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It's a great pity *spoiler*

13

Comments

  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    Quartz said:

    I respect your opinion on this, but we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

    I figured your streak of liking my posts on the thread was gonna end with that one. :)

  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    Aranthys said:

    Come on, that's a stupid statement.
    Using your same reasoning would mean that the original BG2 developers were racist simply because Denahyr was gotten rid of in BG2 by beeing killed.
    Or because the only "asian-ish" guy is a traitor.
    Or whatever other goddamn reason that absolutely make no sense.

    Hell, I'm not even for Clara becoming a full fledged NPC, but there's no way I can let go that kind of bold statement.

    The difference is that neither Dynaheir nor Yoshimo get replaced by white people when they die, and nobody is demanding they be replaced by white people. People are demanding they be able to replace Hexxat with a white woman who they want to be straight/bi.

  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    Actually... technically, Dynaheir totally does get replaced by a white woman.

    MornmagorQuartzbooinyoureyes
  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,826
    Ayiekie said:

    Awong124 said:


    I've said it on this forum before, but political correctness is getting out of hand. And people trying so hard to be politically correct just makes the situation worse.

    Hahahahahahaha. No. I'm not going to argue with you, or point out obvious recent newsworthy events that make a mockery of your statement, because it will just get the thread locked even faster than it clearly will be, but no.
    image

    Awong124Qbertbooinyoureyes
  • MornmagorMornmagor Member Posts: 1,160
    edited November 2013
    Ayiekie said:

    Actually... technically, Dynaheir totally does get replaced by a white woman.

    Ahahahah :p Aerie yeah.

    booinyoureyes
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    Quartz said:

    Ayiekie said:

    Awong124 said:


    I've said it on this forum before, but political correctness is getting out of hand. And people trying so hard to be politically correct just makes the situation worse.

    Hahahahahahaha. No. I'm not going to argue with you, or point out obvious recent newsworthy events that make a mockery of your statement, because it will just get the thread locked even faster than it clearly will be, but no.
    image
    I was actually confused and had no idea what he was talking about either.

    QuartzjankielQbertbooinyoureyes
  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    That's a pretty amusingly inappropriate choice of response images, there, Quartz. You know Patrick Stewart's not exactly on the "political correctness has gone too far" bandwagon, right?

  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,826
    Ayiekie said:

    That's a pretty amusingly inappropriate choice of response images, there, Quartz. You know Patrick Stewart's not exactly on the "political correctness has gone too far" bandwagon, right?

    That's not Patrick Stewart, that's Captain Jean-Luc Picard.

    jackjackbooinyoureyes
  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    Awong124 said:


    I was actually confused and had no idea what he was talking about either.

    That's because I didn't bring it up; I just alluded to it.

    My point was not about any one political incident (for one, we most likely don't live in the same country), but rather to vociferously disagree with your "political correctness has gone too far" statement. Not only has it not gone too far, almost by definition (the real definition, not the fake definition used by people who love to attack it) it can't go too far.

  • DisgruntlerDisgruntler Member Posts: 100

    <
    The difference is that neither Dynaheir nor Yoshimo get replaced by white people when they die, and nobody is demanding they be replaced by white people. People are demanding they be able to replace Hexxat with a white woman who they want to be straight/bi.

    Replacing a white woman with a black person is okay, but it turns into racism if a black woman is replaced by a white one? Good to know.
    Are there any other reasons against having the choice between Clara and Hexxat?

    QuartzQbertbooinyoureyes
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    DarkDogg said:

    1765 said:


    They are obviously a racist. If someone says that you're being racist, and explains why, and you think to yourself "no way am i racist I just like the look of white people more than black people its just preferences yeah", sorry to break it to you, but you have a racist mindset.

    It's hypercriticism.
    I think all this stuff about Hexxat and Clara is about compassion. Nothing more.

    hahaha
    you guys are crazy with this racism stuff.
    I'm not racist if I just prefer white girls.
    No, you're right, that doesn't make you racist to prefer white women over black women aesthetically. Demanding a black woman be replaced by a white woman after you kill her does, however, have pretty unfortunate implications.
    Mornmagor said:

    Ayiekie said:

    Actually... technically, Dynaheir totally does get replaced by a white woman.

