I see him die in a "glorious" way Fredrick Barbarossa style.
Crew member : "Captain, there's a hurricane, we can't cross it!" Balduran : "NONSENSE! I navigated these seas for most of my life, a little hurricane won't stop me!" *jumps inside water while wearing his armor, sword, shield and helmet*
They say Balduran was yet alive from those 3 months spent in the deep abyss of the oceans... but the crew just decided not to cope with his craziness and left him down there, where he's attempting to walk slowly out of the seas... Apparently he's the new Big Daddy >.<
@Miloch@RedGuard I'd certainly enjoy a mod that expanded on this possibility, it's a great idea. Even so, in all my playthroughs I always left the island thinking that Balduran had in all likelihood died there, both from an in-game perspective and from the perspective that I never felt like the writers deliberately aimed to keep the option open - so I guess we'll just have to disagree on that one.
Pretty sure he's dead. I actually ran a small RP way back in the day with an alternate history where he made a pact with Umberlee, pledging his ship and his crew to her service to escape the curse. Umberlee, all too happy to take the Wandering Eye which had eluded her wrath for so long only to lose it and the crew to Malar, agreed, claimed dominion over the lives of the crew, which Malar, as a lesser deity and ally, was forced to accept. Umberlee guided the crew back out to see, where in her cruelness, and Balduran's betrayal of Selune, who had guided him for so long kept the Eye at sea perpetually, where her crew succumbed to dehydration and died, only to serve Umberlee in their undeath. Balduran himself became a wraith, tainted by the pact he made with the abyssal deity.
The ship, kept afloat only by the will of Umberlee, now raids coastal towns and scuttles ships, appearing out of nowhere, and even when fired upon, seems to stay afloat. As characters in the RP, you hear rumors of a ghost ship which appears to be the very same Balduran captained. Your mission is to hunt down this ship, find out what happened to Balduran and his crew, if possible, and take care of the maritime threat.
Well... when I played TotSC I was pretty sure that he fell victim to the curse and was the first leader of the wolfweres (the folks that lived inside the ship)... By the end of his journal his writing became kind of erratic like he wasn't a human anymore.
And speaking of his gear. The only two places that you find his gear in are "Helmet and a Cloack" and Werewolf Island... God knows how his helmet and cloack got to Baldur's Gate... maybe it was mentioned somewhere in passing... but I'm convinced that he died on the island... no man in his right mind would set sail without his trusty butter knife in hand... ))
@Anduin: Btw the one who brought Balduran's gear to Amn was actually PC himself. It seems that PC was carring it with him on his journey. And after Irenicus caught him he stripped all his gear off, Half of it he sold and half he kept as trophies I guess... enchanted helmets make for fine interior decorations. ))
Wouldn't Balduran become a werewolf if he were cursed? I always thought Wolfweres were wolves turning into men, whereas Balduran - unless there are some darker secrets surrounding him than that of what was inside his underpants - most likely was a "natural" human.
You're right, wolfweres are the other way round to werewolves. Plus the werewolves and wolfweres are opposing factions, so I don't see it as likely Balduran becoming their leader.
The city of Baldur's Gate is named after the legendary seafaring explorer, so he's long dead unless something happened to him magically to extend his life.
NO! Balduran Lives! A man with a magical butter knife and a helmet a viking warlord would be proud of is not going to die on an island full of Werewolves... He would have BIT THEM and turned them into... into... Gnomes! (Gnomes are afterall byproducts from Gnashing ones teeth...)
Not sure if that is a logical conclusion...
But if you believe and clap your hands five times... then Balduran lives.
Possibly in the mummified remains of his underpants...
something happened to him magically to extend his life.
Yep... what I said. Time flows much slower on the Elemental Plane of Water .
@Grayvie - his writing does not become erratic toward the end of the journal... rather, most of it is too water-stained to read and he writes in "ye olde style" to begin with.
It would appear that time has not been kind to the pages of this tome, but snippets of information are still readable.
This is the logbook of the goode ship Wandering Eye, under the command of the mos...orthy Balduran
...will return once we have again seen far off shores. The men are restless, but the promise of wealth rivaling our last voyage will keep them well in line...
...weather is clear and we shall make Anchorome in goodly time, of that I have no doubt...
...have calmed the crew, though nervouse they will remain. I blame them not, for it was not a pleasante encounter in the least. Bloody Elves would do well to remember that the sea belongs to no one, save the gods that guard her. I shall avoide the northerly passage just the same, if only to prevent another overzealouse boarding party. Such paranoia from the 'fair folk...'
...arrived in Anchorome, and I am remembered by a goodly number of people, not all fondly...
...but 'his grace' has deemed me worthy to proceed through his lands. I am quite sure the two hundred-strong complement of the Wandering Eye aided in the decision. Still, we were received in goode humore, and I will not request tribute...
...adventure it has been! Such wealth as this...only in the deepest ruins of home. Here it is almost for the taking, with only a measure of 'diplomatic' discussions as the cost...
