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Why You Should Play PS:T -- An Informative Rant

MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
edited September 2013 in Archive (General Discussion)
Good afternoon, fellow adventurers of the Sword Coast. I come to you today somewhat shocked by the number of BG players who haven't played Planescape: Torment, judging by the "What Infinity Engine games have you beaten?" poll on these boards. Now, even as a huge fan of the game myself, I recognize that PS:T is pretty far from what I might call "mainstream", and I wouldn't recommend it to just anybody. But you guys aren't just anybodies, you're BG players. You have two feet firmly planted in this style of game, and all you need to do is nudge yourself forward to enjoy PS:T.

So, I bring you this: A list of reasons to play PS:T. Bullet-pointed for ease of reading, in no particular order, all off the top of my head with very little preparation on my end. I hope this changes some people's minds, or at the very least gives you something to read while pretending to work.

1. It's the best-written game you'll ever play. Yes, that's a subjective evaluation, but I think if you give it a shot you'll agree. The story of PS:T has no comparison to other games, novels, or movies. It's just crazy. I won't spoil anything by saying more.
2. It has better party members than anything the BG series has to offer. So much more effort is put into these characters' stories and personality. You like Minsc? Yeah, he's pretty cool. Meet Morte, a floating, wisecracking skull with a never-ending supply of one-liners, questionable bits of advice, and sweet interactions with the plot, not to mention infinitely better fighting skills than his dimwitted ranger counterpart. You think Edwin is a powerful mage? Take Ignis along for the ride, a mage so consumed by his desire for power that his body became a living portal into the elemental plane of fire.
3. The dialogue is the best of any Infinity Engine game. Every stat potentially impacts your conversation options, unlocking new conversation routes depending on your build. You have the option to lie and mislead in conversations, or to make binding vows. I've had entire play sessions comprised of nothing but dialogue, and been satisfied with that session. Hell, I've had entire play sessions comprised of nothing but dialogue with my own party members, and it was fantastic. There is so much to discover.
4. Alignment actually CHANGES. This is something the BG series barely does. You start at True Neutral, and your actions throughout the course of the game alter the PC's alignment. This allows for much better roleplay than just picking an alignment and forgetting about it, especially since there are many points in the game where your alignment becomes relevant.
5. The setting is an extremely welcome shift from classic Forgotten Realms, if you haven't experienced it yet. This is a loose comparison, but if you prefer Game of Thrones to Lord of the Rings, you'll likely appreciate the tonal shift. There are beggars and prostitutes everywhere, as well as vicious gang members and all sorts of shady characters. Bother the wrong traveler on the street, and he'll attack you. Guards aren't going to come to your aid. There's no Order of the Radiant Heart or Temple of Lathander to comfortably hang out with the goody-goodies of the world.
6. The main character is so much more compelling than BG's Bhaalspawn protagonist. Granted, some people might appreciate the option to concoct their own backstory for a protagonist and won't have that option in PS:T, but the tradeoff is a much more fleshed-out character. You start as a neutral human male fighter, with a malleable alignment and class. That's all I'm going to say about the protagonist, as I encourage you to find out the rest yourself, but suffice to say that I'd place his story on par with pretty much every popular NPC of the BG saga combined.
7. The combat actually isn't that bad. It's common for people to be critical of it, and they aren't wrong, but there are some really cool spells to cast that aren't in the BG saga, as well as several really great set-pieces to battle through. BG and IWD undoubtedly have better combat, but PS:T isn't as deficient in this category as people say.
8. There is a TON of replay value. I find new things every time I go through the game. There are hidden areas, rare items, and wildly different paths you can take through the game. All sorts of secrets are there for you to find. If you need convincing, here's a minor spoiler of one such secret, which won't ruin much unless you really want to go into the game blind:
A ways into the game, the protagonist gets the ability to talk to corpses. You might assume that this ability wouldn't work in the beginning area's massive mausoleum... but it DOES. Most of the corpses within don't impact the gameplay meaningfully, but several have fascinating stories to tell, and you can spend upwards of an hour just wandering the beginning area, talking to zombies and hearing cool lore

9. The score rocks. Not much more to say. It's unusually effective.
10. For this style of RPG, there are an unusually high number of NPCs with actual interactions, not just random "Commoners" wandering about to fill up space. You don't have the immersion-breaking scenario of simply ignoring commoners and talking to everyone with an actual name; If an NPC "extra" is behaving erratically or wearing unusual clothing, for example, they've probably got something to add to the game beyond re-hashed filler lines.
11. The ending is nuts. I won't say anything about it. Suffice to say that, if you were worried the game wouldn't pay off for all the crazy stuff you experience along the way, well... it does.
12. It's dirt-cheap, and you have nothing better to be doing right now. BG2EE doesn't come out until November 15th. The super-patch is probably going to have open beta soon, sure, but unless you all intend to spend all of your gaming time bug-testing, you'll want a change of pace.

