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Dual or Multi Fighter Mage

ValorousValorous Member Posts: 5
What do you prefer when you play a fighter mage and your playing from BG through BG2? How do you build your fighter mage either as dual or multi when it comes to stats and pips?
  1. Dual or Multi Fighter Mage86 votes
    1. Figher>Mage Dual
      31.40%
    2. Figher/Mage Multi
      68.60%
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Comments

  • SmilingSwordSmilingSword Member Posts: 827
    I find there are way too many down sides to duel classing, first you have to be a fighter forever to get any real benefit out of it, as either level 9 or 13 are considered the norm to dual to mage.
    So that's the whole of BG1 and a bit of BG2 before you can cast any spells and playing a straight fighter is just plain boring. The most egregious problem though is having to play a human, if you don't want to use mods/EEkeeper.

    Multi gives way more benefits earlier on such as the sleep spell, which destroys most of BG1. Plus you can be a Elf or a half Elf, so it's instantly infinitely superior to dual classing.
  •  TheArtisan TheArtisan Member Posts: 3,277
    No vote for me. There's merits to both class. If you just want a strong caster with some fighting prowess, a dual-class is fine. In fact, I highly recommend it if you want to have more ranged options than just darts and slings. You can also skip a large portion of the 'regaining levels' by scribing scrolls in BG2. Grandmastery in short bows is a good choice.

    If you run a fighter/mage, you run an entirely different set of spells and probably also need a secondary mage. The payoff is greater but it takes longer to get there and you really have to emphasize the power of mage buffs because your magic growth is slower. Dual-wield is the strongest choice.
  • FinneousPJFinneousPJ Member Posts: 6,455
    Over the entire trilogy I would pick the multiclass.
  • 10Bazza1110Bazza11 Member Posts: 169
    Multiclass all the way for me. I hate the way you have to start over with a dual class. I think you should be able to use use all your abilities from the first class albeit with any restrictions imposed by the second class.
  • OrangemooseOrangemoose Member Posts: 83


    So that's the whole of BG1 and a bit of BG2 before you can cast any spells and playing a straight fighter is just plain boring.

    I disagree, I find the bhaalspawn powers more than makes up for it and especially if you go for a ranged character.
    Plus that's really only a worry if you're playing a solo character anyway.
  • YamchaYamcha Member Posts: 486
    Really depends on how you want to play your f/m

    Nearly invincible tank, always close to the enemy -> multi
    Mostly casting, making little use of the bonus Hp, thac0, and bonus attacks -> dual

  • LateralusLateralus Member Posts: 903
    edited April 2016
    Gnome fighter/illusionist is hands down the most powerful character, and fun, and very versatile. A few more hit points, a kit perk, and weapon specialization are nice but I'd trade that for a +1INT, extra spell slots, and huge saving throw bonuses 7 days a week and twice on Sunday. And a gnome swinging around greatswords and halberds looks as funny as it sounds. Until it starts raining chunks, then it's awesome.

    I almost forgot. With multi-class, your thac0 never stops improving, so in the long run you will be a much more effective fighter AND spell caster unless you use mods.
  • magisenseimagisensei Member Posts: 316
    Having played both as most of us have - I prefer the multi-class option. Yes, it takes longer to level up but you are not left with being a bit weak as you wait for your first class to re-activate. I dualed Imoen and its only to level 7 that I have to get to and its taking a while.

    Playing through the entire trilogy, I would say that the multiclass is probably better overall without even looking at the benefits of the HLA. Yes, you lose some kit abilities assuming you start with a specialist fighter like a kensai or something but you get the added benefit of buffs at low level even without the extra pluses you get from being a kensai.

    As a f/m you can decide if you want to melee it out or just a be a bit lazy and blast them all away from a afar - ahh the options.... so many to pick from.

    Although either one really are in the end a bit too powerful. Dualed and multi-class should be limited to some degree in terms of spells (for the multi-class and fighting skills) or in terms of their THACO or grandmastery for the dualed class (assuming you go for grandmastery at level 9 or is it 13) - dualed characters should no longer be able to grandmaster their fighting skills or something to limit them.
  • SkatanSkatan Member, Moderator Posts: 5,352
    edited April 2016
    I think the F/M is slightly more versatile and stronger throughout the saga, if I have to choose one. It's easy to support either build, but getting access to both HLA's, no downtime, being unique etc makes the F/M slightly more favorable to me. If played in a slightly smaller party, you will get enough xp to still be a competent mage, but I always prefer to bring another one anyways.

    edit: regarding being unique, I mean there's no F/M NPC. There's no F-M NPC either, but there are strong single-class leveling mages in the game but no multiclass other than Jan.
  • For stats and pips, ideally a F/M would like to have high stats basically everywhere, but since that isn't feasible, I tend to skimp on CHA and WIS, since there's a ring for CHA and you have to be pretty late in the game before you can cast Wish and might actually need WIS. That brings stat requirements down a bit, but if you need more, you can skimp a little on INT and use potions to help scribe scrolls or skimp on STR and rely on spells/items to boost it up (~15 should be sufficient for INT, and 15 STR is nice for the carrying capacity and shield use).