    Ahahahah :p Aerie yeah.
    Holy shit...you're right.

  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,826

    <
    The difference is that neither Dynaheir nor Yoshimo get replaced by white people when they die, and nobody is demanding they be replaced by white people. People are demanding they be able to replace Hexxat with a white woman who they want to be straight/bi.

    Replacing a white woman with a black person is okay, but it turns into racism if a black woman is replaced by a white one? Good to know.
    Are there any other reasons against having the choice between Clara and Hexxat?
    Isn't internet social justice just the best?

    Qbertbooinyoureyes
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    edited November 2013
    Ayiekie said:

    Awong124 said:


    I was actually confused and had no idea what he was talking about either.

    That's because I didn't bring it up; I just alluded to it.

    My point was not about any one political incident (for one, we most likely don't live in the same country), but rather to vociferously disagree with your "political correctness has gone too far" statement. Not only has it not gone too far, almost by definition (the real definition, not the fake definition used by people who love to attack it) it can't go too far.

    It goes too far when it makes a mountain out of a mole hill. It goes too far when it takes generally innocuous comments and blow them out of proportion, humiliating the supposedly victimized party even more than they would have been originally. It has nothing to do with social awareness, but making an issue a bigger deal than it actually is.

    QuartzQbertbooinyoureyes
  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792


    Replacing a white woman with a black person is okay, but it turns into racism if a black woman is replaced by a white one? Good to know.

    Stop making me argue for the side I disagree with, please.

    Of course a narrative replacing a black woman with a white woman in fiction is going to be looked at more critically than if it happens the other way around. Do you honestly need someone to explain to you why that is?

    Purudaya
  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    Awong124 said:


    It goes too far when it makes a mountain out of a mole hill. It goes too far when it takes generally innocuous comments and blow them out of proportion, humiliating the supposedly victimized party even more than they would have been originally.

    I'm sure Hexxat will get over the humiliation, somehow. She's a pretty tough lady.

  • markthesharkmarktheshark Member Posts: 57
    Ayiekie said:

    Awong124 said:


    It goes too far when it makes a mountain out of a mole hill. It goes too far when it takes generally innocuous comments and blow them out of proportion, humiliating the supposedly victimized party even more than they would have been originally.

    I'm sure Hexxat will get over the humiliation, somehow. She's a pretty tough lady.

    Or, she'll just snack on the offenders like she did on Clara.

    Ayiekie
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    edited November 2013
    Ayiekie said:

    Awong124 said:


    It goes too far when it makes a mountain out of a mole hill. It goes too far when it takes generally innocuous comments and blow them out of proportion, humiliating the supposedly victimized party even more than they would have been originally.

    I'm sure Hexxat will get over the humiliation, somehow. She's a pretty tough lady.

    Then she also wouldn't mind people pointing out the fact that she's black and/or lesbian, making this whole discussion pointless.

    booinyoureyes
  • DarkDoggDarkDogg Member Posts: 598
    Strong logic guys:
    I'm a racist and a homophobe, because I don't like interracial gay porn.
    YOU MUST WATCH IT! No thanks, I better stay racist and homophobic.

    QuartzQbertbooinyoureyes
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190


    Replacing a white woman with a black person is okay, but it turns into racism if a black woman is replaced by a white one? Good to know.
    Are there any other reasons against having the choice between Clara and Hexxat?

    Again, as I've said time and again, that I would be fine with modders taking a crack at Cleric. And, as I have also repeatedly stated, the changeling aspect of Clara/Hexxat is fine. What I'm pointing out that has bigoted implications is the fan demand for Clara to be able to replace Hexxat. As I have also said many times, I wish Hexxat could be romanced by my male charname. She can't, and that's okay. Other people, on the other hand, are demanding to get back this brainless, servile white girl, whom they know virtually nothing about and hope is straight, because they got stuck with this black lesbian that is for some reason unsatisfactory.

    It has nothing to do with political correctness or social justice, but everything to do with the implications of what is being demanded. Desires aren't born in a vacuum, and there has yet to be a particularly good reason for why Overhaul's decision to give us RealHexxat is so appalling to some people.

  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    Awong124 said:


    Then she also wouldn't mind people pointing out the fact that she's black and/or lesbian.

