@Night_Watch, as an evocation spell, Fireball should be "incertus, pulchra, imperio", unless you mean original, vanilla BG1. Actually, I had forgotten that that had different incantations. Shoot, there's more I need to try to look up.
@belgaramth yes i am talking about vanilla bg1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvqxxepCXPw it's at roughly the 5 second mark the mage starts chanting what i'm talking about. i didn't realize they changed the latin from bg1 to bg2 back then O.o
@Nightwatch, the audio quality there is poor, so I can barely hear it. I think the last word sounds like "mak", and the middle word sounds like "kaliah", or "kadiah". The first word is maybe "olm"? "Oulm, kadiah, mak", maybe. At least they started right out with the three-power-word incantation pattern, so we know we're looking for three words or phrases.
As I've said, it's really hard to work with it by ear only, without being able to see the text, and it doesn't help that the game cuts off the incantations for fast-casting spells.
Cure Light Wounds cast by a female, sounds like "Aquaa, in Mahehr". Or, I maybe hear a "g" in that first word "Agua, in Mahehr".
I seem to recall reading a comment from @Mortianna in an older thread that addressed this topic, that the original incantations were supposed to be made-up nonsense syllables, that had an occult sound. A lot of people prefer the original versions, and there's even a mod at SHS to restore them to BG2.
The thing is, even with totally made-up spell incantations, the writer is subconsciously influenced by the trope, and tends to choose latinate or Greek roots, that wind up being related to the spell that is being made up, often completely unintentionally.
If that's "Aqua", in the Cure Light Wounds, then that obviously means "water", which would make sense for a healing spell. Even as a necromantic summons, it could probably translate to something like "I bring water back to the dry", or "From death, the water of life."
Also, the diction sounds to me like an ancient Eastern language of some kind, rather than Latin. Maybe Sanskrit or Egyptian.
Going back to the idea that fantasy writers are influenced by their subconscious minds when they make up spell words, anyone who's ever watched Stargate has heard some Egyptian phrases.
Just saying the names of their gods, pharaohs, places, and archetypes starts to get the mysteries of ancient Egyptian language and culture swimming around in your head: Ra, Amenhotep, Tutenkhamun, Anubis, Osiris, Akhenaten, Ramses, ankh, Isis.
Combine any three of those names, speak them aloud with an ominous sounding intonation, stretching out all the vowels, while widening your eyes, grinning evilly, and waving your arms and fingers around tracing astrological glyphs in the air, and voila, you look and sound like you're casting a spell.
@belgarathmth XD thanks for all the information. i wonder if in the far future people will be using english or other languages in our era to fulfill their spell casting needs O.o
@Night_Watch, I wouldn't doubt it. LOL, love the meme. "That which you do not understand, is *witchcraft*! Be very afraid! Suffer not a witch to live!" LOL
@belgarathmth XD thanks for all the information. i wonder if in the far future people will be using english or other languages in our era to fulfill their spell casting needs O.o
That, and the pidgin latin direct/contextual translation discussion, reminded me of this:
@pekirt, roflmao! One of the wonderful things about Stargate, was that it both lampshaded and regularly subverted the trope we're discussing here. Usually through the character of Colonel O'Neil, who had reasonable Wisdom (at least a 12-15, I'd say), and so-so INT (probably a solid, average, 10), compared to the stellar Intelligence of Daniel Jackson (probably INT 18 and WIS 9ish), or Samantha Carter (probably INT 16-17 and WIS 10 or so.)
EDIT: Uh-oh. I hope I didn't just derail the thread into another "fictional character stat war".
