Berserker or Berserker/Cleric

RobertMcDuck

I want to do a playthrough as a fighter/tank. But I'm having a hard time choosing so I'll ask for your opinions. I want to be an optimal fighter for every creature. A bastard sword against undead, Longsword against dragons, Cromfaeyr(?) against giants and etc. I want to be able to use a great range of weapons, that is my biggest concern playing as a beserker/cleric. What would be the best choice? Please motivate.

Berserker:
+ Can use all weapons
+ Focus more on dealing damage (?)
+ No major restrictions
+ Play as an Orc
- No self buffs
- No turn undead.

Berserker/Cleric:
+ Cleric spells, Heal and buff
+ More HLAs
- Weapon restrictions
- Restricted to Human Race
- Must spend alot of points into Wisdom.

Jaheiras_Witness

Berserker sounds like what you're after. You can hardly use swords as a cleric.

You actually get fewer HLAs as a berserker/cleric...only the cleric HLAs (quest level spells), none of the fighter HLAs.

Unless you have roleplaying reasons to play a half-orc, a dwarf would be far superior (save bonuses 》》》》》》》》》+1 STR and DEX).

mashedtaters

I prefer the dual class, personally, but a big downside is the inability to use swords. However, there are some amazing weapons that clerics can use in the game. One of the best weapons in the game, actually, is capable of being equipped by a cleric.

As a side not, many people like berserker/cleric, for the rage ability, but I have a hard time consoling myself with the loss of ranged weapons. Unless BG2EE has added such a weapon, there are no very good ranged (thrown) weapons that a berserker/cleric can use. But, if you intend on always being on the front lines then it hardly matters.

Another advantage of being a cleric dual class is that you don't need to bring along a cleric npc to do your healing. Depending on your alignment, that can be difficult. Aerie or Anomen for good, or Viconia for evil. (I disagree with some who people say you can use Jaheira alone, I personally think that druids are unsuitable as replacements for clerics.)

Aerie isn't really the greatest cleric: her strength lies in her versatility. She will get the job done, though.

Anomen is aptly named Annoymen, because lots of people find him annoying (but he is one of the most powerful and useful characters in the game simply because he is a fighter/cleric dual class).

Viconia is always great, but it can be tiresome to bring her along for the 5th or 6th time just because you need a cleric, and then you have to micromanage your reputation if your good. Plus, single class clerics tend to be lack-luster, imho, although her magic resistance makes up for it.

I played through as a fighter9->cleric, and it was one of my best playthroughs. I loved being able to destroy and heal in the same breath. I have not played as a straight-up berserker, though I had Korgan in my party with my fighter/cleric, and I have to say that Korgan was more of a tank than my Charname, especially late game. Although, buffed up, Charname blew Korgan out of the water.

What do you want? The versatility of a fighter(berserker)/cleric? Or the powerhouse tanking of a straight up berserker? They are both incredibly powerful characters, and both are very straightforward and easy to use.

mashedtaters

And, to be clear, you list one of the strengths of a berserker edit:over the dual class is focus more on dealing damage. They both deal damage to an extreme degree. A berserker deals tons of melee damage, as well as the dual class, but a dual class can also deal magic damage. There are some amazing later game spells and HLAs that a cleric gets that deal super massive damage.

RobertMcDuck

Well yes, I was referring to melee damage. Well using many weapons is very lucrative. There is bastard sword that is superior to slaying undead, there is crom fraeyr as a +5 weapon, ideal for golems and such as well. There is this longsword that is great against dragons. I want to be suited for all these creatures that are tougher than most enemies. And undead is probably the most common enemy. That is the great downside of dual-classing to a cleric.

Lord_Tansheron

Are you talking about a solo run here? Or do you plan on going with a party?

RobertMcDuck

Party, loaded with spellcasters. And jan as a thief/mage

Gotural

A multiclass Fighter/Cleric will be superior to both mechanically because you will be able to use Hardiness + Armor of Faith + Defender of Easthaven. Plus if you go the Berserker single class or dual path, the main advantage is Grand Mastery, so you won't be able to use alot of weapons anyway.
And by playing the F/C you can roll a Dwarf, which is another huge bonus.

JLee

Fyi, clerics, particularly pure class or duals, have absolutely no need for any weapons when dealing with the undead. So, don't feel bad about losing the ability to use bastard swords.

Walking into a room unarmed and making legions of undead go pop is one of the great pleasures of playing a cleric.

Reticent

One upside of going cleric though is eventually exploding undead with your very presence.

That said, it sounds like what you really want is to play a straight up warrior type rather than a spellcaster- so do that! You'll be much more satisfied playing the class you want to play rather than playing something just because it seems hypothetically more powerful in select circumstances.

If anything, might I suggest playing a Barbarian rather than Berserker? Reason being Barbarian is going to end up spreading proficiency points around to a wide variety of weapons (which is a much better match for the "right tool for the job" approach you are going for), whereas Berserker is going to put you under a lot of pressure to go for grand mastery in just one or two weapon types.

Nothing at all wrong with a Half-Orc Barbarian.