...attacked, and barely made it to the ship in time. Dradeel did warn of such, but who is to trust a worde from his mouth? I do sweare, his senses seem addled at the best of times...
...the crew, but a larger share for the remaining will keep them well and truly happy. I shall conscript replacements from the local populace this night, and we shall set our sails at dawn...
...delays, but with one hundred and fifty new hands, one must expect the going to be slow at the start. They seem quite calm and orderly, not at all as I expected...
...should have searched! We cast him out, but his words...eady inflamed the crew. I know not what was worse, the shaman's constant...or the reaction of the crew when he was committed to the sea. Their eyes are...and resigned. I dislike a crew with no fire in their bellies, but I do suppose it is better than a fire in the hold...
...weather unseasonable, and the moode does worsen. As well, beetles have beset the foode stores, and we shall surely be hungry long before reaching the coast of home...
...set aground to forage. It is a small isle, but will yield what we need. Perhaps I shall...on my own while the crew...time on land will do them goode...
...original men seem quite shallow in the face, quite different from the pallor of the new recruits, but all are most definitely ill...
Clearly these last two entries to me suggest "that's it, I'm outta here!"
Mark my words - Balduran gets back at it with a vengeance; long story short, he is put back together, by science...or maybe it's supernatural - CLEAVER!
I felt he either died on the island or ran away on a life boat at the last minute. I've always been undecided which would be correct. I can see him staying and trying to help his men. I can also see him running to a life boat and saying, 'I'm outta here!' when the men started to change.
The original BG1 manual says Balduran lived "long ago."
Btw, there's a whole history and evolution to the city of BG itself in canon. The crescent shaped city has a big wall running through the center of it that divides it. The original older half of the city adjoins the waterfront, and a newer and richer half was constructed above the wall. The lower half is supposed to be a bit seedier and grittier.
Anyway, the main gate of the interior wall that separates the city's lower and upper halves was named after Balduran. This happened informally.
I have files for all this somewheres, including a timeline for the city's development, IRCC. I had gathered all the lore on the region that I could find when I ran the Baldur's Gate region server for A Land Far Away years ago (for NWN1, that is).
@Lemernis - it was "long ago" but I forget how long exactly. I think whoever said it was around 300 years ago in that thread might be more or less right. The settlement at Baldur's Gate was obviously called something else before his time (though I never discovered what exactly; possibly it was named after the river Chionthar) since it has existed for much longer. There is doubtless some actual record of his expeditions on the timelines etc.
So obviously as a human he would be dead under normal conditions. But we're talking about a universe with potions of longevity, alternate planes/timestreams and other magic. Plus I find it more than a bit suspicious his body was never found, nor does such a great hero even have a tomb anywhere.
@Seldar - given that he refers to elves as "paranoid 'fair folk'" (as a result of sailing to close to Evermeet or something) he probably wouldn't be open to living with them, but who knows, maybe his views changed when he got older.
I think bladeinAmn has the best answer I have seen, from what we're able to cobble together. I had thought his post referencing author George Krashos sharing what Ed Greenwood has said about the founding of the city was probably the most definitive one I've seen. However Ed did have more to say about this at the Candlekeep site:
The realm of Shavinar was founded in the Year of the Raised Banner (227 DR) by a local adventurer, Orluth Tshahvur (possibly-exaggerated bards' ballads describe him as a "swift sword" who "won many blood victories" and was smart as well as deadly in battle), in an attempt to unite human steadings (ranches and farms) for common defense against marauding monsters, frequent troll raids, and outlaws cast out of more southerly Sword Coast cities.
Tshahvur built a crude keep near what is now Baldur's Gate (and was then a nameless cluster of fisherfolk huts), lured a shipwright fleeing from Calishite persecution to settle, and established what was really a pirate port: he was ruthless with anyone who used violence against anyone else there, but otherwise "welcomed all and let anything pass."
The place became known as Gaeth (the Thorass local word for "rivermouth" or "inlet"), the obvious derivation of the "gate" part of the name "Baldur's Gate" today. Gaeth was home to perhaps 120 people (dwelling in fieldstone-and-thatch or wood-and-thatch huts, situated on three wandering dirt streets) when "Lord Tshahvur of Shavinar" died (in 242 DR), an iron-hard man worn out by almost countless hard riding and harder sword-swinging, as he fought trolls, trolls, and more trolls to keep Shavinar from being overrun.
Orluth's son, the proud and pompous King Arlsar (chiefly remembered for his indefatigable wenching ways and his mirror-bright, gem-studded, ornate "show" suit of plate armour) inherited a kingdom that stretched from the sea-mouth of the northbank River Chionthar along the coast as far north as the Troll Hills, and "four days' ride" east (probably 80 to 100 miles, as we moderns would reckon it). Arlsar abandoned most of his father's hilltop forts (little more than ring-ditches around summits that sported barrow-like "weather shelter" chambers) as too expensive (along with the warriors who defended them; as they fell in fighting, they weren't replaced), and during his short reign Shavinar shrunk - - under persistent troll and outlaw raids - - to less than forty miles across.
