Reason to choose crossbow proficiency in BG1
Eck4343
Member Posts: 38
I'm wondering what if any are the advantages of choosing proficiency in crossbows as opposed to long or short bows in BG1. It seems that with the latter that good ammo is constantly being dropped and that the only way to get crossbow bolts is to buy them. Are there any reasons, other than RPing, that one would choose this proficiency?
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That said, I'm not a big fan of crossbows... It just isn't enough if a "hero" weapon for me.
The Army Scythe has been mentioned.
But wow, is it ever expensive!
With some of my characters, xbows just make a lot more sense. But then that is an RP decision, after all.
As for the rest… they wield shortbows.
Also wanted to add that you can get 2 Army Scythes in BG2 if you work it properly.
Crossbows: 1d8, 1 APR
That said, the Crossbow of Speed will put you on par with bows with APR and you'll still have the increased damage. That said, the Crossbow of Speed is +1 THAC0 +1 Damage, so 1d8+1, vs. Long Bow of Marksmanship +3 THAC0 +2 Damage, so 1d6+2, and the Composite Long Bow +1, which is +2 THAC0 +3 Damage, so 1d6+3 ... Still not really worth it as you can see.
I think an often overlooked item is the Heavy Crossbow of Accuracy, +5 THAC0 +2 Damage. You don't get the extra APR, but I'd argue the extra THAC0 makes up for it in the case of Baldur's Gate 1. Not so much in BGII.
As mentioned Crossbow ammo can kick pretty serious ass.
I'd argue that Crossbows are certainly worth using for one character in your party, but the rest should be wielding bows and darts ... except for your damn Clerics who have to use shitty slings. Seriously, screw slings.
Shortbows automatically have 2 APR, and they have other nifty bonuses such as the capability of hitting things up to +4 in immunities, which crossbows sorely lack.
And if APR is important to you: think again, my dear unenlightenable - the Tuigan Shortbow has the same damage and thac0 bonuses as the Army's Scythe, and has 1 more APR than it does, making it far superior.
The only reason to choose crossbow IMO is that you eventually run out of good things to give your party members, since you can't dupe items, so giving them the Firetooth after another archer already has the Gesen's might be worthwhile.
In terms of advantages in BG1 I think others have pretty well covered it. You can get the Heavy Crossbow of Accuracy, which provides more accuracy than the best longbow, but that comes at the cost of APR.
A crossbow is great on a fighter type like Dorn who can get more than 1 APR with 2 proficiency pips but only use them once in a while. This would only be used when you want to soften up an ememy before charging in for melee.
Dorn (or an assassin) with poison active plus light crossbow of speed means he can make sure that pesky mage in the back is disabled before anyone could reach him with melee. It also works well with a Blade charname using Offensive Spin.
The heavy crossbow of accuracy is okay in a pinch if you have some magical bolts you want to use but don't have any pips in crossbows. Or if you got lucky and found a bolt of polymorph and you really really want to make sure it hits. :-)
On a slightly related note: What do people think about slings as a competitor to the long/short/cross bows? I sometimes wonder what it would be like to have a warrior take a sling over a different launcher. The way I see it, slings have potential do some pretty massive damage output. They suffer from a similar APR issue to crossbows but their ammo and launcher options are almost as good as their competitors in both games and lets not forget that they add strength to damage in both games now. In BG1 We get a sling +3 which is, if I am not mistaken, the highest enchantment launcher in BG1 since it does +3 to both attack and damage. On top of that bullets +2 are fairly easy to come by and putting the two together does great things. It only gets better in BG2 when you get awesome slings like Errine and Everrard. Errine especially, which makes unlimited +4 bullets. That is a sling that does +4 to hit and damage (later +5) and then it makes its own bullets that do another +4 to hit and damage. That is a +8 (or +9) to hit and damage right there and easily the best thac0 and damage bonus coming from the launcher and ammo alone!
Sorry to hijack the conversation here. If anyone complains I will gladly start this one in a new thread. Err, Firetooth? That +4 (or +5) crossbow that is available way earlier than Gesen?
Plus with Whirlwind APR becomes largely irrelevant.
So, if I may so humbly suggest, delight yourself with the picture of the disturbed seal I so frequently use when I piss out of the pot.
I am really really sorry. Honest.
I want to hide in a dark, damp, fetid and tight hole right now. I want to seclude myself in a coccoon of pain and loneliness. I need skittles. And churros. And condoms.
Jokes aside, may I humbly implore for your forgiveness? I am aware that I have made a mistake, and that I will not be so quick to lash out at someone due to my own inherent sadism. I have enough enemies in the forums as it is, and I do not want to count any more people among them. Please.
From a RP perspective I like crossbows on less dexterous warriors, because in reality it's easier to aim with them than with bows.
Getting back on topic, it is fine to have a character using crossbows in BG1, especially vanilla. Quality bows are limited, you can buy the Army Scythe early, and you can utilize the magical bolts you find. More crossbow users and you will start seeing diminishing returns due to the lack of quality crossbows in the game.
Edit: Also, they're super-camp.
That being said, I prefer crossbows in bg2 but most npcs come with shortbow proficiency (Imoen, Nalia, Yoshi, Mazzy) and giving them crossbow proficiency seems like a huge waste. If I ever make an archer for bg2 I would go for crossbow grandmastery. And farm shauguins and kuo toas for their wonderful bolts.
That is all.
1) Throwing weapons are simply bugged. You get BOTH DEX and STR bonuses to your THAC0, which means you hit with your axe better when thrown than in meele. Yeh.
2) STR damage added to slings and thrown weapons, resulting in ridiculous damage. Completely againts reality as well. Try to chop some wood with thrown axe. Slings, spears and other throwing weapons were used by second class soldiers, used for scouting and pre-battle harras. Strong trained men used combosite bows and heavy crossbows. Guess why.
3) Bows getting exta APR. Yes bow is indeed the fastest ranged weapon, but it is by no means faster than meele weapons. Current situation, when archer can shoot two arrows in your face, while you swing him . It would get pretty funny if not for:
4) AC penalty vs meele. Yes this is logical and correct, but it would be more cool if the game would actualy tell you. I've personally find about this reading gamebanshees forum, year after I've started with BG.
2) The issue of which ranged weapons should receive strength bonuses (and why) has been discussed at length in the past. Game balance comes into play here too. Personally I'm fine with how it is now. Even with STR damage bonus being added to slings/throwing weapons, I believe they rarely (if ever) manage to out-damage (cross)bows.
3) You could argue that the rate of attack with melee weapons factors in things like blocking, feinting, etc., rather than just how fast it's physically possible to swing the weapon, but yeah I agree that it doesn't really make sense. But there are lots of things that don't make sense in BG (and D&D). Sometimes you just have to go with what works for the game rather than what works in real life.
4) Agree. I think the vanilla BG2 loading screens might have had a note about this, but yeah it's not exactly made obvious.