Yes, the first hour or so is a bit tedious. You'll balk at the engine's inferiority to the BG series, you'll grumble at the lack of direction, and you'll probably get frustrated by all the seemingly-identical zombies in the opening area. Power through it. We all probably remember how much worse BG1 was before people started modding and improving it, PS:T is no worse than that. Trust me, you'll get used to it and forget you ever had an issue with the engine once you've pushed past that first hour.

I hope I've convinced some people to give this amazing game a shot, and that those people will enjoy it when they do. I certainly did once I finally got around to playing it, and all this talk of PS:T has me about to start yet another run myself.

I leave you with some fan-made Torment music from the impeccable Gavin Dunne over at the Escapist. It captures Torment's mood and theme perfectly, and is comparable in style to the score of the actual game if you're interested. Enjoy! http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/miracle-of-sound/7890-Nameless-Planescape-Torment
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Comments

  • CuvCuv Member, Developer Posts: 2,535
    Yes!

    What can change the nature of a man?
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    Glad I've got one person who agrees with me =D

    Oh, addendum to the above and credit to the guys in blue: When I say the PS:T party members are better than BG party members, I'm talking about the original group of party members. I think the Overhaul crew has made some great additions to the game. Dorn, in particular, is of comparable quality to the PS:T cast, and actually reminded me a bit of Vhailor and Ignis when I recruited him.
  • ThrasymachusThrasymachus Member Posts: 903
    I agree that PS:T is a great game. It's been 10 years since I played it, though, so my memory of it is a bit hazy. I plan to play it again once I finish my current IWD game. (Hopefully by the time I'm done IWD+PS:T, the patch for BGEE will be done, and BG2EE will be available.)
  • Avenger_teambgAvenger_teambg Member, Developer Posts: 5,862
    The amount of crazy spell effects is just damn high in PST. So it isn't just about reading a novel.
    The NPC's are diverse and fun. Maybe with the exception of Vhailor.
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    Yeah, I appreciate Vhailor, but he doesn't fit into my parties very often. Very unique and interesting NPC, though.
  • kansasbarbariankansasbarbarian Member Posts: 206
    Yes PS:T is *known* to me.
    This is by far my favorite game. Dakkon, Annah, and Fall-from-Grace are great characters. And good ole Morte. Hey Chief.
    I spent hundreds of hours on this game in 1999. In fact I broke it back out before BGEE came out. How many games can you use your own tatted arm as a club.
  • kansasbarbariankansasbarbarian Member Posts: 206
    Scars and dreads whats not to like. All the chicks dig you. And did I mention tats.
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    @Permidion_Stark

    The Witcher saga has the same issue. The Witcher 2 was excellent, and The Witcher 3 looks downright revolutionary. I hope your preference for hotter male leads doesn't keep you from these games =P
  • mylegbigmylegbig Member Posts: 292
    I agree for the most part, but...

    The game has some replay value, but I wouldn't say a ton. Even though the game had a far bigger impact on me than the BG games when first played (I was actually disappointed with BG2 because I played PS:T first), I think I only made 2, maybe 3 complete play throughs over the years. I've spent far more time playing BG 2. With BG 2, once I became too familiar with the dialogue I just skipped most of it and played it for the combat/character building. With PS:T, the dialogue IS the gameplay, so over familiarity kills a lot of the replay value.

    Oh, and as for the ending. The final "dungeon" and "battle" were interesting, but the actual ending itself, not so much. It left many things unanswered and obviously left room open for a sequel that never happened because the game wasn't successful enough.

    That said, still one of my favorite games of all time.
  • Permidion_StarkPermidion_Stark Member Posts: 4,861
    Madhax said:

    @Permidion_Stark

    The Witcher saga has the same issue. The Witcher 2 was excellent, and The Witcher 3 looks downright revolutionary. I hope your preference for hotter male leads doesn't keep you from these games =P

    Actually I generally play as a female. The issue isn't that I want to be hot; I just want some choice regarding the character I am playing.