    Sorry, I guess my desire to make a joke overshadowed my desire to be clear in the post you were responding to: Hexxat is not a real person. Her feelings in the matter are therefore both unknowable and irrelevant. She cannot be humiliated; nor can she be offended.

    If you're going to say "Then what's the problem?", I'll remind you Hexxat's feelings weren't a part of the discussion until quite recently.

  • jankieljankiel Member Posts: 127
    I stoped reading this topic when i saw 'racist'.

    Is it hard to understand that some people woud like Clara because she is not a bloody vampire? Because some would save her instead of letting a vampire ravage her? You know since vampires are major antagonists in the game it's only natural if you don't trust them? Even on an evil charname im pretty sceptical to the idea of having her on the team.

    So racism? Really?

    I don't give one crap about Hexxat's sexuality or skin color. She could be whatever and be even green. It's not an issue here! Why oh why people bring in this racial and sexual thing? WHY????? :)

    KvanTDisgruntlerQbertbooinyoureyes
  • QuartzQuartz Member Posts: 3,826

    Ayiekie said:



    Stop making me argue for the side I disagree with, please.

    Of course a narrative replacing a black woman with a white woman in fiction is going to be looked at more critically than if it happens the other way around. Do you honestly need someone to explain to you why that is?

    It gets better. The black woman being 'replaced' by the white one would be so only if the companions of the white woman manage to stop her murdering the very same white woman that she would have otherwise replaced.
    In a videogame!


    That spoiler ... oh jeez xD

  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    DarkDogg said:

    Strong logic guys:
    I'm a racist and a homophobe, because I don't like interracial gay porn.
    YOU MUST WATCH IT! No thanks, I better stay racist and homophobic.

    Nobody said anything like that. You're being silly.

  • AyiekieAyiekie Member Posts: 792
    22longZ said:

    Well, I kinda regret to have started this discussion. I was simply displeased with the fact that the idea of a Clara dlc cant be brought up without any bigotry or the accusation of bigotry. ... Cant we just get along and let those who like the idea express it? Am I really that naive that it cant be brought up in a internet forum?

    It can, but tempers are running high at the moment, due to the intense debate on the subject and the presence of several people who were actually bigots about it tainting the discussion.

    As a suggestion, if you want to talk about Clara, try to keep the discussion on Clara and not let it get into a Clara versus Hexxat discussion (I'm not saying you did or would do this; just that this is what is generally causing tempers to flare). Also keep in mind the game's not been out for very long; people will cool off with time. Probably.

    22longZ
  • SchneidendSchneidend Member Posts: 3,190
    DarkDogg said:

    Strong logic guys:
    I'm a racist and a homophobe, because I don't like interracial gay porn.
    YOU MUST WATCH IT! No thanks, I better stay racist and homophobic.

    That's a real nice strawman you have there. Nobody is forcing you to do anything, much less watch something you don't like. Still, the demand to replace Hexxat with Clara is like pointing at the interracial gay porn and demanding that one woman be replaced by a man (to make it not gay), and the black person be replaced by a white person (to make it not interracial), but leave everything else about the video exactly the same, instead of simply going and finding porn that DOES suit your tastes. THAT is what has racist implications.

  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    edited November 2013
    Ayiekie said:

    Awong124 said:


    Then she also wouldn't mind people pointing out the fact that she's black and/or lesbian.

    Sorry, I guess my desire to make a joke overshadowed my desire to be clear in the post you were responding to: Hexxat is not a real person. Her feelings in the matter are therefore both unknowable and irrelevant. She cannot be humiliated; nor can she be offended.

    If you're going to say "Then what's the problem?", I'll remind you Hexxat's feelings weren't a part of the discussion until quite recently.

    I never brought up Hexxat's "feelings". I was speaking in general terms. You said something about not being possible to be overly PC, and I responded with my comment. Actually, even my original comment in this thread had absolutely nothing to do with Hexxat. I was just commenting on political correctness in general. I personally have no opinion about Hexxat at this point at all, I haven't even bought the game yet. I'm just amused at people making such a big deal about other people's preferences and saying, "oh no, you can't say that, it's potentially offensive."

    QuartzQbert
This discussion has been closed.