IWD2: what are the low intelligence dangers for tanks?
My half-orc Battle Cleric of Tempus starts like this:
STR: 20
DEX: 12
CON: 18
WIS: 18
INT: 4
CHA: 2
I only need skill points for concentration, nothing else, but is there any danger of intelligence being too low? I could lower the intelligence even more and pump up some dexterity instead or i could lower my dexterity and pump up some intelligence. Now, i don't want my Cleric to be slow, so i will not drop dexterity below 10. This Cleric will be a tank, with that low charisma he will never engage in any dialogue (except the drinking contest for the wolf medallion).
So what are the dangers of ultra low intelligence?
STR: 20
DEX: 12
CON: 18
WIS: 18
INT: 4
CHA: 2
I only need skill points for concentration, nothing else, but is there any danger of intelligence being too low? I could lower the intelligence even more and pump up some dexterity instead or i could lower my dexterity and pump up some intelligence. Now, i don't want my Cleric to be slow, so i will not drop dexterity below 10. This Cleric will be a tank, with that low charisma he will never engage in any dialogue (except the drinking contest for the wolf medallion).
So what are the dangers of ultra low intelligence?
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For a cleric, you don't need more than 16 CON for additional HPs, because only fighters get HPs for mor than 16 in this stat.
Also, I believe a half-orc can has 19 STR, not 20.
If you want a tank, not a damage dealer, better concentrate on DEX than STR, because AC matters for your tank to "tank" for a longer period of time.
The poster is referring to IWD2, not IWD:EE.
Put simply, there are no dangers of ultra low intelligence. You will only get 1 skill point per level, which you can put into concentration. It will be very difficult for this character to ever get any of the elemental damage feats, which can be very useful.
I would go for the following:
Str 20
Dex 18
Con 14
Wis 18
Int 3
Cha 1
How cheesy do you want to go exactly? I know of one quest that will give you +2 to Wisdom (permanently) and another quest that will give you +1 to Strength and +1 to Wisdom (also both permanent). The quests themselves are not mutually exclusive, but the rewards are, since the rewards depend on your character having at least one level in a particular character class. These character classes are mutually exclusive due to the alignment requirements.
PS make the character lawful and add a level of monk. You get better AC than is possible with armor by having a level of monk and going unarmored. Plus you get evasion.
You won't get an experience penalty if you just make the character a solid Battleguard of Tempus. Experience penalties only apply with multiclassing, and only if one of the classes is not the race's favoured class. So, if you made a half-orc Monk/Battleguard of Tempus, you would receive an experience penalty. But, you could make a half-orc Barbarian/Battleguard of Tempus with no experience penalty, because Barbarian is the favoured class of half-orcs.
Hope this helps.
Some feats like expertise etc. will be forever locked to you.
You can not train knowledge arcana and alchemy thus potions and magic items will be unidentified to your character.
And spellcraft will be a big no, you can only train concentration. Spellcraft is useful in battles as it lets you recognise a spell being cast by an enemy. If your skill check is succesful (which is not shown in the battle log) you will see a floating text on the enemy saying 'casting x spell' However this is only marginally useful as you can guess what spell is being cast by an enemy from the casting glows and incantations. Like, if an ancient lich is casting a long, drawn out necromantic spell you will know you are in big trouble unless you have tons of hp and a strong fortitude save. But spellcraft will let you know if it is a horrid wilting or wail of the banshee.
I would prefer DEX 14 and CON 18 for a battle cleric, since high DEX will waste the benefit of heavy armor, and CON 18 will add fortitude, which for a cleric is more important than reflex anyway.
Actually the best AC you can reach in the game requires that you wear no armor. Armor in Icewind Dale 2 is pretty terrible, its better to rely on spells such as Shield, Spirit Armor, Ghost Armor, Barkskin, Mass Haste, and the Monk's AC bonus.
A cleric's naturally high wisdom synergizes nicely with the monk AC bonus. Plus, one level of monk provides evasion. In my IWD2 playthroughs, all of my characters have 18 dex and evasion, which means I can drop fireballs right on my party with no-one taking any damage at all. Well, except enemies of course.
10 base
8 Drakkas' Fury
13 DEX
5 Barkskin
5 Expertise
6 Divine Shell
5 Red Fang's Tomb
2 War Chant of the Sith
4 Haste
5 Brazen Bands
3 Prayer and Recitation
4 Deep Gnome
1 Dodge
71 Total
It's not quite as tough as another Deep Gnome tank, but it requires less micromanagement. Also, you can get higher AC by having multiple bards in your party and/or using the Lingering Song feat to stack songs while paused, though some dislike the Lingering Song trick because it can do basically everything.