  • DelvarianDelvarian Member Posts: 1,232
    I've started this game several times, but never got much further than the first area. It took me a long time to figure out the controls, such as how to use an item. I had the key for the door but couldn't for the life of me figure out how to use it on the door.
    When I made it out of the first area, I was promptly killed by a group of street toughs. I thought combat was something that Didnt matter in this game?
    My only other problem was the lack of direction. I had no idea what I should be trying to accomplish. The only goal I seemed to have was crazy vague.
    Not trying to hate on the game, the dialogue was very good, but it seems that you need to invest some serious time and energy on this game. I just haven't been able to take the time to figure it out yet. Maybe if I quit my job...
  • AristilliusAristillius Member Posts: 873
    Well written argumentation @Madhax, you have convinced me to try it out!
  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,344
    It's indeed a rare gem of a game, and I wish it would someday get the kind of attention that GTA V is getting right about now - it'd be a valuable lesson in game design for a lot of people.


    (Though having said that, I still prefer the BG series.)
  • LateralusLateralus Member Posts: 903
    It takes me a long, long time to get into any game. Sometimes I have to play the first 10-40 minutes of it over and over again before I find it worthwhile. It took me awhile to get into Torment, but it was one of the few games I kept coming back to until I got lost in it.

    Anyways, the game is unique. It's very fun, and it moves at an interesting pace. I love that game and would buy it again in a heartbeat. I feel like there is so much of it I left unexplored.
  • GawdzillaGawdzilla Member Posts: 86
    @Madhax, totally agree. PS:T breaks a lot of rules & it's an amazing game.

    I still remember my first run thru, I went to every shop looking for armor ha ha.
  • lamaroslamaros Member Posts: 139
    edited September 2013
    I'll be that guy:

    The story of PS:T is all 'read lots of text', not much 'experience it through the game'. It's fun in a sense, but it doesn't often feel like a game.

    The denoumont is cliche and a bit lame.

    The combat is horrible; awkward, unchallenging and boring.

    Half the characters are bare bones and the game generally has a lot of 'planned but not realised/implemented' parts.

    There is very little replay value at all as it is so linear and story driven.

    The engine is even more limited and difficult to handle than the BG one.

    Items and character development is borderline non-existent. There is no meaningful range of classes or play styles: see comments about the combat also regarding this.

    However is is worth playing once. Though it isn't as good as the BG games and will not be a cup of tea for many many players it is a unique experience and will be really enjoyed by a certain type of gamer.
    Post edited by lamaros on
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  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416

    Madhax said:

    @Permidion_Stark

    The Witcher saga has the same issue. The Witcher 2 was excellent, and The Witcher 3 looks downright revolutionary. I hope your preference for hotter male leads doesn't keep you from these games =P

    Actually I generally play as a female. The issue isn't that I want to be hot; I just want some choice regarding the character I am playing.

    I figured as much, I was just joking. Clearly my humor either A) doesn't translate well via text or B) doesn't actually exist anyway.
    Delvarian said:

    I've started this game several times, but never got much further than the first area. It took me a long time to figure out the controls, such as how to use an item. I had the key for the door but couldn't for the life of me figure out how to use it on the door.
    When I made it out of the first area, I was promptly killed by a group of street toughs. I thought combat was something that Didnt matter in this game?
    My only other problem was the lack of direction. I had no idea what I should be trying to accomplish. The only goal I seemed to have was crazy vague.
    Not trying to hate on the game, the dialogue was very good, but it seems that you need to invest some serious time and energy on this game. I just haven't been able to take the time to figure it out yet. Maybe if I quit my job...

    You were likely trying to open the wrong door, keys work out of your inventory the same way they do in the BG saga. If you start asking around about Pharod, you should eventually figure out how to proceed...
  • MadhaxMadhax Member Posts: 1,416
    lamaros said:

    I'll be that guy:

    The story of PS:T is all 'read lots of text', not much 'experience it through the game'. It's fun in a sense, but it doesn't often feel like a game.

    The denoumont is cliche and a bit lame.

    The combat is horrible; awkward, unchallenging and boring.

    Half the characters are bare bones and the game generally has a lot of 'planned but not realised/implemented' parts.

    There is very little replay value at all as it is so linear and story driven.

    The engine is even more limited and difficult to handle than the BG one.

    Items and character development is borderline non-existent. There is no meaningful range of classes or play styles: see comments about the combat also regarding this.

    However is is worth playing once. Though it isn't as good as the BG games and will not be a cup of tea for many many players it is a unique experience and will be really enjoyed by a certain type of gamer.

