AD&D 5th Edition attempts at fixing 4th Edition - facepalm
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So, I've been reading what they've cooked up for Forgotten Realms setting in 5th Edition and how all the Spellplague clusterfuck is supposedly fixed with the Sundering event along with the resurrection of many of the dead gods, for example, such as Mystra (yet again, lol), Eilistraee and the dynamic trio- The Dead Three - Bane, Myrkul and Bhaal.
I wouldn't even call 4th edition a proper AD&D and it seems that changes in FR setting were made without the consent of the major FR writers such as Ed Greenwood or R.A. Salvatore, who now for 5th edition have to write books, where they try to explain what the ef happened during this transition. Although the books themselves are no less facepalm worty as R.A. Salvatore, for example, had no other ideas other than to reincarnate long dead Drizzt's friends - Cattie-Brie, Regis and Bruenor - into other characters. Regis now is a halfling/water genasi, lol.
Furthermore, for the Bhaalspawn saga they came up with a dumb story about how that godawful character Abdel Adrian (who somehow managed to live for over a century) was finally killed by none other than Viekang, who turned into a monster and was subsequently killed later as well, lol. Good riddance. But that's all minor compared to the resurrection of Bhaal himself as greater power. Bhaalspawn saga is totally screwed.
Personally, since 4th Bullshit Edition came out and butchered FR and Planescape settings I'm in denial and no longer consider anything that came out after the 3d Edition as canon, cuz all of that later stupidity was written by total hacks who have no proper knowledge or respect for the settings.
I wouldn't even call 4th edition a proper AD&D and it seems that changes in FR setting were made without the consent of the major FR writers such as Ed Greenwood or R.A. Salvatore, who now for 5th edition have to write books, where they try to explain what the ef happened during this transition. Although the books themselves are no less facepalm worty as R.A. Salvatore, for example, had no other ideas other than to reincarnate long dead Drizzt's friends - Cattie-Brie, Regis and Bruenor - into other characters. Regis now is a halfling/water genasi, lol.
Furthermore, for the Bhaalspawn saga they came up with a dumb story about how that godawful character Abdel Adrian (who somehow managed to live for over a century) was finally killed by none other than Viekang, who turned into a monster and was subsequently killed later as well, lol. Good riddance. But that's all minor compared to the resurrection of Bhaal himself as greater power. Bhaalspawn saga is totally screwed.
Personally, since 4th Bullshit Edition came out and butchered FR and Planescape settings I'm in denial and no longer consider anything that came out after the 3d Edition as canon, cuz all of that later stupidity was written by total hacks who have no proper knowledge or respect for the settings.
Post edited by Aramintai on
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agree, also
But enough of that...
What does the Sundering do for the planet Toril as a whole, exactly? Does it bring back Anchorome, Maztica and Katashaka? What about Zakhara, Kara-Tur or Osse? Will we see a return of Mulhorand, Unther and all the other countries of Faerûn which were "replaced" (or simply deleted for no reason at all) as well? Couldn't care less about this Returned Abeir thing WotC threw at our faces.
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Sundering_(event)
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/The_Companions
I facepalmed hard upon reading this. But considering that Regis and Cattie-Brie's deaths were Spellplague's fault and WotC seems to want to erase it from FR setting like a bad dream I can't say I really blame Salvatore for wanting to bring everything back to the way it was before. Poor Drizzt though, he had to live through all that.
I'd be less quick to condemn the creative instincts of someone writing in a shared world in this way. Salvatore likely has more leeway than most writers in doing what he wants, but to the best of my knowledge he doesn't own the characters. It's certainly possible--if it was a writer of lesser stature I'd even say it was likely--that the idea of restoring/reincarnating previously established characters was one that came down from on high. That idea of restoration/resurrection seemed to run through a lot of the Sundering, with the return of Bhaal, the lost continents, etc.
The desires of creators often run counter to those of management, and in a shared world environment, the management's going to win most of those arguments. If such an argument occurs, the creator is left with an unpalatable option: walk away or try to execute the idea as best they can. I imagine that decision would be even harder to make for a creator who invested a signficant amount of time creating the characters and helping build a successful franchise.
I'm absolutely NOT saying that's what happened in this case. I'm just saying that professional work for hire writers sometimes have to write the story they're given rather than the one they want.
Combined with the idiotic concept of aggro, taken straight from (bad) MMORPGs, and things like second wind that make absolutely zero sense in the game universe, I concluded that 4E is simply not a role-playing game anymore - it's just a MMORPG raid simulator that you play using dice instead of your PC.
So bizzare: Second Edition DnD inspired countless single-player computer RPGs, which then in turn evolved into MMORPGs, which then devolved into Theme Parks... and then these very Theme Parks were taken as an inspiration and base for the next DnD edition! What a circle of decline.
Amazingly enough, it wasn't only Wizards of the Coast that fell for this. What happened to Warhammer Fantasy could only be described as a travesty, and recently Warhammer Fantasy Battle suffered no less humiliating treatment.
I can't wait to see how they'll ruin 40k next!
to (A)D&D as a collective or buy shares of wotc/tsr to change how things are done
there, so things could be "fixed" that are broken and to change the direction
everything takes.
Maybe there is even a way to unite all Editions into one, perfect edition?
AD&D 1st Edition
System ***
Lore *****
Advanced Dungeons & Dragons 1st Edition is basically Classic D&D from the Red Box, but with the option to build your own character (making an Elven Thief or a Dwarven Cleric, for example) and with more options of races and classes. The Lore is in the 80s high fantasy style, like Conan the Barbarian and still very close to old classic legends, like Knights of the Round Table. Also, 1st Edition had Greyhawk as its core Campaign Setting, wich in my opinion is a more grounded setting than Forgotten Realms.
