It probably is SCS, and it's not exactly intentional, but it's awkward to fix. The problem is that BG2 designates creatures as Innocent via their class slot, which means that something can't be simultaneously Innocent and a mage. That's a problem because being flagged as Mage class makes a significant difference to how spells' levels are worked out and how other scripts treat them (at least in vBG2; come to think of it, it might be a bit easier in BG2EE). There is a workaround in SCS but it's pretty partial and I suspect it's glitching here. When I next have time to work on the mod (don't hold your breath) I'll see if it's improvable.
One, the reality point : no-one witnesses the act, it can't affect reputation (another unsolved mystery murder...)
Well, to counter the reality point, murders do get solved without any direct witnesses to the act.
Now granted, Forgotten Realms forensic science isn't going to have DNA tests or fingerprinting, but they can still ask questions. Perhaps the group of people across the street saw your party go into the house, heard some screaming, and shortly thereafter saw you leave the house wiping blood from your sword.
Their testimony would be plenty to get your party convicted, without any direct witnesses to the actual killing.
And even without the screaming and wiping of blood, simply being seen going in and out of the victim's house could affect your party's reputation, even if it didn't lead to a murder conviction.
One, the reality point : no-one witnesses the act, it can't affect reputation (another unsolved mystery murder...)
Well, to counter the reality point, murders do get solved without any direct witnesses to the act.
Now granted, Forgotten Realms forensic science isn't going to have DNA tests or fingerprinting, but they can still ask questions. Perhaps the group of people across the street saw your party go into the house, heard some screaming, and shortly thereafter saw you leave the house wiping blood from your sword.
Their testimony would be plenty to get your party convicted, without any direct witnesses to the actual killing.
And even without the screaming and wiping of blood, simply being seen going in and out of the victim's house could affect your party's reputation, even if it didn't lead to a murder conviction.
Don't forget, there's also the spell Speak With The Dead in AD&D. Who needs forensics when you could just ask the corpse, "Who killed you?" :-)
Seriously, this thread is just a dispute between the "I want every magical item in the game" and "I want some balance and reason in the game" people. I'm all for rep hits for murdering innocent people just to get items - we all know thats the real reason for killing them not some "he stole 15 gp from me so I killed him lol".
Since it's in the general bg ee section of the forum and it's nowhere marked as scs topic, I think it's a right place for this discussion. I checked and Landrin and Unshey are indeed giving rep loss when killed but zhurlong and pheirkas are issues in my opinion. Anyway I'll start another topic for them.
@karnor00 - in the FR, there are so many ways for someone (or some[b]thing[/b]) to kill someone else, that without some direct evidence to the contrary, it is going to be very difficult to convict here.
Magical invisibility, magical disguises (doppelganger, etc), Invisible Stalkers, Air Elementals, Water Elementals, Earth Elementals, camouflage effects, etc!
"Your Honor, yes, we did visit Mr. X on the night of Y, but when we left Mr. X was alive and well...if a bit shaken up. Perhaps it was one of his many enemies? After all, there are sooo many different ways that one could have had Mr. X done away with...might I suggest a few?"
@AstroBryGuy - yes, there is Speak with the Dead and also Speak with Inanimate Object, Stonetell, etc!
All many of divination type spells.
But they are hardly good ways of producing reliable witness! After all, they can be faked, can't they?
"Your Honor...I feel...I feel a presence...SILENCE! Someone here is disturbing the ether with negative thoughts! Ahh, better...yes...yes...YES! It is the spirit of the deceased...it...she...she is trying to say something...something...it is becoming clearer..." *opens eyes, glances at *
"She has named as her murderer, your Honor!"
Says the paid "Wizard" representing Mr. Y.
So how can the Magistrate (representing Law and Order here) be sure that the "Wizard" in question here really is speaking with the dead (or using any other type of spell or effect)? After all, only the "Wizard" gets this direct information...and even then, who is to say (in the case that all can see the apparation or hear the words) that is not just a different spell, simulating another?
Think of how easy it would be to abuse such power, and how the Rich and Powerful would throng to do so - resulting in chaos within a short span of time!
Any society would soon tumble into chaos in a short amount of time based on such a system, since it is not foolproof.
I don't think may FR realms are states of law in the modern sense. If there is jurisdiction, it's bound to be wildly varying, arbitrary and overall very "medieval"
So, I guess the examples above can't really be applied. But this tpoic is sure getting out of hand!
Comments
Now granted, Forgotten Realms forensic science isn't going to have DNA tests or fingerprinting, but they can still ask questions. Perhaps the group of people across the street saw your party go into the house, heard some screaming, and shortly thereafter saw you leave the house wiping blood from your sword.
Their testimony would be plenty to get your party convicted, without any direct witnesses to the actual killing.
And even without the screaming and wiping of blood, simply being seen going in and out of the victim's house could affect your party's reputation, even if it didn't lead to a murder conviction.
http://pandaria.rpgworlds.info/cant/rules/adnd_spells.htm#Speak With The Dead
I'm all for rep hits for murdering innocent people just to get items - we all know thats the real reason for killing them not some "he stole 15 gp from me so I killed him lol".
Magical invisibility, magical disguises (doppelganger, etc), Invisible Stalkers, Air Elementals, Water Elementals, Earth Elementals, camouflage effects, etc!
"Your Honor, yes, we did visit Mr. X on the night of Y, but when we left Mr. X was alive and well...if a bit shaken up. Perhaps it was one of his many enemies? After all, there are sooo many different ways that one could have had Mr. X done away with...might I suggest a few?"
@AstroBryGuy - yes, there is Speak with the Dead and also Speak with Inanimate Object, Stonetell, etc!
All many of divination type spells.
But they are hardly good ways of producing reliable witness! After all, they can be faked, can't they?
"Your Honor...I feel...I feel a presence...SILENCE! Someone here is disturbing the ether with negative thoughts! Ahh, better...yes...yes...YES! It is the spirit of the deceased...it...she...she is trying to say something...something...it is becoming clearer..." *opens eyes, glances at *
"She has named as her murderer, your Honor!"
Says the paid "Wizard" representing Mr. Y.
So how can the Magistrate (representing Law and Order here) be sure that the "Wizard" in question here really is speaking with the dead (or using any other type of spell or effect)? After all, only the "Wizard" gets this direct information...and even then, who is to say (in the case that all can see the apparation or hear the words) that is not just a different spell, simulating another?
Think of how easy it would be to abuse such power, and how the Rich and Powerful would throng to do so - resulting in chaos within a short span of time!
Any society would soon tumble into chaos in a short amount of time based on such a system, since it is not foolproof.
So, I guess the examples above can't really be applied. But this tpoic is sure getting out of hand!