    Perfectly reasonable complaints, though I obviously disagree with most of them. It's not for everyone. The storytelling is certainly less visual than it could be, though I have to think at least some of that is technological restrictions. If it was re-made with Mass Effect dialogue... I would never exit my basement again.

    I don't get the complaints about the ending, though. I found it very fulfilling, and there were so many cop-out paths the writers could have taken that they thankfully avoided. Plus, and I'm being exceedingly vague here, the experiences leading up to the final encounter were absolutely BRILLIANT in my book.
  • XerxesVXerxesV Member Posts: 187
    @madhax sir, you have convinced me to try it again. Three bad starts, each less than an hour, and I was quitting.
  • KingGhidorahKingGhidorah Member Posts: 201
    Loved the story, setting and characters. Hated the combat (though the spell effects and cinematics where cool).

    Despite what people say, tactical combat really is PS:T's one huge weak point.
    Shame, because everything else is so good
  • AntonAnton Member, Moderator, Mobile Tester Posts: 513
  • Permidion_StarkPermidion_Stark Member Posts: 4,861
    One thing PS:T does have in its favour is that Sheena Easton, the Scottish pixie of pop, does the voice acting for one of the NPCs. That alone makes it worth giving it a go.
  • Cimmerian1xCimmerian1x Member Posts: 32
    Nameless One the undead warrior!
  • O_BruceO_Bruce Member Posts: 2,790
    Playing Planescape:Torment is on my "things to do" list, but there's a catch. IF I manage to find this game in my native language, that is. Most of you will probably gog.com it, but gog doesn't give a damn about in how many languages game was released. That is true to their release of Baldur's Gate, as well as Planescape:Torment.
  • ljboljbo Member Posts: 177
    Totally agree with th awesomeness of PS:T, a cRPG that takes "role" very seriously.

    For the best experience, I highly recommend to install the fixes as explained here:
    http://thunderpeel2001.blogspot.fr/2009/01/planescape-torment-fully-modded.html

  • GaveGave Member Posts: 66
    I tried, mostly because of the godifying reviews. Still I found it fairly boring and hard to flash into. I had played fallout 2 way after its release as well, and I had no problem with gameplay or graphics, so I guess it wasnt about simply disliking the outdated tech about it.

    For me a video game is defined primarily by the interaction. Presenting text over text over text ...over. is not really the interaction I was looking for ... The fact that I know there are fairly limited ideas in the text just makes it less attractive. I can fully appreciate, and enjoy a well designed Forum based RPG, due to the high chance of something awesome happening, sometimes even out of context. -- So it isnt really about reading and interacting with text either.

    For me the atmosphere was not attractive. (Not for everyone I guess)

    I learned the lessons the hard way: Just because people advertise something as "Aaawesome", it isnt necessarily good, lots of people like social networking, let me not go into detail how badly repulsive I think socmedia is :). On the other hand, I like "specialized" or "themed", niche communities. (BG forums *wink* )

    To get a story awesome you definitely dont need walls of text tho. Some of the best characters and stories for me said little but told much. I prefer genius in simplicity.

    For many reasons I would rather know OG is working on icewind dale. At least upgrades could post affect BGs as well. I would even pick up the worse parts of IWD2 (and i really dislike some parts) than to force play PS:T.

    No offense meant at all, I know some folks are touchy about their precious games.


  • MessiMessi Member Posts: 738
    Gave said:

    For me a video game is defined primarily by the interaction. Presenting text over text over text ...over. is not really the interaction I was looking for ... The fact that I know there are fairly limited ideas in the text just makes it less attractive. I can fully appreciate, and enjoy a well designed Forum based RPG, due to the high chance of something awesome happening, sometimes even out of context. -- So it isnt really about reading and interacting with text either.

    To me that's a really weird complaint about PS:T it's by far the most interactive game I've ever played. Eg. the very first area(ie. the mortuary) you start in has layer after layer of depth. I don't wanna get too spoilery, but eg. the zombies you see mulling about aren't just random NPCs(like they would be in almost any other game). Try examing them more closely and you will find out all kinds of secrets and lore.

    That is only one of many things about the mortuary you might not immediately notice, but are there. PS:T is absolutely chock full of stuff like from start to finish so what you are saying doesn't really make much sense to me.
  • lamaroslamaros Member Posts: 139
    PS:T is full of walls of text from start to finish. It's perfectly reasonable to not like it.

    I enjoyed PS:T, but I'm not going to replay it.
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