AD&D 2nd Edition
System ****
Lore *****
2nd Edition is a refined version of 1st Edition. Abilities were better scaled and proficiencies and skills had a very nice design direction. Of course, how this rules were displayed in the Core Rulebooks were a bit disorganized, and reverse calculations of Thac0, Saving Throws and Abilitie rolls were a little dizzy... So it could seems a complicated system, when in fact it's pretty simple. Lore was the same of 1st Edition, but passing through the growing development of Forgotten Realms, Dragon Lance and Dark Sun, while Greyhawk reaching its sunset.
D&D 3.5 Edition
System ****
Lore ***
Now we had a very different, but still a good system. The skill system was great, the understanding of the rules were better explained through the Rulebooks, but it were a much more complex system. I think the real failure of 3.5 system were progression. Everything goes fine in 1st, 2nd and 3rd level... But things start to break when you go further in levels. When you reach Lv. 10 you are practically a superhero from Marvel, while in preview editions Lv. 10 was more like a classical hero from mythology, like Perseus, Achiles or Sigfried. Paragon Class dependency for the Fighter class is a pain in the ass too. But, in general, it was a great system. My big problem with 3rd Edition, is that they started to mess with the lore of the Realms... Greyhawk was dead and Dragonlance in sharp decline.
D&D 4th Edition
System **
Lore *
4th Edition was a fine system. But it wasn't D&D. It was well balanced - in combat, only. Because skills were messy. Why all Lv. 20 Wizards should be better in Athletics than Lv. 1 Warriors? Dumb system. But the battles were prolonged and very different than the fill of D&D battles. Well... It has a better system than World of Warcraft or any other MMO RPG... I mean, this system could work in a video game, pretty much like Tactics Ogre or Final Fantasy Tactics... But D&D shouldn't aim for that. Lore was complete garbage. Babylon Five Tieflings, Dragonborns... Really? They even tryed to bring back the Demon Princes (and that were nice), but everything were designed just to attract the attention of new kids, not core players. It was really a messy attemption to transform D&D in a dice rolled video game. Complete failure.
D&D 5th Edition
System *****
Lore **
5th Edition system is paradise. It has the best worlds of both AD&D 2nd Edition and D&D 3.5 Edition. Really, the best D&D system created so far - wich makes it the best RPG system of all time. It's a simplified version of 3.5, with a core feeling of 2nd Edition. Bounded Accuracy and Progression were an incredible and very wellcome improvement. Now it is possible to bring a challenge for a Lv. 10 party with a horde of goblinoids. Also, you can fight a mature Dragon if you have an army of soldiers and archers. Very rounded system. I even had brewed some houserules that fit my taste for the high fantasy style I idealize (very based in Tolkien and Mythology), but the system is nigh perfection. I even created my own racial traits and redesigned some classes (like the Bard), removed some archetypes, but the system is still all there. In the other hand, Lore stinks. Well... It continues the lore of the Realms after 3.5 and 4th Edition, so it couldn't be worthy. But, hey, why not play 5th Edition System, with 2nd Edition lore? That is playing smart.
Unless of course the Feywild was introduced prior to 4e. I haven't heard of it outside of 4e material, though.
Feywild is sort of magical parallel plane to the Prime Material world of Toril and was always in relatively close proximity to it. In some places they overlapped, allowing for passage through. That's how the first fey folk and elves moved to live in what was then a united world of Abeir-Toril. Later both planes separated from each other almost completely, only to come back into very close proximity during the Spellplague event in 4th edition.
With re-separation of Abeir from Toril and Mystra's resurrection in 5th edition Feywild's probably gonna move away again as well. I'd say good riddance - too many elf types for my liking.
At least gnomes are still Fey, though. At least I hope they keep that element.
But its only natural different gamers will have wildly different views on what they actually want to play.
The setting, or lore is a separate issue entirely as far as I'm concerned. Some DMs will want to create their own setting, others won't. The various published settings exist as an aid to the DM who doesn't want the hassle. OR as common ground for things like modules or (ahem) computer games that are meant to have broader appeal than just a local game table.
Now all that said, I love 2E rules that I use (with many of my own modifications) in my setting. I've played with other DMs who use different rule sets, I've played with DMs who use their own unique worlds, I've played with DMs who composite their own ideas into a published setting. I've even played with DMs who used MY modifications to the core rules (that can get a little awkward when an interpretation is called for...)
And its all good.
Ultimately I think role playing is a very personal experience. The DM SHOULD use a rule set that best facilitates them telling a story the way they want to tell it. And players need to let the DM run their game the way they want to. If a game, whether its because of rule set, setting or something else doesn't suit a player; DON'T PLAY IT!
Its not a big thing. In playing a wide range of games I've quit a few. It can get a little sticky to realize you can't play with a friend. Although in one case a friend and I who COULDN'T game together became very close as co-conspirators helping each other with ideas and trouble spots in each other's games. (I was better at mood, color, setting and combat management; he was better at really digging into the meat of a story)
I think the bottom line is always that it should be fun whatever rule set and setting are involved.
Ok, join my "in denial" club - there is no canon beyond 3d edition
Or go check out Numenera setting, it's my last bastion of hope for these types of mind blowing settings. Hopefully the upcoming game will do it justice.
Use the setting and rules that work for you. WotC is of zero consequence to me. Honestly the only time I've ever played in the Realms is in computer games anyway.