Shadowdancers
mumumomo
Member Posts: 635
A few recent posts describe the shadowdancer as an interesting thief kit.
However i really don't understand why (at least from a mechanical point of view)
- it's a kit so it's either for single or dual class. For dual, due to limited skill points progression, you are basically forced to put everything in HIS/MS, which severly limits your efficiency as a thief.
For their special bonus :
- +1 to saving throws is nice but hardly decisive
- HIPS allows you to rehide mid fight. This is nice but you can anyway use corners to do that, whatever your kit.
- shadowstep is also quite good but it seems quite redundant with HIPS. Furthermore, there is other ways to get away from a fight (invisibility from potions or rings)
For their malus :
- 15 skill points/level. That's as bad as an assassin. The problem, once more is that this class focus on HIS/MS which are very expensive to get to interesting levels.
- worse backstab multiplier
- no HLA traps.
Overall i could argue that the kit is weaker than a vanilla thief (easily replicable bonus, harsh penalties).
Furthermore other thieves kits are great :
- swashbucklers are basically Fighter/Thieves without backstab
- assassin have the ultimately OP poison weapon and an improved backstab multiplier.
- bounty hunters are great if you like traps
Could someone explain to me why they think the class is good? Or is it only for RP purpose (they are indeed quite nice for that)
However i really don't understand why (at least from a mechanical point of view)
- it's a kit so it's either for single or dual class. For dual, due to limited skill points progression, you are basically forced to put everything in HIS/MS, which severly limits your efficiency as a thief.
For their special bonus :
- +1 to saving throws is nice but hardly decisive
- HIPS allows you to rehide mid fight. This is nice but you can anyway use corners to do that, whatever your kit.
- shadowstep is also quite good but it seems quite redundant with HIPS. Furthermore, there is other ways to get away from a fight (invisibility from potions or rings)
For their malus :
- 15 skill points/level. That's as bad as an assassin. The problem, once more is that this class focus on HIS/MS which are very expensive to get to interesting levels.
- worse backstab multiplier
- no HLA traps.
Overall i could argue that the kit is weaker than a vanilla thief (easily replicable bonus, harsh penalties).
Furthermore other thieves kits are great :
- swashbucklers are basically Fighter/Thieves without backstab
- assassin have the ultimately OP poison weapon and an improved backstab multiplier.
- bounty hunters are great if you like traps
Could someone explain to me why they think the class is good? Or is it only for RP purpose (they are indeed quite nice for that)
0
Comments
personally I found it tedious it has some good applications for dual classing tho.
I don't see how it can compare positively compared to assassin or swash dual.
It allows you for the cheesiest tricks and now I can't see a more powerful kit than this one, you can cancel so much spells by turning invisibible or using Shadowstep which acts like a Time Stop.
Ultimately this class has been created either for RP or for massive cheese, I mean the tools offered by this kit are only usable by cheesing. You can hide, select your weapon to start leaving shadows, wait the 6 secs then backstab, hide again immediately and repeat which break the game.
If you're willing to use the kit to its fullest, I can't see anything stronger.
Seriously, after the Shadowdancer had been nerfed (with a 6 seconds cooldown period) this class became uninteresting to me. Chain backstabs were so good, although they were considered OP by some people, but they were cool.
Now I prefer an Assassin. This kit is much more both entertaining and powerful than the Shadowdancer.
Alternatively you could also probably take advantage of the shadow twin and use it for scrolls, wands, and charged items.
@Gotural, In multi i can see the point of the class.
But the thing is multi kit are not allowed by the defaut game engine. And let's face it single class thieves suck incredibly in fighting (i really don't think dual shadow dancer -> something can work unless you are willing to dual very late).
The repetitive HIPS tactic may work but it's incredibly boring and tedious (at least for me). Furthermore all thieves can do it by using corners or the staff of the magi (with UAI)
@FinneousPJ, infinite invisibility is indeed very nice but :
- a lot of strong opponents see through invisibility
- getting an "invicible" character who has weak offense and is unable to take damage for others (he will not be targeted) seems quite useless though. As an alternative (slight exageration) you could park your thief on a corner of the map...
That sounds pretty nasty.
Not really nasty if you ask me.