gems as a single diamond worth 500 gold pieces would be easier to carry than the 500 gp itself).
I believe that this is why banks and bank notes were invented. Besides, I presently have 100k gold with nothing to spend it on (since the good loot is, you know, found in dungeons...) so I'd probably donate it all to temples rather than lugging around 1000 pounds of gold but that leaves will leave evil parties literally unable to move under th weight of their accumulated riches.
Not having to worry about the encumbrance of gold pieces is an abstraction that works well with the game. This way, the game retains ease of play, and there is less distraction from the fantasy experience.
I don't see a reason for making gold management more realistic, since generally inventory system in games are always non-realistic at all. Even in BG. You can have 16 full plate armors in your backpack. Forget about actual size of said backpack and the fact that you might be crushed by weight of those 16 full plate armors...
It should not be imposed on everyone, certainly. But a mod that includes this, the pack mule, and anything else along the lines of basic resource management (eg, requiring food and water) could actually be very interesting (for me) in the ways that I play roleplay the game (when I roleplay). Anyway, gold encumbrance is fine for a mod, I think.
What's the point of adding something that makes the game more annoying or frustrating without actually changing the challenge or difficulty? Adding something that moves gameplay time away from quests/combat/dialogue and into inventory management of all things is completely pointless except for the people that enjoy games like Microsoft Access.
It should not be imposed on everyone, certainly. But a mod that includes this, the pack mule, and anything else along the lines of basic resource management (eg, requiring food and water) could actually be very interesting (for me) in the ways that I play roleplay the game (when I roleplay). Anyway, gold encumbrance is fine for a mod, I think.
For this work, and just to say i don't want this to work, i'm pretty fine with the way the system works about this atm, the game would need to get more acurrate with PnP style:
1° - Make gems be able to be used directly as gold (it could make 2 number sequences in the gold display, the first the current gold pieces, the liquid capacity of the player, and between "( )" at it's side, the value in gold of the sum of precious gems, the ones accepted directly in the market.
2° - make merchants trade precious gems for gold, and make the intelectual abilities of characters determine prices (wis, int, cha), to buy those gems.
3° - some stuff on the game would be payable with gems as gold and other stuff, the simple ones like pay an inn, drink, couldn't.
This is the base, and anything besides it will surely be boring and unreal, cos a packmule carring 30.000 gold with it would be the target of every bandit (and dragon) for miles.
This is the base, and anything besides it will surely be boring and unreal, cos a packmule carring 30.000 gold with it would be the target of every bandit (and dragon) for miles.
That is actually a great idea! If you have for example 100,000 gold perhaps you could attract a curious Dragon? Would that not be a fantastic Easter Egg?
How would the curious dragon get past the hordes of dwarves that would be following you around once they got a whiff of that gold?
Quite the opposite, I strongly believe the gold coins on Faerun are tiny black holes that subtract weight each piece you have, in other words, having 10 of them makes you lose 1 unit. Negative weight explained in a nutshell!
Actually, what they need is shopkeepers not having infinite gold.
Something like Skyrim (gasp) where they say:
"So, you gots for me a +5 Foozlebane and an Armor of the Incipent Saint of Inanities, do ya? I'll pay you all my 340 gold and throw in the family cow and my daughter's hand in marriage to boot."
I usually assume that basic needs (since your room fee at an inn includes both the room and your meal) are lumped into the fatigue penalty (Which would make a lot more sense if they used the IWD version of fatigue (which will WRECK YOUR WORLD if you don't rest within a couple hours of becoming fatigued, rather then the easily ignorable joke that is BG's fatigue).
I wouldn't mind gold having weight, as long as they added the ability to convert gold to platinum pieces (100>1) to help save weight, at certain places (fieldpost inn, is pretty high class and would likely have the funds needed), and BG of course, Friendly Arm might....and definitely several places in Amn or in trade-meet. Though after spellhold, it wouldn't matter anymore as you'd could just stick the pouch in the bag of holding.
And made them an actual inventory item that could be split up between party members.
ToEE included all 4 tiers of currency (Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum) as well as giving them weight and take inventory space, and that worked quite well, IMO.
This thread made me think of Ultima 7 Serpent Isle and what a pain in the arse the currency system was. I vastly prefer BGs system. Like a lot of things in D&D I prefer to think of currency as being abstract; ie, the party's gold is actually stored in A Beregost bank or something, but for simplicity it's on-hand
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But seriously, the Gold Box games (26 years ago) had a completely workable system for coinage that included encumbrance and multiple denominations of coin that worked with pretty minimal fuss. It was NOT that tedious or burdensome for the players. It was never a big deal. I thought it was worth a little complexity for the detail and atmosphere.
http://www.shsforums.net/topic/55998-mod-w-packmule-for-bgee/
When you have the mule, you can carry far more than the party can normally and you won't have to worry much about encumbrance or roleplaying whether you can carry excess gold, equipment, or party members who may have died. When there is a melee and it is wounded, it runs off. But, you can signal it to come back afterwards. I don't view it as cheese because you have to haggle to buy the mule from its owner at the FAI, and it is expensive enough so a level 1 or 2 party is not likely to afford it. For adventurers, a packmule makes some sense and may add to the fun.
Basically, forcing me to only use gold and making me carry it around isn't more realistic, because it draws attention to the simplified economy. Not having a simplified economy would require a similar amount of work to say, a new Durlags Tower size level, and I know which I'd rather have.
Edit: And reasonably, I do most of my trading with like, 3 shops at most. Presumably when I sell them things I could just ask for credit. The shopkeep would be fine with that, because if I go and die hes quids in. Its not really possible to realistically model economic dealings in a game unless its central to the gameplay, so all this adds is busywork which doesn't actually add realism compared to me just imagining such explanations happening.
This way, the game retains ease of play, and there is less distraction from the fantasy experience.
1° - Make gems be able to be used directly as gold (it could make 2 number sequences in the gold display, the first the current gold pieces, the liquid capacity of the player, and between "( )" at it's side, the value in gold of the sum of precious gems, the ones accepted directly in the market.
2° - make merchants trade precious gems for gold, and make the intelectual abilities of characters determine prices (wis, int, cha), to buy those gems.
3° - some stuff on the game would be payable with gems as gold and other stuff, the simple ones like pay an inn, drink, couldn't.
This is the base, and anything besides it will surely be boring and unreal, cos a packmule carring 30.000 gold with it would be the target of every bandit (and dragon) for miles.
Something like Skyrim (gasp) where they say:
"So, you gots for me a +5 Foozlebane and an Armor of the Incipent Saint of Inanities, do ya? I'll pay you all my 340 gold and throw in the family cow and my daughter's hand in marriage to boot."
Not for this game, but any future release it would be nice. Adds realism, gives reasons for precious gems and other artifacts.
I wouldn't mind gold having weight, as long as they added the ability to convert gold to platinum pieces (100>1) to help save weight, at certain places (fieldpost inn, is pretty high class and would likely have the funds needed), and BG of course, Friendly Arm might....and definitely several places in Amn or in trade-meet. Though after spellhold, it wouldn't matter anymore as you'd could just stick the pouch in the bag of holding.
And made them an actual inventory item that could be split up between party members.
ToEE included all 4 tiers of currency (Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum) as well as giving them weight and take inventory space, and that worked quite well, IMO.