I can already see Daniel Jackson fans coming here and shouting "No way, Daniel had both INT and WIS 18, because he Ascended!" LOL
Sanskrit is verily similar to Latin; their linguistic ancestor split but a while ago, after all. I doubt the guys at Black Isle would venture so far to the East, however. Might be worth a try, though the resonance of the words you present here appears more European than Indian. Egyptian, is even less plausible. And, unless by Egyptian you mean colloquial Egyptian Arabic, it is beyond human power to reproduce the actual sounds of the language. Whilst many consonants of Classical and older varieties of Egyptian are indeed quite precisely deciphered to date, the vowels remain a mystery. This is an inconvenience that somewhat affects understanding (although not so much, since lots of roots are shared by Semitic languages) but its most important consequence is that it is impossible to actually speak in the language. Some scholars try to reconstruct words and vocalize them by putting vowels in place, whether by analogy with other Semitic languages or by e-ing (it's actually a common habit among egyptologists to just throw in 'e' every time a vowel is needed). So, it'd be rather unlikely that Egyptian was used in the game. Other Semitic languages don't fit the roots very well, either. Though I'm by no means an expert in terms of human inventions, such as languages. Even now, I sound really Akkadian when speaking Arabic and I habitually use extremely old-fashioned grammar structures (like e.g. using אלוהים as a unitary God-dyad collective) whenever I try to speak any variety of Hebrew. Though if you send me some stone tablets with transcripts of the expressions in question, I might still be able to give you linguistic aid. Or anthrax.
@pekirt, roflmao! One of the wonderful things about Stargate, was that it both lampshaded and regularly subverted the trope we're discussing here. Usually through the character of Colonel O'Neil, who had reasonable Wisdom (at least a 12-15, I'd say), and so-so INT (probably a solid, average, 10), compared to the stellar Intelligence of Daniel Jackson (probably INT 18 and WIS 9ish), or Samantha Carter (probably INT 16-17 and WIS 10 or so.)
No way Samantha has INT below 18. Who else can write a 1000 page book about wormhole physics in less than 2 hours?!
@God, you are Awesome Sauce, as usual! You even give us an answer to the question "Can God create a stone that God cannot lift?" Although, I'm sure You didn't mean to. Or else, You did. You are wonderful beyond my comprehension that You can fragment Yourself into so many actual entities, that even You cannot be fully conscious of their language and culture creations and inventions at any one time. Unless You can. Hmm, I'm starting to think a bit about the Christian theological doctrine of "Trinity" again, although that particular theological line of thought is woefully off-topic for this thread, and my tendency to derail threads has struck, yet again. So, I don't want to derail this "magical incantation" thread by discussing theology any farther, here, although I always appreciate getting a spark of Your attention. And not. Since You are always hopelessly frustrating to Your creatures. And hopelessly inspiring. And the end of all human endeavor, since we seek You endlessly and we can't help ourselves,..... and, um, yeah.
@Quartz, what is your source of information for the assertion that the BG1 incantations were composed as gibberish by their writers? I would be *very* interested in taking a look at that source of info! Did one of the original game writers say something about it in a interview or something?
@Pecca, okay, I will yield to your idea that both Samantha and Daniel had INT of at least 18. Maybe Daniel even had a 19. But, I still assert that Colonel O'Neil had a WIS higher than either of them, or at least, higher than Daniel's. Maybe Samantha and Jack were equals in WIS... but, if we really want to have some fun with this, we should start a new thread.
Sam: INT 19 WIS 10 - *yes, we can!* Jack: INT 10 WIS 19 - *... but should we?*
Daniel has some of both, sort of a INT 17 WIS 17 kind of guy. Clever and smart, and well aware that that's just part of the story. He obviously has the higher total, which is why he got to go for godhood.
Let's start a separate topic in Off-Topic for Stargate discussion, okay? I'll go out and make it right now. This thread here is supposed to be about translations and speculation on spell incantations used in Baldur's Gate 1, Baldur's Gate 2, and Neverwinter Nights.
@belgarathmth Pretty easy to presume they are gibberish given the fact that the vast majority of people agree it's gibberish, and the best attempt I've seen to decipher it is yours' in this thread, and to be honest, it seems incredibly forced.
Comments
As I've said, it's really hard to work with it by ear only, without being able to see the text, and it doesn't help that the game cuts off the incantations for fast-casting spells.
