I've found out a problem with the coding though If you eekeeper their class to something else they lose the ablitiy to use their own item -.- I changed cernd into a different druid kit and he couldn't use his items afterword
@Akuratheunseen: Yeah, I just checked out Cernd's items in NI and they're flagged as unusable by Totemic Druids and Avengers (which doesn't seem wholly necessary since they're flagged to be unusable by anyone whose name is not 'CERND' anyway).
@Akuratheunseen, @Eudaemonium, that's left over from the original game and probably not likely to change. The reason for the class limitations and minimum stat requirements, at least the only reason I can logically see, was because the original developers either 1) didn't want the player to be able to interchange the items on any character, or 2) wanted to make it as difficult as possible so that people just wouldn't bother trying (or would not think to try).
Noting, of course, that Use Any Item came in after Shadows of Amn, so you really wouldn't have been able to use those items unless you built your character in such a way that it mirrored the character the item was intended for.
Anyway, since it causes such unrest, I'll get a mod uploaded by the end of the week. Maybe sooner.
Funny.. i found back that old original BG2 tips&tricks for HLA page... the section for UAI was beautiful .. )) http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/SpellsReference/HighLevelAbilities.htm I can't resist the pleasure to paste the best part / UIA (precisely) : -------------------------- "Use Any Item An insanely powerful ability, the first any rogue should pick. Ignores not only class restrictions but also alignment restrictions, race restrictions and "NPC only" restrictions (meaning you can equip items useable only by specific NPCs). Equip any armor, wield any weapon, and (probably the best of all) read any scroll.
Some tastes of what this could get you:
Read a Mislead scroll and start backstabbing. Equip your Fighter/Thief with Carsomyr, Human Flesh, the Amulet of Seldarine and the Ring of Gaxx for 90% magic resistance. If you got the Good Selfishness Tear in Hell you top off at 100%. Imprisonment, Time Stop, Abi-Dalzim's Horrid Wilting, Simulacrum, Project Image, Protection from Magic Weapons, Tenser's Transformation, Stoneskin... all within your grasp. All you need is scrolls. Equip Hear’Dalis' Chaos Blade and kill enemies by draining their Dexterity to zero. Equip your Kensai/Thief with armor, bracers, helmets, shields and ranged weapons. Equip your Wizard Slayer/Thief with all the magic items you want. Equip your Cleric/Thief with the Robe of Vecna to just about halve all your Casting Times. Equip the Staff of the Magi to turn invisible any time, anywhere. " ---------------------------- Well.. bye bye Haer Dal' funny little short sword, etc, etc so..in EE vanilla) Well2..next time i find a Balduran item, i will carefully see if i have the exact same body stats..we never know.. *)))) [mod noted..seems perfectly fine to me..and must have at least..sooo..ok! weird all the same not in standard..but well..k^^!]
It is extremely annoying to me that the Use Any Item HLA was nerfed so badly. Thank you for the fix, Troodon.
I find it amusing that there are players so abjectly pitiful at the game that losing the ability to equip NPC specific items feels harsh and unfair. Seriously, which fight were you unable to beat without Valygar's stuff? Or Anomen/Keldorn/Mazzy's etc? If you let us know, I'm sure the community can suggest some strats.
I think it's a principle issue rather than an issue with not being able to use them, or having to use them. I doubt I would have noticed if I hadn't explicitly designed a character around the idea of using Valygar's armour. It's more a question of 'why can't someone able to use any item use any item?'
I actually like the change overall since it means I can create items specifically for certain characters.
It is extremely annoying to me that the Use Any Item HLA was nerfed so badly. Thank you for the fix, Troodon.
I find it amusing that there are players so abjectly pitiful at the game that losing the ability to equip NPC specific items feels harsh and unfair. Seriously, which fight were you unable to beat without Valygar's stuff? Or Anomen/Keldorn/Mazzy's etc? If you let us know, I'm sure the community can suggest some strats.
