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The great Shadows of Amn conspiracy!

CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
I bet someone else thought about it... I always have seen some clues on something "bigger" going on in Shadows of Amn, so I gathered some clues here and there :

1) Kalah, the tiny little gnome illusionist, mentions in his final breath that he was promised something. He achieved great power in that tent, even though Aerie said his skills weren't ever that powerful. It is possible that he wanted that in his own ambition, as stated that Gnomes are pretty much just made fun of in Athkatla, or hunted down as criminals. But what if his motives weren't his own, but rather he was controlled?

2) In the de'Arnise hold, Glacias, Lord Arnise's personal bodyguard as well as friend states that his new masters shown him the truth through magic. Incidentally, TorGal didn't have ANY magic, but he *did* have some beasts that made holes through the underground - the Umber Hulks!

3) In the dungeon at Windspear hills, we meet Tazok... *again*, even after having him decapitated, splattered in tiny pieces of minced meat... well, you get my meaning. Interestingly enough, he has new masters and new plans this time around and carries a key with him, key that opens a secret door to the sewers in Athkatla!

I am pretty much sure there are other clues scattered around, but I forgot them by today. Yet one thing is certain - all clues lead to the Illithids indirectly. Are those dudes trying to conquer the world or are they simply testing the protagonist? Cut content? Pretty damn sure it was.

What do you guys think?

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Comments

  • CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
    @Drugar : problem as I see it is that the Roenalls shouldn't have such powerful domination spells and Umber Hulks at their disposal, something Illithids have in numbers.

    As for Kalah, agreed that it might not be the Illithids as there's no mention of any mentally unstable people there. Faldorn on the other hand is kind of mad in BG2, I wonder if that could have any possible connection...

    Also, Illithids and Beholders in the same sewers in the same city = bad bad things to come O_O

    BelgarathMTHlolienProont
  • SallparadiseSallparadise Member Posts: 94
    It was a shame they never expanded on the Illithid plot in TOB.

    BelgarathMTHXavioriaRexfaroensislolien
  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,345
    1) Don't know about this one. The ending was clearly left out (though there's a mod that does a good job of reinstating it), but I can't really see the illithids doing this.. what would be their motive if so? They don't tend to be the chaotic evil types to go out of their way to cause problems without having a clear plan and something to gain.

    2) This is an interesting aspect. Obviously there are unanswered questions regarding the keep invasion: Tor'Gal admits the trolls didn't come up with the invasion plan themselves, and refers to a "stronger". This could be the Roenalls, but they would likely have paid Tor'Gal, not threatened him to submission. A troll boss calling someone stronger seems to imply a fair deal of respect/fear.
    There's also the fact that de'Arnise guards were paid off to leave the keep. Obviously, the trolls and umber hulks didn't pay them. On the other hand, even if the illithids were planning on establishing a presence in Athkatla (as the note in their sewer lair seems to imply), what interest would they have in a keep way out on the countryside?

    In the end, I think the more likely connection/conspiracy here is the slave traders/guarded compound/twisted rune/roenall situation, but clearly parts of that are missing as well.

    3) Always found it weird that he had that key, definitely reeks of unfinished business. Given Firkraag's capacity to hold a grudge though, he probably isn't the kind of taskmaster where you want to be double-dealing with another employer.

    BelgarathMTHcolonel_burgerProontmonico
  • SceptenarSceptenar Member Posts: 606

    You also forgot Jan and rescuing his niece. The noble he meets in the sewers is an Illithid.
    Also, Durlag's Tower. They're mentioned in the backstory as attempting to take over the tower as well, hence the traps.

    It wasn't illithids that attempted to take over Durlag's Tower, it was doppelgangers. I took a look at the backstory just to be sure, it said Durlag Trollkiller had attracted "evil forces" who wanted the tower's wealth, but it never mentioned anything about illithids, regardless his entire family was killed by and replaced with doppelgangers.

    KirkorlolienProont
  • DrugarDrugar Member Posts: 1,566
    The official version of Dominate Person lasts 1 day per level, and is a 5th level spell. Shouldn't be a problem for the Roenalls to arrange. It's possible one of the many Yuan-ti cast it actually. We might want to look into their presence as well, they're not mindless beasts.

    I don't believe in tying all the crazies of BG2 into a plot together. That would be a large, large organisation of enemies then :-p

    XavioriaProont
  • SallparadiseSallparadise Member Posts: 94
    Sceptenar said:

    You also forgot Jan and rescuing his niece. The noble he meets in the sewers is an Illithid.
    Also, Durlag's Tower. They're mentioned in the backstory as attempting to take over the tower as well, hence the traps.

