Is Neera really Chaotic Neutral?

ShapiroKeatsDarkMage

I think she's a bit too friendly to be ''neutral''.

SionIV

She's crazy and a wild mage, trying to buff someone with haste and then having that person instantly die from cow-to-head prevents her from being of good alignment.

True Story.

Xanar

Yup, she's as crazy as a hatter. CN is quite accurate.

meagloth

She is the finest example of chaotic neutral I can think of. She ran away from here home because she messed up a spell, with pretty much no perpetration whatsoever.

And what do you mean by "too friendly too be neutral"? Neutral can be friendly.

atcDave

I don't think friendliness has anything to do with alignment. She steals, and has accidentally hurt people, and the only remorse she seems to feel is for getting in trouble.
Don't get me wrong, I like her, and often have her in my party; but I think CN fits her perfectly.

badbromance

meagloth said:

She is the finest example of chaotic neutral I can think of. She ran away from here home because she messed up a spell, with pretty much no perpetration whatsoever.

And what do you mean by "too friendly too be neutral"? Neutral can be friendly.

Yeah "Evil" people can be friendly too. It may or may not be genuine and they may or may not leave you in a pool of your own blood in a deserted alley but hey, still friendly.
I also think it would be a mistake to assume all good characters are friendly too!

Edit: I agree with you @meagloth, I should have quoted the OP

element

attributes like being nice or friendly aren't limited to good alignment

in the same way that being a dick isn't an exclusively evil characteristic

Drugar

She doesn't go out of her way to help people and doesn't go out of her way to hurt people. Sounds neutral to me.

Even the Joker is a friendly guy, if you have a sense of humor. Doesn't make him Good.

Southpaw

To me, she's more like Chaotic Annoying.

ghostowl

I cringe everytime I cast a spell with her...wild mage is NOT fun for me..

Schneidend

My Lawful Evil Cavalier/Hell Knight in Pathfinder is one of the friendliest guy you'll ever meet, but that doesn't mean he's not pondering whether it would be profitable to kill you or not.

CutlassJack

meagloth said:

And what do you mean by "too friendly too be neutral"? Neutral can be friendly.

...at least 50% of the time. :P

LiamEsler

Good =! friendly. Being friendly has nothing to do with alignment.

meagloth

After 10 comments saying the same thing I think we can agree that good does not mean friendly.

sarevok57

it could also be for the fact that it makes it so she can kinda join any type of alignment group and fit in sort of thing, plus they had one new evil npc, one good one, and they had to make a neutral one, so if you are the role playing sort, this gives her an excuse to fit it because she could go either way

mylegbig

Most people are neutral really. D&D good is basically defined as being willing to go out of your way to help others. How many people actually do that?

sarevok57

actually quite a lot of people do that, donations to charity being an example, that's going out of your way to help others, and usually in towns smaller than 50 000 people the people in those towns seem to be much nicer than city people ( generally, but that's not always the case)

mlnevese

After reading all the comments about alignment having no relation to friendliness I keep trying to imagine how a friendly evil NPC would behave

meagloth

mlnevese said:

After reading all the comments about alignment having no relation to friendliness I keep trying to imagine how a friendly evil NPC would behave

Tricksy, nasty tricksy...... Slit through in night he does......nasty tricksy........ friendly in the daytime he is......

Durenas

mlnevese said:

After reading all the comments about alignment having no relation to friendliness I keep trying to imagine how a friendly evil NPC would behave

Montaron and Xzar are pretty friendly! They gave me a healing potion!

sarevok57

i find dorn to be quite friendly, here you are being attacked by a bunch of bandit baddies and he comes on in, helps you kill 'em all and after they all be dead he says; hey there chap, let me join up with ye and we can bonce around seeing the sights and sing about the good ol' times of the yester years...... or at least something on those lines.....

atcDave

mlnevese said:

After reading all the comments about alignment having no relation to friendliness I keep trying to imagine how a friendly evil NPC would behave

I'm pretty sure I've worked with a couple of those...

Ayiekie

mlnevese said:

After reading all the comments about alignment having no relation to friendliness I keep trying to imagine how a friendly evil NPC would behave

Serious answer? They'd like you, and be fun to be around. They'd even help you out when you were in trouble, maybe (evil people aren't going to let a friend die just to be eviluz, in most cases). The problem is that when it comes right down to it they'd betray/kill/rob/abandon you in favour of their own goals, which might be very unpleasant goals indeed.

A thieve's guild leader might be your jolly drinking buddy, Mr. Corrupt Guard, and he'll even slip you a little something extra, or let you know your wife's cheating on you without charging for the info, or make sure you get to arrest a high-value suspect - that he didn't like that much anyway - so you can get that promotion you're angling for. He'd have your back if an army invaded the city, even. And he'd put a knife in that back the moment you had an attack of conscience and it got back to him you were considering compromising his operations. He might even be a bit sad when he gave the order, brood a bit over that nice brandy you two used to share. But there's never any chance sentimentality would make him let you live.