That's a bit rich after seeing your complaints in the Free Action thread...
Rather than calling people pitiful you should accept that some people find the ability more fun if it works exactly as advertised. It doesn't mean they think the game is too hard without it.
And if someone is struggling with the game, so what? It's not a bad thing.
It is extremely annoying to me that the Use Any Item HLA was nerfed so badly. Thank you for the fix, Troodon.
I find it amusing that there are players so abjectly pitiful at the game that losing the ability to equip NPC specific items feels harsh and unfair. Seriously, which fight were you unable to beat without Valygar's stuff? Or Anomen/Keldorn/Mazzy's etc? If you let us know, I'm sure the community can suggest some strats.
None, and stop being condescending. No gear is "strictly necessary", not when I can run an entire naked party and beat Throne of Bhaal on Insane. Notice that I said it was "annoying", not "unreasonable" or "unfair". I, like many others, enjoy having the option to access that gear because some of it is quite useful, and "Use Any Item" is one of the major reasons to make a Fighter/Thief CHARNAME. The personalized item in question that I always made use of was Jan's Adventurewear because in ToB AC becomes less important as To Hit bonuses skyrocket and the damage resistance that it offers makes Fighter/Thief characters much more durable.
Do we NEED these items? No. But realistically, you don't need ANY items. They're just nice to have for one reason or another, and some people enjoyed making use of them. Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate II have much to do with the strategy of character building, and Use Any Item is absolutely something that many have chosen as an end goal for their character. They are 100% justified in wanting it reverted to what it was because the change removed options that were previously available to us.
Keep in mind, I'm all for the character-specific items only being able to be used by them without UAI. I thought it was pretty silly that my Monk could use Keldorn's Full Plate when statted properly.
Edit:
@Cyteen Of course you would post as I was writing. Apology accepted.
Some items really just shouldn't be taken. I like the idea in terms of roleplay of certain characters not letting you take their items out of their inventory (like Edwin with his necklace). Why would Keldorn, Valygar or Anomen allow some random bearded gnome who enjoys turnip tales use their precious family heirlooms?
lol.. soooo... yes, only Balduran should ever be able to use his gears.. makes perfect sense for the whole serie thing with items from the past too...
Anyway.. I don't see the problem, personnaly, if a real professional rogue by trade can be among the very first to be able to find the way to adapt and/or use a unique item (through his very special high level UAI ability..not your basic pro rogue too^), before everyone else (so far only the owner knew how to use or wear it correctly, bla etc)... honnestly, i had/have no problem with that (made/makes kinda sense too) ^ ..and i suppose that's exactly why so many (named' items from the past are now perfectly available to everyone..like good old Balduran gears. ^ Voilà.. lore curiosity/thing explained. *)
Anyway.... that is indeed not really annoying for the BG2 gameplay (yes, at the end, that is, here, changing almost nothing (though..as quoted in the above article i resurrected -circa 200x-, the special effects from the Haer'Dalis little sword can always be used, if you want to play very smart and exploit every possible little things^..always indirectly very powerful too^) ..those items are not ToB levels anyway^) .. just totally dumb for the lore logics lol. (so, at that moment, the reverse is true too; why not keep it that way and basta^).
That is funny to observe, though, that when a few people want to change something from the old mechanism.. they sure can visibly !... But when that is touching to another thing they don't want to touch (aka obviously very weird and original obviously weird Free Action mechanisms...with multiple differently acting items/etc, and/or even 'exploits' according the order you use or put the items.. -talking about a logical mess too here^!- = lol).. but weirdly, there, there is a total acceptance to the fact that, strangely, there, 'nothing must or can be changed', 'if that was like that, therre was a reason for that (there)'!, etc.. )) .. yes, i see too the logics here...