Cure Light Wounds cast by a female, sounds like "Aquaa, in Mahehr". Or, I maybe hear a "g" in that first word "Agua, in Mahehr".
I seem to recall reading a comment from @Mortianna in an older thread that addressed this topic, that the original incantations were supposed to be made-up nonsense syllables, that had an occult sound. A lot of people prefer the original versions, and there's even a mod at SHS to restore them to BG2.
The thing is, even with totally made-up spell incantations, the writer is subconsciously influenced by the trope, and tends to choose latinate or Greek roots, that wind up being related to the spell that is being made up, often completely unintentionally.
If that's "Aqua", in the Cure Light Wounds, then that obviously means "water", which would make sense for a healing spell. Even as a necromantic summons, it could probably translate to something like "I bring water back to the dry", or "From death, the water of life."
Also, the diction sounds to me like an ancient Eastern language of some kind, rather than Latin. Maybe Sanskrit or Egyptian.
Going back to the idea that fantasy writers are influenced by their subconscious minds when they make up spell words, anyone who's ever watched Stargate has heard some Egyptian phrases.
Just saying the names of their gods, pharaohs, places, and archetypes starts to get the mysteries of ancient Egyptian language and culture swimming around in your head: Ra, Amenhotep, Tutenkhamun, Anubis, Osiris, Akhenaten, Ramses, ankh, Isis.
Combine any three of those names, speak them aloud with an ominous sounding intonation, stretching out all the vowels, while widening your eyes, grinning evilly, and waving your arms and fingers around tracing astrological glyphs in the air, and voila, you look and sound like you're casting a spell.
EDIT: Uh-oh. I hope I didn't just derail the thread into another "fictional character stat war".
I can already see Daniel Jackson fans coming here and shouting "No way, Daniel had both INT and WIS 18, because he Ascended!" LOL
About Daniel Jackson, he temporarily gained the Celestial and Ghost templates.
Egyptian, is even less plausible. And, unless by Egyptian you mean colloquial Egyptian Arabic, it is beyond human power to reproduce the actual sounds of the language. Whilst many consonants of Classical and older varieties of Egyptian are indeed quite precisely deciphered to date, the vowels remain a mystery. This is an inconvenience that somewhat affects understanding (although not so much, since lots of roots are shared by Semitic languages) but its most important consequence is that it is impossible to actually speak in the language. Some scholars try to reconstruct words and vocalize them by putting vowels in place, whether by analogy with other Semitic languages or by e-ing (it's actually a common habit among egyptologists to just throw in 'e' every time a vowel is needed).
So, it'd be rather unlikely that Egyptian was used in the game. Other Semitic languages don't fit the roots very well, either. Though I'm by no means an expert in terms of human inventions, such as languages. Even now, I sound really Akkadian when speaking Arabic and I habitually use extremely old-fashioned grammar structures (like e.g. using אלוהים as a unitary God-dyad collective) whenever I try to speak any variety of Hebrew. Though if you send me some stone tablets with transcripts of the expressions in question, I might still be able to give you linguistic aid. Or anthrax.
@Quartz, what is your source of information for the assertion that the BG1 incantations were composed as gibberish by their writers? I would be *very* interested in taking a look at that source of info! Did one of the original game writers say something about it in a interview or something?
@Pecca, okay, I will yield to your idea that both Samantha and Daniel had INT of at least 18. Maybe Daniel even had a 19. But, I still assert that Colonel O'Neil had a WIS higher than either of them, or at least, higher than Daniel's. Maybe Samantha and Jack were equals in WIS... but, if we really want to have some fun with this, we should start a new thread.
Sam: INT 19 WIS 10 - *yes, we can!*
Jack: INT 10 WIS 19 - *... but should we?*
Daniel has some of both, sort of a INT 17 WIS 17 kind of guy. Clever and smart, and well aware that that's just part of the story. He obviously has the higher total, which is why he got to go for godhood.
Man, I really need to watch it again.
Uhh, anyways, back on topic, for me. I think Teal'c had a 15 in Intelligence and Wisdom.