He's a great guy. But he's not a GOOD guy.

CoM_Solaufein

Chaotic Airhead.

Schneidend

mlnevese said:

After reading all the comments about alignment having no relation to friendliness I keep trying to imagine how a friendly evil NPC would behave

The same way other friendly people behave. Good manners, a smile, and like Ayiekie said, willing to help you out until the moment you're an inconvenience. When that time comes, you're probably dead, or you'll be tortured for the rest of your days, or he'll ruin you professionally/financially and leave you in squalor.

FrozenCells

mlnevese said:

After reading all the comments about alignment having no relation to friendliness I keep trying to imagine how a friendly evil NPC would behave

How about Korgan in BG2? He's revels too much in carnage and killing to be neutral but his bark is worse than his bite. He's very tolerant of the PCs decisions even if he thinks they're stupid and actually becomes quite supportive and loyal over the course of the game. He obviously doesn't place much value on human life and doesn't see weak people as being worth any kind of consideration but with the right people, he's actually perhaps a much nicer companion than some apparently good-aligned characters. I don't see this as a contradiction on alignment either. There's degrees of evil, they're not universally psychopaths.

shawne

FrozenCells said:

How about Korgan in BG2? He's revels too much in carnage and killing to be neutral but his bark is worse than his bite. He's very tolerant of the PCs decisions even if he thinks they're stupid and actually becomes quite supportive and loyal over the course of the game. He obviously doesn't place much value on human life and doesn't see weak people as being worth any kind of consideration but with the right people, he's actually perhaps a much nicer companion than some apparently good-aligned characters. I don't see this as a contradiction on alignment either. There's degrees of evil, they're not universally psychopaths.

Korgan's actually a great example of how an Evil person can react differently to specific individuals: Mazzy and Aerie are both Lawful Good, but he develops a crush on the former and torments the latter endlessly (or at least until she finally snaps), while getting along perfectly well with Imoen and Keldorn.

Anduin

Didn't she set someone on fire and run away?

If she was good, she would have got some water, attended to the wounds, say sorry, and make amends.

If she was evil, she would have burnt 'em some more, burnt more people, applied butter to the burns afterwards so they would cook, spit on them and say she was glad she did it.

Now as she was neutral, we know she ran away but she could have easily, blamed someone else or demonic possession, thought that the victim was suffering from demonic possession...

Anyway... She is defo neutral...

KidCarnival

Southpaw said:

To me, she's more like Chaotic Annoying.

Lawful Annoying to me. She strictly follows the rule to annoy me in any possible way, no exceptions.

As for friendly evil NPCs - Eldoth can be very charming if it suits him, Xzar is friendly all the way (not just giving a free potion; he's a big contrast to most evil NPCs insofar that his banter lines don't have anything arrogant or hateful - with the notable exception of hating sunlight - toward charname, and he doesn't insult other NPCs in banters either), Kagain isn't unfriendly (and where some elven NPCs complain in dungeons of 'acting like dwarves' - Kivan; Kagain doesn't seem to be prejuduced or hateful toward any race - after Dorn's quest, he asks him to become business partners after the adventure with you, and Dorn replies surprisingly friendly, saying he'll consider the offer).

On the other hand, Kivan is quite grumpy as a good NPC. He dislikes dwarves (or at least how they live, other elves don't state specifically they hate 'the ways of the dwarven folk'), his hatred toward Viconia seems mostly one-sided and he's generally grumpy.

Schneidend

shawne said:

FrozenCells said:

How about Korgan in BG2? He's revels too much in carnage and killing to be neutral but his bark is worse than his bite. He's very tolerant of the PCs decisions even if he thinks they're stupid and actually becomes quite supportive and loyal over the course of the game. He obviously doesn't place much value on human life and doesn't see weak people as being worth any kind of consideration but with the right people, he's actually perhaps a much nicer companion than some apparently good-aligned characters. I don't see this as a contradiction on alignment either. There's degrees of evil, they're not universally psychopaths.

Korgan's actually a great example of how an Evil person can react differently to specific individuals: Mazzy and Aerie are both Lawful Good, but he develops a crush on the former and torments the latter endlessly (or at least until she finally snaps), while getting along perfectly well with Imoen and Keldorn.

This, both shawne and Frozen are right on the money. Korgan, and BG2 evil NPCs in general, are perfect examples of Evil characters who can work with Good characters, the borked NPC-break-on-rep system notwithstanding. The only reason people have this false impression that Evil-aligned characters are one-dimensional is because they make them that way when they play them, or have played PnP or roleplayed with somebody who has.

Magnus_Grelich

I think her character was sorely lacking in depth. She just seemed very one-dimensional to me.:D Maybe this will be rectified in BG2, though. Even Rasaad and Dorn seemed more interesting.