Anyway, that mod seems to be perfectly fair to me.. and the change from the original UAI not that critical for BG2 as it is (with the items in question), but..good a possible patch (original behaviour) is there... all the same. *))
@booinyoureyes /the 'family heirlooms', yes, at least that could make sense i guess /'family heirlooms', well seen!..though amongst friends, for a temporary lapse of time, i don't see a problem they could agree to temporarily give/exchange their things (for the good of the team).. and if the team using them is evil well..murder (just for gears) is a thing that seems to happen with those evil teams too apparently..even to rob you from your very beloved family golden pistols/stamps or whatever..^ )
anyway.. that one is not too important i guess.. as a separated patch is very easy to do indeed..at least for the guys who bought the game and knew the forum and so, knew such a patch was available (and/or for the ones knowing how to use the quick mod tools)..for the others well.. bad luck.. but that's ok, k.. //
Why would Keldorn, Valygar or Anomen allow some random bearded gnome who enjoys turnip tales use their precious family heirlooms?
That makes sense with Edwin because you cannot unequip the item, however, how are the rest of these guys going to stop you once you have removed it from them and placed it in Mainchar's inventory?
Why would Keldorn, Valygar or Anomen allow some random bearded gnome who enjoys turnip tales use their precious family heirlooms?
That makes sense with Edwin because you cannot unequip the item, however, how are the rest of these guys going to stop you once you have removed it from them and placed it in Mainchar's inventory?
For those ones, 'the locked" ones..i always had a very simple explanation (like for the Imoen not removable belt btw); those ones are really magical ones totally linked to their owners (created with a life force connection, whatever..) )..they die, they disappear.. that's all. and neh. I could at least understand the restriction on those ones, though.. k. )
ps; more seriously, both of those 'personal' items seems to be well differentiated in the file 'item_use.2da' ; totally not removable have a flag '1' (Alora, Edwin, Nalia, 'Ohhfak'/Hexxat'...), others a simple flag '2'. seems logical to me that way too.. (but nowww..if someone wants to change that flag..sss..i said nothing of course..as i would not see the point too, especially the edwin ring..'said nothing.. *// ).
Comments
Hexxat spoiler:
I'm sure there are plenty of people out there who just want to powergame, and there will undoubtably be a mod soon that allows you 'real UAI'.
Noting, of course, that Use Any Item came in after Shadows of Amn, so you really wouldn't have been able to use those items unless you built your character in such a way that it mirrored the character the item was intended for.
Anyway, since it causes such unrest, I'll get a mod uploaded by the end of the week. Maybe sooner.
http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/SpellsReference/HighLevelAbilities.htm
I can't resist the pleasure to paste the best part / UIA (precisely)
--------------------------
"Use Any Item
An insanely powerful ability, the first any rogue should pick. Ignores not only class restrictions but also alignment restrictions, race restrictions and "NPC only" restrictions (meaning you can equip items useable only by specific NPCs). Equip any armor, wield any weapon, and (probably the best of all) read any scroll.
Some tastes of what this could get you:
Read a Mislead scroll and start backstabbing.
Equip your Fighter/Thief with Carsomyr, Human Flesh, the Amulet of Seldarine and the Ring of Gaxx for 90% magic resistance. If you got the Good Selfishness Tear in Hell you top off at 100%.
Imprisonment, Time Stop, Abi-Dalzim's Horrid Wilting, Simulacrum, Project Image, Protection from Magic Weapons, Tenser's Transformation, Stoneskin... all within your grasp. All you need is scrolls.
Equip Hear’Dalis' Chaos Blade and kill enemies by draining their Dexterity to zero.
Equip your Kensai/Thief with armor, bracers, helmets, shields and ranged weapons.
Equip your Wizard Slayer/Thief with all the magic items you want.
Equip your Cleric/Thief with the Robe of Vecna to just about halve all your Casting Times.
Equip the Staff of the Magi to turn invisible any time, anywhere. "
----------------------------
Well.. bye bye Haer Dal' funny little short sword, etc, etc so..in EE vanilla)
Well2..next time i find a Balduran item, i will carefully see if i have the exact same body stats..we never know.. *))))
[mod noted..seems perfectly fine to me..and must have at least..sooo..ok! weird all the same not in standard..but well..k^^!]