    You can go a lot of different directions with pips, depending on who else is in your party competing for weapon choices. Longswords are always a safe bet, and some kind of ranged weapon for early on is a must (it becomes less important in BG2EE). You could go Katana for Dak'kon's Zerth Blade, but I generally have more important things to buy early in BG2, and it quickly gets outclassed (Celestial Fury is still a decent reason to grab the proficiency anyway). But you could honestly go in any direction, though two-weapon fighting's advantages mean you generally stick to one-handed weapons.
  • AvlanAvlan Member Posts: 21
    The fighter HLA's are the clincher, so I will go with the fighter/mage multi.(Namely the gnome Fighter/Illusionist)

    Though I will give points to the berserker/Mage, simply because of Berserk. So very handy in just about every situation. But if I was going to play a mage, I would stick with a more powerful caster like a Wild Mage or Sorcerer.
  • DevardKrownDevardKrown Member Posts: 421
    Dual over Multi any time of the Year.

    While Multi has His Merrits in BG1(may even be stronger), around mid SoA you will notice the lacking spell levels and the slower Spell Grade unlocks. also fighter after 13 will not add anything to your class aside marginal better THAC0 and Greater Whirlwind...where i prefer Improved Haste Over..

    Dual on the Other hand Opens up possibility's...
    from the crazy lvl 13 kensage who with his self buffs is basically immortal once you reach that...
    all the way down to the Puny LvL 2 Fighter who just opens up some Weapon choices , a Helm , a Shield and a few more HP so Kobolds don't kill him with a Cough...
    to everything in between, (namely 7 and 9)

    the only downside to Dual is the Downtime ...but that's as long as you want it to be..
  • CaradocCaradoc Member Posts: 92
    I find multi classing just way more fun because there is no downtime and you're character is always usefull. For me Elf fighter-mage is the most fun build in the entire game. In fact I'm currently replaying the saga as one :smile:
  • JumboWheat01JumboWheat01 Member Posts: 1,028
    I'm more fond of multi-classing myself whenever I actually do it (I'm more of a class purist, really, with the one exception of fighter/thief.) I don't like the idea of leaving a class behind when I obviously dedicated my pre-adventuring life to studying it.

    I'll also say I prefer a pure mage over a mixed one of any sort, even if my character is about as strong as wet tissue paper for the first couple of levels.
  • PK2748PK2748 Member Posts: 381
    A: Humans suck
    1- die of old age before gnomes even reach sexual peak
    2 - night blindness
    3 - no facial hair options
    B: Gnomes kick ass
    1- bonus illusion spells
    2 - fighter HLA
    3 - shorty saves
    4 - enemies have save penalties to your illusion spells

    The multi also doesn't have down time in between and you lose what? One half attack and 3 points of damage but gain ever improving thac0 so that in the long run you hit MORE often which results in more damage
  • ValorousValorous Member Posts: 5
    Thank you all for your exp with multi/dual class options. It's very nice of you to help new players out and I really am enjoying my gnomish fighter/mage. I think he just looks hilarious.
  • OrangemooseOrangemoose Member Posts: 83
    PK2748 said:


    1- bonus illusion spells

    Not worth it if you miss out on Necromancy in my opinion.
    Illusion spells are great sure, but Necromancy is also equally great.
  • JumboWheat01JumboWheat01 Member Posts: 1,028

    PK2748 said:


    1- bonus illusion spells

    Not worth it if you miss out on Necromancy in my opinion.
    Illusion spells are great sure, but Necromancy is also equally great.
    Well judging from your forum avatar, I can see why you think so, hehehe. Illusion spells tend to be very defensive, which an armorless Fighter/Illusionist would LOVE having more of on hand so they can get up-close and stab.
  • DevardKrownDevardKrown Member Posts: 421

    PK2748 said:


    1- bonus illusion spells

    Not worth it if you miss out on Necromancy in my opinion.
    Illusion spells are great sure, but Necromancy is also equally great.
    the utter reason i don't like Mage Specialists in the first Place, those extra spell/level is nice Indeed but i don't Like to be cut out of ANY school , because there is always this One spell you would want...
    even worse so for Multi Fighter/Illusionist ..while they cheer for their first lvl 7 spell at the Beginning of ToB i already chug out my first LvL 9
  • MalbethMalbeth Member Posts: 27
    Definitely duel class.