JuliusBorisov

Gotural said:

A multiclass Fighter/Cleric will be superior to both mechanically because you will be able to use Hardiness + Armor of Faith + Defender of Easthaven. Plus if you go the Berserker single class or dual path, the main advantage is Grand Mastery, so you won't be able to use alot of weapons anyway.
And by playing the F/C you can roll a Dwarf, which is another huge bonus.

Lucius: Whistles innocently

RobertMcDuck

Ah, thank you all for your answers, really gives me perspective!

sluckers

Play the berserker. The simple fact is that the most optimal fighter against all creatures is, well, a fighter.

One of the biggest mistakes I have routinely made in this game is playing a class because it will be powerful in the end game, or what it can hypothetically do if and when i get the required abilities/spells. The end game is very far away, and there are a lot of levels between the hypothetical 'now' and 'then'.

It's a major source of restartitis. At least for me.

Forget about HLAs. You're just not there yet. Ya, they're nice, but they come at the end. You have to get there first, and that's a hurdle that cannot be ignored as far as game enjoyment is concerned.

The berserker is like christmas. It gives and keeps on giving, and it does so in a very simple and hassle-free way, and you get a lot of what it offers right from the start. It's one of the best classes and the safest, due to its immunities. It's an excellent spellcaster destroyer, which is great for BG2.

It's also brilliant against the undead, again because of it's immunities. Not nearly as funny and comedic as a cleric under sanctuary, but to be fair, swords make the undead explode too, and Berserker rage immunizes the class against all the undead special abilities.

Don't do anything half-baked, so go single class. Play a single class berserker. Enjoy what is best in life: to crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the women!

[Patches O'Houlihan]You've got to get angry! You've got to be mean!![/Patches]

P.S. About berserker ranged weapons, there are several axes, daggers and hammers available throughout BG2, and one in BG1. None higher than +3, but +3 weapons are very respectable, as very very few enemies--almost none, in the grand scheme of things--are naturally immune to them.

vish

I like the Berserker kit myself. I could talk all day about dual classing, but sometimes it's better to just play it straight. In the case of the Berserker this much is true. Berserker will be powerful almost immediately. Berserker/Cleric will take sometime and proper pre dual leveling to get the most of. The dual class will actually have more choices of weapons and will only be restricted to Cleric usable weapons. As you noted there are plenty powerful weapons Clerics can use: Crom Faeyr, Runehammer, Flail of Ages. All very powerful +5 weapons. If you're going with a party of 5/6 or want raw damage go with the Berserker. For smaller parties you'll want/need the versatility instead.

mashedtaters

sluckers said:

Play the berserker. The simple fact is that the most optimal fighter against all creatures is, well, a fighter.

One of the biggest mistakes I have routinely made in this game is playing a class because it will be powerful in the end game, or what it can hypothetically do if and when i get the required abilities/spells. The end game is very far away, and there are a lot of levels between the hypothetical 'now' and 'then'.

It's a major source of restartitis. At least for me.

Forget about HLAs. You're just not there yet. Ya, they're nice, but they come at the end. You have to get there first, and that's a hurdle that cannot be ignored as far as game enjoyment is concerned.

The berserker is like christmas. It gives and keeps on giving, and it does so in a very simple and hassle-free way, and you get a lot of what it offers right from the start. It's one of the best classes and the safest, due to its immunities. It's an excellent spellcaster destroyer, which is great for BG2.

It's also brilliant against the undead, again because of it's immunities. Not nearly as funny and comedic as a cleric under sanctuary, but to be fair, swords make the undead explode too, and Berserker rage immunizes the class against all the undead special abilities.

Don't do anything half-baked, so go single class. Play a single class berserker. Enjoy what is best in life: to crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the women!

[Patches O'Houlihan]You've got to get angry! You've got to be mean!![/Patches]

P.S. About berserker ranged weapons, there are several axes, daggers and hammers available throughout BG2, and one in BG1. None higher than +3, but +3 weapons are very respectable, as very very few enemies--almost none, in the grand scheme of things--are naturally immune to them.

I agree with this 100%. Play what you want to play.

Trust me, you will like this game enough to play it through more than once. All of the classes are viable, and capable of beating the game, with the right equipment, party, and strategy. Do what you want to do. You may want to play as a figher/cleric next time, or go for something absolutely unrelated, like a sorcerer. Each class/race plays differently. Some are easier to play, which is why some people say they are "more powerful", but all the classes are balanced enough to be the "most powerful" if played properly. Beyond what is "most powerful", have fun!! This game is a lot of fun!

Otherguy

Dwarven F/C dw flails for easthaven and FoA. Really good tank from start to finish with cleric buffs (25 str and immune everything), 85% dmg res (HLAs). Amazing damage with GWW sling coming close to the best ranged character in the game and GWW FoA is also pretty much among the best melee in the game. Or make do with 7 APR (8 with gloves) if a mage throws you a impr haste but unless moding (or cheesing) it won't work with FoA +5. Plus every level up will feel important which is not the case with pure fighters.

If it had access to spell immunity abjuration it would be beyond broken... FMC is where it's at!