I actually like the change overall since it means I can create items specifically for certain characters.
Rather than calling people pitiful you should accept that some people find the ability more fun if it works exactly as advertised. It doesn't mean they think the game is too hard without it.
And if someone is struggling with the game, so what? It's not a bad thing.
Do we NEED these items? No. But realistically, you don't need ANY items. They're just nice to have for one reason or another, and some people enjoyed making use of them. Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate II have much to do with the strategy of character building, and Use Any Item is absolutely something that many have chosen as an end goal for their character. They are 100% justified in wanting it reverted to what it was because the change removed options that were previously available to us.
Keep in mind, I'm all for the character-specific items only being able to be used by them without UAI. I thought it was pretty silly that my Monk could use Keldorn's Full Plate when statted properly.
Edit:
@Cyteen
Of course you would post as I was writing. Apology accepted.
I agree with the sentiment of your post though
I would never try it. Not my cup of tea
Why would Keldorn, Valygar or Anomen allow some random bearded gnome who enjoys turnip tales use their precious family heirlooms?
Anyway.. I don't see the problem, personnaly, if a real professional rogue by trade can be among the very first to be able to find the way to adapt and/or use a unique item (through his very special high level UAI ability..not your basic pro rogue too^), before everyone else (so far only the owner knew how to use or wear it correctly, bla etc)... honnestly, i had/have no problem with that (made/makes kinda sense too) ^ ..and i suppose that's exactly why so many (named' items from the past are now perfectly available to everyone..like good old Balduran gears. ^ Voilà.. lore curiosity/thing explained. *)
Anyway.... that is indeed not really annoying for the BG2 gameplay (yes, at the end, that is, here, changing almost nothing (though..as quoted in the above article i resurrected -circa 200x-, the special effects from the Haer'Dalis little sword can always be used, if you want to play very smart and exploit every possible little things^..always indirectly very powerful too^) ..those items are not ToB levels anyway^) .. just totally dumb for the lore logics lol. (so, at that moment, the reverse is true too; why not keep it that way and basta^).
That is funny to observe, though, that when a few people want to change something from the old mechanism.. they sure can visibly !... But when that is touching to another thing they don't want to touch (aka obviously very weird and original obviously weird Free Action mechanisms...with multiple differently acting items/etc, and/or even 'exploits' according the order you use or put the items.. -talking about a logical mess too here^!- = lol).. but weirdly, there, there is a total acceptance to the fact that, strangely, there, 'nothing must or can be changed', 'if that was like that, therre was a reason for that (there)'!, etc.. )) .. yes, i see too the logics here...
Anyway, that mod seems to be perfectly fair to me.. and the change from the original UAI not that critical for BG2 as it is (with the items in question), but..good a possible patch (original behaviour) is there... all the same. *))
@booinyoureyes /the 'family heirlooms', yes, at least that could make sense i guess /'family heirlooms', well seen!..though amongst friends, for a temporary lapse of time, i don't see a problem they could agree to temporarily give/exchange their things (for the good of the team).. and if the team using them is evil well..murder (just for gears) is a thing that seems to happen with those evil teams too apparently..even to rob you from your very beloved family golden pistols/stamps or whatever..^ )
anyway.. that one is not too important i guess.. as a separated patch is very easy to do indeed..at least for the guys who bought the game and knew the forum and so, knew such a patch was available (and/or for the ones knowing how to use the quick mod tools)..for the others well.. bad luck.. but that's ok, k.. //
ps; more seriously, both of those 'personal' items seems to be well differentiated in the file 'item_use.2da' ; totally not removable have a flag '1' (Alora, Edwin, Nalia, 'Ohhfak'/Hexxat'...), others a simple flag '2'.
seems logical to me that way too..