    In BG1, a straight fighter is good enough - and you can rely on others for your spellcasing.

    In BG2, access to high level abilities as a mage mean you need to be level 18+ for those 9th level slots. Fighter levels above 13 are a waste, since you are either using your wizard abilities to improve your fighter side or else you should just be a straight fighter.
  • Wraith_SarevokWraith_Sarevok Member Posts: 130
    Once you do Dual, you're too cool to go back.
  • jackjackjackjack Member Posts: 3,251
    Specifically, a Gnome Fighter/Illusionist :D
  • matricematrice Member Posts: 86

    Once you do Dual, you're too cool to go back.

    Even more, once you tasted the power of K21M22, you cann't ever go back to multy, they are so weak in comparaison :(
  • DevardKrownDevardKrown Member Posts: 421
    matrice said:

    Once you do Dual, you're too cool to go back.

    Even more, once you tasted the power of K21M22, you cann't ever go back to multy, they are so weak in comparaison :(
    while i bet that's a Powerhouse i would never play it , just bashing the last bit of ToB isn't worth the long Wait...but if its a Solo character and you do meta Grinding i can see its merits..still im not a fan of the kensai , being able to "cheat" around his restrictions is just weak programming..
  • matricematrice Member Posts: 86
    Yeah that's a freaking powerhouse (and that feeling when with alacrity you cast crit + kai on a bbod ^^) (along with 10 apr obviously)

    However i don't see any cheating around restriction, that's just common restriction. In addition, you can actually be 8M xp in a 3man party in soa, and mb with a 4 man party aswell (not sure for this one).

    And yeah as you stated it, i played once this character as solo, in a scs ascenscion, and i actually bashed so hard the last battle with it.
  • BazztasticBazztastic Member Posts: 8
    edited April 2016
    What weapon proficiency's would you take as gnome f/i? also what are the best 3 spells to pick on character selection? Planning to play multiplayer later going to roll up one now.

  • woowoovoodoowoowoovoodoo Member Posts: 150
    edited April 2016

    What weapon proficiency's would you take as gnome f/i? also what are the best 3 spells to pick on character selection? Planning to play multiplayer later going to roll up one now.

    To have some ranged weapon might be a good idea. Shortbows are rather good. It's up to you, even darts and slings will be fine but arguably short bows and crossbows are the strongest options for this class. WRT melee options: again, it's a matter of preference, e.g. if you prefer two-handed weapons, there are interesting quarterstaffs for mages. But if you're concerned with sheer power, then put two pips in two-weapon style and then put some pips into long swords, flails, katanas for main hand and maybe short swords or scimitars for off hand... not all of them, just pick something.
  • BazztasticBazztastic Member Posts: 8
    why short bow/crossbow over long bow? I like the sound of the 2 weapon style. If we have Khalid in the party should i avoid longsword? Why not mace for the stupifer or is flails better/katanas better?
  • woowoovoodoowoowoovoodoo Member Posts: 150
    edited April 2016

    also what are the best 3 spells to pick on character selection?

    Blindness makes sense. Also, because you're an illusionist, the enemies will have a penalty. It's not very useful in BG2, but before that it's a very good choice. Spook is also a good illusionist spell though it'll be more useful later due to high penalty to saving throws, but now you're rather not concerned with saving throws and 3 rounds are not very impressive. Sleep is a good choice though you can find it in the game rather easily. And Find familiar/Identify/Friends/Magic Missile are not useless in their own sense.
  • woowoovoodoowoowoovoodoo Member Posts: 150

    why short bow/crossbow over long bow? I like the sound of the 2 weapon style. If we have Khalid in the party should i avoid longsword? Why not mace for the stupifer or is flails better/katanas better?

    > why short bow
    Because there are several awesome short bows in BG2. And long bows in vanilla game are... acceptable but not the strongest choice. And you do not have the ability to respec your character in a legit way.
    > If we have Khalid in the party should i avoid longsword?
    There are enough longswords for everyone, rejoice! :)
    > Why not mace for the stupifer or is flails better/katanas better?
    Stupefier is nerfed, I think it's not worth to build a character around it. And in BG2 maces are not so strong as other options. Katanas are good for only basically the first half of BG2. Long swords and flails are both safe choices.
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