    It wasn't illithids that attempted to take over Durlag's Tower, it was doppelgangers. I took a look at the backstory just to be sure, it said Durlag Trollkiller had attracted "evil forces" who wanted the tower's wealth, but it never mentioned anything about illithids, regardless his entire family was killed by and replaced with doppelgangers.
    You're right of course. I remember there being mention of an Illithid taking over the tower, I forgot that they took over much later in history and weren't the reason for it.

  • CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
    I'm pretty sure Durlag's Tower's story involves Illithids. There are several mentions of figures with tentacles.
    I am also pretty damn sure that the Tower is a connection to the underdark, just look at the room with the Astral Phase Spider in it.

    Dopplegangers are pretty much the cause for Kiel's madness, but I believe that Illithids *were* controlling the dopplegangers (I am pretty damn sure it is also mentioned in the game)

    lolienProontmonico
  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,345
    Illithids were indeed behind the attack on Durlag's tower, it's mentioned several times as you learn what happened there. Doppelgangers make for good infiltrators, but they seemingly don't really have the drive/initiative to come up with stuff like that on their own. Everything they do in the BG games is planned by someone else.

    XavioriaProont
  • CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
    @Shin : except for the doppleganger in BG2, in Irenicus' dungeon... well, unless, he was ordered to follow the player.
    Interesting though - they are great at infiltrating, master at deception and lies... but lose temper pretty damn quickly XD

    I don't know, for some reason I always thought that the Illithid wanted the player to become stronger, and that's why they gave him or her this kind of challenges, which were up to his or her skills. Or maybe (probably) I'm reading too much into it.

    Still, there's pretty much a lot of content that makes huge plot holes in Shadows of Amn.

    lolien
  • ajwzajwz Member Posts: 4,122
    The illithids lich under the sewers in athkatla drops a very interesting note hinting to this conspiracy - I've always wanted a follow up on that note

    CheesebellylolienProont
  • CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
    @ajwz : didn't know that! Could you please find the contents of the note? :o

  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,345
    @Cheesebelly Yeah, that one doesn't seem to have any significant plan though. I always figued he was held captive for some reason, and when he encounters the player he does what he can in order to get out.. but his temper indeed seems to get the better of him.

  • ShinShin Member Posts: 2,345
    The note is called illithid correspondence and is mostly in the illithid language, but contains a passage in common mentioning how the base is established and the infiltration continues - and that "The Hidden gathers followers", which is vey likely a reference to Jan's quest.. or was at one point anyway.

  • ajwzajwz Member Posts: 4,122
    This note has several sections written in alien languages, some painful to look at

    A small section written in common reads as follows:
    “The base is established and the infiltration continues. The Hidden gathers followers and soon we shall dominate the minds of the entire...”

    Th message continues in one of the more alien scripts. The Illithids are up to something as is typical for thier race, but your being here has likely disrupted thier plans.

    lolien
  • CheesebellyCheesebelly Member Posts: 1,727
    I wonder what is the word next to "entire"... Amn? Athkatla? WORLD?! God knows really >.<

    lolien
  • drawnacroldrawnacrol Member Posts: 253
    Ad-on content for BGII hopefully

  • LemernisLemernis Member, Moderator Posts: 4,309
    There's a lot going on behind the scenes in Amn at that time. BG2 is set in 1369 DR. In 1370 DR the ogre mage Sythillis invades Amn with an army of monster races, taking hold of several major cities. He launches this attack from a stronghold beneath the Small Teeth mountains. Beyond that source book for the region isn't called the Lands of Intrigue for nothing. There's the Council of Six, Cowled Wizards, Shadow Thieves, Twisted Rune, and Knights of the Shield, all of whom are major power players in Amn.

    RedRodent
  • CorvinoCorvino Member Posts: 2,269
    Love the conapiracy theory. Find yourself a mod team and put it all together!

    colonel_burger
  • MedillenMedillen Member Posts: 632
    edited August 2012
    Actually I had the same hypothesis as @CheeseBelly while playing BG2. Kalah last words... Cunning trolls (and umber hulks ! Those are pretty rare on the surface, and troll are surfacer as far as I know. Illithid, on the other hand, lives in the underdark and have a connexion with Umber hulks). The hidden, Jan quest, the secret base, the note.

    The only point I'll disagree is Tazok.

    I think Tazok may have been revived by the dragon himself to gather info on charname... Or smg else. Anyway it doesn't play along the same lines. Same with the twisted rune.

    GoturalMERLANCE
  • jpierce55jpierce55 Member Posts: 86
    I always figured Glacias and Tazok to be Firkraag related. Firkraag did know and hate Gorion after all. The Kalah thing always irked me. I have always wanted to know.

    ARKdeEREH
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