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Weirdness

LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
edited August 2012 in Archive (General Discussion)
Isn't it strange that by the end of Baldur's Gate 2, you get access to the spell, "Wish", which is one of the most powerful spells in the game (in both Pen and Paper and this game), but you can never Wish for Aerie to get her wings back?

I mean, if you are a good aligned character, shouldn't that be something that should occur to you?
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Comments

  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    Its one of those things that developers hope the players forget about.

    Its not like there aren't cases of characters in the Forgotten Realms regrowing limbs.
  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,345
    I'd say it seems like a pretty natural result of including a spell with more or less limitless outcomes in a game where you're forced to put a pretty sharp limit on it.

    I can see how a reworking of wish with about a hundred new options added might be cool.. but on the other hand, it'd just add even more versatility to the class that needs it the least.
  • DrugarDrugar Member Posts: 1,566
    Doesn't one of the ToB pimping mods give you the option to use your Godly powers to give Aerie her wings back? But yes, Wish (or hell, even Regeneration) should do the trick. Possibly even just killing her, destroying the body and casting Resurrection, which provides a pristine new body for habitation.
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    edited August 2012
    @Tathalas I mean, not even in Aerie's ending is this addressed... Where, you think, this might be a good deed for one of the characters to do. But, eh, in my world, I at least gave her an item that allows her to fly... even if I can't regrow her wings, let her regain the feeling of flight. Heck, she apparently never thinks to do this to herself, either, so...

    @Drugar It's like the AD&D version of Aladdin's Genie Powers. AWESOME COSMIC POWER- no imagination.
  • ajwzajwz Member Posts: 4,122
    I'd like wish to have many more options as well - stuff like bringing "gibbed" characters back from the dead, changing a characters race, class, alignment and gender, Reallocating stat points, stuff like this. Wish is really underwhelming, even in comaparison to limited wish. All of its options were almost strictly combat related.
  • Kitteh_On_A_CloudKitteh_On_A_Cloud Member Posts: 1,629
    Hmm, Wish is indeed underwhelming. But from a developer's point of view, the spell HAD to be limited, otherwise it would disturb the game's balance. I wonder why they even included it in the first place. Well, at least I've never felt the need to use it myself.
  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,345
    The one imaginative part is where you can wish for an adventure that you've never had before I suppose. Other than that it's likely more used as an in-combat rest.
  • KasonKason Member Posts: 30
    Not bad idea, 1PP even made wings for BG paperdolls:
    http://www.shsforums.net/files/file/682-1pp-attachable-wings/
  • taletotelltaletotell Member Posts: 74
    This is more a problem with the forgotten realms than it is BG. Being able to wish away any problem takes away the point of playing the game. The idea is you have limits and have to work within them to overcome the problems. Aerie gets over her loss, just like you don't wish to have Gorion back. If you could fix problems like that the game wouldn't feel real anymore.
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    I mean, I understand that in the game, you are going to want to use it for combat stuff. But it should give you the options of 1) World's Best Resurrection Spell, 2) Allowing Stat Increases (1 point per wish- but also give it the same drawbacks as in the game, you know, 3 years of aging per Wish, 1 per Limited Wish), 3) Perhaps not allowing Aerie to get her wings back in-game, but afterwards, yeah. (maybe her fears of enclosed/underground spaces come back with her wings, making it impossible for her to enter dungeons and underground areas if she gets her wings back too soon...), 4) Allowing you to cast any other spell with maximum range, damage and so on. (I haven't actually gained Wish in the game at the time I had to upgrade my computer system, so I am unsure of the spell's actual use in the game. Forgive me if I say something the spell actually already covers.)
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    @talertotell I didn't even suggest using it to resurrect anyone who isn't in your party. I mean Jaheira is upset about Khalid's death at the beginning of BG2, but she also flatly refuses to raise him (and you can lose her from your party if you keep suggesting/strongly insist on it). Maybe your character knows Gorion didn't want to be resurrected in case of Death (I mean, he raised you, you would know such a thing if he felt this way, presumably), or after you find out he lied to you about your mother, you might not WANT to bring him back. I'm not suggesting it as an "Automatic Win" button, because its the Gods who grant these wishes, but... Aerie's non-romantic ending suggests she isn't as copacetic about the loss of her wings as she pretends to be. So, if you are a good character, at the ending, why not be able to fix that?
  • DelvarianDelvarian Member Posts: 1,232
    Resurrection in BG world (and D&D in general) has always been a problem for me. It makes people's deaths so less meaningful. "Oh well, let's haul him off to the temple". It makes no sense that Jaheira doesn't want to res Khalid (aside from making Jahiera romanceable) especially due to the fact that if I used Khalid in the first BG game I probably resurrected him tons of times.
    As far as wishing for Aeries wings, I like the idea, what a nice use for the wish spell. My guess would be that the Devs never thought about it. Wish is a bad spell to implement into a videogame because it's to open. You can wish for anything (more wishes :P). You can't put that in a videogame, it's impossible to guess everything someone may want to wish.
  • KasonKason Member Posts: 30
    @Delvarian There was a reference in BG2 why Khalid couldn't be resurected. It was something about the fact if someone stay "dead" for long time there is a point when he cannot be brought back to life.
  • lmaoboatlmaoboat Member Posts: 72
    Resurrection in BG world (and D&D in general) has always been a problem for me. It makes people's deaths so less meaningful. "Oh well, let's haul him off to the temple". It makes no sense that Jaheira doesn't want to res Khalid (aside from making Jahiera romanceable) especially due to the fact that if I used Khalid in the first BG game I probably resurrected him tons of times.
    As far as wishing for Aeries wings, I like the idea, what a nice use for the wish spell. My guess would be that the Devs never thought about it. Wish is a bad spell to implement into a videogame because it's to open. You can wish for anything (more wishes :P). You can't put that in a videogame, it's impossible to guess everything someone may want to wish.
    Yeah, that's always bugged me. The game makes raising the dead to seem pretty easy, but whenever someone plot-related dies, it's like the spell never existed.
  • AndrewRogueAndrewRogue Member Posts: 72
    Aerie's wings, in general, are a case where you really need to handwave basic DnD spellcasting. As pointed out, there are several, far easier ways then Wish to have done it.
  • TanthalasTanthalas Member Posts: 6,738
    edited August 2012
    LadyRhian said:

    Maybe your character knows Gorion didn't want to be resurrected in case of Death (I mean, he raised you, you would know such a thing if he felt this way, presumably)

    I'm pretty sure that one of the scrolls on Gorion's body was a signed DNR.
    Post edited by Tanthalas on
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    I wouldn't give her the wings even if it was an option in the game. She whines about it too much.
  • MornmagorMornmagor Member Posts: 1,160
    Even a regeneration spell should grow her wings back, it doens't state that after some time regeneration doesn't work, but even so, a wish or a miracle should do it anyway.

    Oh well.
  • morgy321morgy321 Member Posts: 36
    call me mad but i kinda did like the deck of many things my self

    sure its had to use but sure is funny
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    @Tanthalas Or the Realmsian equivalent... ;)

    @Awong Meanie. ;)

    I think it would be more realistic, if she really *wasn't* upset about her wings, to be more concerned about people seeing her back. Even if her wings had to be amputated, her back probably didn't look like a normal elven back because of the way muscles for those wings would lie. And they couldn't have amputaed those without giving her problems lifting and raising her arms.

    Yes, I am a writer, and yes, I officially think too much.
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    edited August 2012
    @LadyRhian

    I'm normally a nice guy, but Aerie's just way too annoying, everything from her voice to her comments. When I play BG2 I usually just kill her when she still looks like an ogre.
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    edited August 2012
    Tanthalas said:

    LadyRhian said:

    Maybe your character knows Gorion didn't want to be resurrected in case of Death (I mean, he raised you, you would know such a thing if he felt this way, presumably)

    I'm pretty sure that one of the scrolls on Gorion's body was a signed DNR.
    Probably also says Organ Donor.

    *Dammit, should have just edited this post into the previous one.
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    @Awong I had Skie in my party from BG1. She was like, Proto-Aerie. When she goes adventuring, she complains about everything and everywhere. The city, the forest, the underground... everything makes her whinge, moan and complain. One of her actual lines is "Aaah! I broke a nail!" and another mentioned her hair being messy. In fact, she is *so* annoying, I almost enjoyed the way Eldoth treated her. And aside from an 18 Dex, there isn't much to like about her.
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    @LadyRhian

    I've never used Skie, but at least she sounds annoying in a hilarious sort of way.
  • Space_hamsterSpace_hamster Member Posts: 950
    I always dump aerie in a dungeon early on, she is way too whiny for me.
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    @Awong http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6mnag21fpo
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    edited August 2012
    I find Skie's comments pretty hilarious actually. And her voice isn't annoying like Aerie.
  • LadyRhianLadyRhian Member Posts: 14,694
    @Awong My mileage does vary, in this case. And listening to her for long stretches at a time tries my patience.
  • Awong124Awong124 Member Posts: 2,643
    I actually find Minsc pretty annoying. I kill him too, but he miraculously reappears in BG2, then I leave him to rot in his cell.
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