Musigny

Berserker / Cleric builds were once popular in SoA but with the release of ToB and its epic XP/levels the generated interest decreased. This is still a solid solution if you want to play a cleric, more interesting than the kits IMHO.
Pure berserker? very efficient but Korgan is already in the game.
Fighter/Cleric, excellent but you will miss the rage ability (the perfect, instant, no brainer ability against mages, liches and vampires).
In any cases finding good weapons won't be a problem.

Avlan

As most of my games are no-reload type games, I prefer to take a Berserker/anything over a multi even if it does mean a loss in damage. Berserker/Cleric is still doing amazing damage with their self buffs and at higher levels when dealing with undead you can just run around like a mad man/woman and watching them turn to dust.(Unless you are evil and would rather have an undead rave with the boss of the dungeon.)

BelgarathMTH

I'm really tempted to try a berserker>cleric for the protections offered by the berserk ability, especially against Imprisonment, but I really hate the idea of playing all of BG1 and a big percentage of BG2 with a character class that isn't what I want to play, which is a cleric who can fight well. That is, I'd have to play all of BG1 without any cleric abilities, and a lot of BG2 without any berserker abilities.

Then I think about the possibility of going half-orc with a fighter-cleric multi and having 19 strength and 19 constitution...

So I'll probably wind up taking the half-orc FC multi over the human F>C dual.

The dual would sound more appealing for a solo run with the faster advancement, but I only like to play with parties.

[Deleted User]

That's why I like to dual the Berserker->Cleric at Berserker 7. You won't quite get your Berserker levels back by the end of BGEE (unless you remove the XP cap), but you'll hit Cleric 8 almost immediately after you begin the next game and be smooth sailing through BG2.

JLee

I recently began trying all the classic duals for the first time. I just completed a Berserker 9>Cleric and it was tons of fun, but it was a grind getting there. I agree with the choice of dualing at level 7.

Dharius

I'd agree with @JLee. Dual classing turns out well in the end, but I think it's a hassle getting there unless you dual early. Anomen's already available as a F/C - he does it so you don't have to From your choices I'd go with 1/2 Orc berserker with high STR: why turn undead when you can bash them?

mashedtaters

BelgarathMTH said:

I'm really tempted to try a berserker>cleric for the protections offered by the berserk ability, especially against Imprisonment, but I really hate the idea of playing all of BG1 and a big percentage of BG2 with a character class that isn't what I want to play, which is a cleric who can fight well. That is, I'd have to play all of BG1 without any cleric abilities, and a lot of BG2 without any berserker abilities.

Then I think about the possibility of going half-orc with a fighter-cleric multi and having 19 strength and 19 constitution...

So I'll probably wind up taking the half-orc FC multi over the human F>C dual.

The dual would sound more appealing for a solo run with the faster advancement, but I only like to play with parties.

I prefer to dual at level 9 for multiple reasons aside from the extra hp and pip.
When playing through bg1, I just bring along a cleric. I can play as a fighter, which absolutely rocks in BG1. Clerics can be difficult to keep alive in the early game.
When I get to BG2 as a fighter, I have a little bit of time before I dual class. I get out of irenicus dungeon, do a few minor quests and then I dual. This kind of mixes things up for me. I like to be able to change my character mid stride and start anew, almost like I'm rolling a new character mid game. You level up to a useful level very quickly. By the time I'm level 9 cleric, I'm just about ready to close chapter 2 and go to the underdark. At that point, it's like I rolled up another brand new character all over again!
It adds variety to charname for me. I don't have to play through the whole game with only one style.

BelgarathMTH

Kaigen said:

That's why I like to dual the Berserker->Cleric at Berserker 7. You won't quite get your Berserker levels back by the end of BGEE (unless you remove the XP cap), but you'll hit Cleric 8 almost immediately after you begin the next game and be smooth sailing through BG2.

Wouldn't dualling at level 7 in BG1 mean facing Sarevok as a low level cleric? I fear doing that. How many levels of cleric did you manage to gain before the final battle?

Wowo

Sounds to me like what you want is either a Barbarian, Paladin or a Ranger:
- no weapon restrictions
- access to weapon specialisation means a greater variety of weapons
- Ranger and Paladin have some self buffs
- Barbarian Rage gives immunity to Imprisonment
- Ranger FE can give a nice bonus against one of the enemy types that you mention which seems to suit your concept

In contrast;
- berserker 9-> cleric has a maximum of 4 attacks per round with gauntlets compared to 5 for all others
- Grandmastery means focusing on one or two weapons until very late game

[Deleted User]

BelgarathMTH said:

Kaigen said:

That's why I like to dual the Berserker->Cleric at Berserker 7. You won't quite get your Berserker levels back by the end of BGEE (unless you remove the XP cap), but you'll hit Cleric 8 almost immediately after you begin the next game and be smooth sailing through BG2.

Wouldn't dualling at level 7 in BG1 mean facing Sarevok as a low level cleric? I fear doing that. How many levels of cleric did you manage to gain before the final battle?

Under the normal BG1 experience cap, you can dual a Berserker at level 7 and hit level 7 Cleric, which is only one level behind where a single class Cleric would be. You're missing one third and one fourth level spell, but that's unlikely to be decisive in the final battle (especially with a high WIS).