I once ran a party composed entirely of bards. I didn't stack more songs that I had bards to sing (with Lingering Song, that's 12 songs total per round), but it was still ridiculous. +6 to hit, damage, and saving throws at level 1. An additional +6 to luck and +18 to saving throws at level 5. And maybe +12 to AC, regeneration, and physical damage reduction at level 11. They were chunking enemies left and right with arrows (which get a triple critical hit multiplier, and therefore benefit especially from luck effects), making their saves 95% of the time regardless of the spell, taking minimum damage from all spells, and eventually becoming almost impossible to damage with physical attacks.
The JUPP contains a deep gnome decoy that can reach the high 80's, but it has massive experience penalties.
EDIT: Is Red Fang's Tomb added by a mod? I can't find it in the official items list
The Chain of Drakkas is only available late-game, but it doesn't matter. AC doesn't need to be that high outside of HoF mode, and in HoF mode, you're already importing characters with late-game items.
And Drakkas isn't the only form of armor that does not limit DEX bonuses. All shields, another form of armor, also cancel WIS bonuses, but do not restrict DEX bonuses. No mage spell grants a shield bonus to AC, a different type of AC modifier (the Shield spell is something of a misnomer). My point was just that Monk levels and their WIS bonuses aren't necessary to create a high-AC tank in HoF mode.
In any case, yes, monk wisdom is not the only way to achieve high AC. However, I think we can both agree that any sort of armor that limits dexterity bonus will make it impossible to achieve ultra high AC. Whether you use Drakkas or the monk wisdom bonus, anything that limits your dex bonus to AC will make it impossible to reach the upper levels of AC.
On a related note, I looked back at an Excel sheet and it seems the maximum AC attainable without using the Lingering Song feat is 111 or 112. It requires a LOT of luck, though, as well as importing and exporting (or multiple playthroughs) to duplicate random drop potions to crank up Wisdom and Dexterity to 40. The character is a Deep Gnome Monk(25)/Sorcerer/Thief, with a party of five Bards to stack War Chant of the Sith.
10 base
7 Shield
5 Ghost Armor
5 Brazen Bands
15 Wisdom bonus
15 Dexterity bonus
5 Expertise
3 Sunfire Talisman
4 Deep Gnome bonus
3 Crow's Nest
1 Dodge
4 Haste
10 War Chants of the Sith
5 Barkskin
4 Tenser's Transformation (scroll)
5 Monk bonus
9 Ryomaru's Harmless Tanuki Staff
111 Total (or maybe 112)
The thing is that the HoF version of the Tanuki Staff has a small chance of giving the wielder +1 generic AC for 2 rounds per hit.
It's irrelevant in any case. If you allowed yourself to amass an infinite number of potions via importing and exporting or multiple playthroughs, you could use Potions of Resistance and Greater Resistance to give yourself 100- damage reduction to all physical damage, rendering AC unnecessary.
Fair enough, but if you're going to cheese like that, just use EEKeeper to edit your stats directly and save yourself the hassle. I don't think there is any point in discussing AC values that require either mods, editing, item creation via console, or importing and exporting.
I suppose what I'm saying is that maximum possible AC in one playthrough has relevance to me, whereas maximum possible AC via importing, editing, modding and/or EEKeeping is completely irrelevant to me.
I apologize if English is not your first language, I truly do not understand what you posted.
But Hide is governed by Dexterity, not Intelligence. So an 18 INT will let you max out the Hide skill, but it won't apply any bonuses on top. If your DEX is 18, however, then you'll get a +4 to Hide.
Also, a DEX of 8 should only impose a -1 penalty to both armor class and skills such as hide, not -5. You'd need a DEX of 1 to get a -5 penalty to a DEX-based skill.
This forum is regarding Icewind Dale: Enhanced Edition, but this thread is concerning Icewind Dale 2. The two use different rulesets.
As semiticgod explained, Intelligence does affect skill points available on level up, but only applies its modifier to certain skills. Wilderness Lore, for example, is indirectly affected by intelligence because it provides more skill points, but a higher intelligence does not directly benefit wilderness lore.
In any case, your statement "it affects a saving throw" is incorrect in Icewind Dale 2 regarding intelligence. Intelligence does not directly affect saving throws or armor class.