Arlsar was murdered by ambitious merchants (who'd begun to settle in Gaeth in some numbers, to carry on all manner of business too unsavoury or too highly taxed to be profitable "back home" in Calimshan and the Tashalar) in 256 DR, and the realm almost disintegrated in the struggle for power that followed.
A cabal of local families viciously poisoned and stabbed various outlander merchants to put forward one of Arlsar's many sons to be king. The glib-tongued, handsome, promise-all Raulovan reigned for four months before one of the Calishite factions ended his pretty words forever - - but a wizard who'd settled on the coastal headlands had grown weary of all the strife, and started spellslaying claimants to the throne and the outlanders promoting them, clearing the way for Arlsar's youngest son, sometimes called "Stonehead" for his terse manner and slow speech: Kondarar.
No one disputes that Kondarar was King in every sense of the manner: just, firm, and a tireless mountain of a man whose strength could overmatch most monsters in blade-to-blade battle, he almost single-handedly kept Shavinar in existence (just as his grandsire had done, by spending his days in the saddle, hewing trolls wherever he found them) from his ascension in late 256 DR to when it all ended in 277 DR, and Shavinar was swept away (Gaeth and all) by trolls and "monsters beyond numbering, all wandering in their own snarling bands."
In short, Shavinar was typical of hundreds of short-lived realms in Faerûn, that have risen and fallen again down the years: they founder if the successors to those who establish them are not stronger - - or far luckier - - than their predecessors.
I thought the quests in TOTSC made it clear. Having escaped that wretched island he went on to found one of the largest butter knife producers in all the realms. Partly because he had forgotten his on his old ship, and partly because in that voyage he learned the value of a good butter knife.
He had to have died on the island. If he built a ship to get off before the curse took hold(and he was an explorer, not a shipwright), he'd have taken his people with him, and probably be killed at sea. If it was after, I don't see how he'd have been able to do it, since everyone would've known if anyone could get off the island it'd be him, and would go hunting for him.
I'm not sure I even like the idea of him 'fighting everything off and escaping in secret'. I honestly never got the impression Balduran was an accomplished warrior, or even anyone that special. The impression I got was that his travels net him a great amount of wealth with which he used to buy several expensive knick-knacks. James Cook had a dashing cape and a sword, and he got stabbed and killed pretty handily.
If Balduran did escape, I can see him retiring comfortably in some far-off land and dying fat and old. I'm not that big into all the extra lore, so I'll just say that I don't like the idea of EVERYONE being a Mary Sue.
Comments
Find the underpants and you find your man!
Maybe a sock aswell...
Crew member : "Captain, there's a hurricane, we can't cross it!"
Balduran : "NONSENSE! I navigated these seas for most of my life, a little hurricane won't stop me!" *jumps inside water while wearing his armor, sword, shield and helmet*
They say Balduran was yet alive from those 3 months spent in the deep abyss of the oceans... but the crew just decided not to cope with his craziness and left him down there, where he's attempting to walk slowly out of the seas... Apparently he's the new Big Daddy >.<
I think he died after sustaining a nasty butter related wound.
The ship, kept afloat only by the will of Umberlee, now raids coastal towns and scuttles ships, appearing out of nowhere, and even when fired upon, seems to stay afloat. As characters in the RP, you hear rumors of a ghost ship which appears to be the very same Balduran captained. Your mission is to hunt down this ship, find out what happened to Balduran and his crew, if possible, and take care of the maritime threat.
And speaking of his gear. The only two places that you find his gear in are "Helmet and a Cloack" and Werewolf Island... God knows how his helmet and cloack got to Baldur's Gate... maybe it was mentioned somewhere in passing... but I'm convinced that he died on the island... no man in his right mind would set sail without his trusty butter knife in hand...
@Anduin:
Btw the one who brought Balduran's gear to Amn was actually PC himself.
Not sure if that is a logical conclusion...
But if you believe and clap your hands five times... then Balduran lives.
Possibly in the mummified remains of his underpants...
@Grayvie - his writing does not become erratic toward the end of the journal... rather, most of it is too water-stained to read and he writes in "ye olde style" to begin with.
This is the logbook of the goode ship Wandering Eye, under the command of the mos...orthy Balduran
...will return once we have again seen far off shores. The men are restless, but the promise of wealth rivaling our last voyage will keep them well in line...
...weather is clear and we shall make Anchorome in goodly time, of that I have no doubt...
...have calmed the crew, though nervouse they will remain. I blame them not, for it was not a pleasante encounter in the least. Bloody Elves would do well to remember that the sea belongs to no one, save the gods that guard her. I shall avoide the northerly passage just the same, if only to prevent another overzealouse boarding party. Such paranoia from the 'fair folk...'
...arrived in Anchorome, and I am remembered by a goodly number of people, not all fondly...
...but 'his grace' has deemed me worthy to proceed through his lands. I am quite sure the two hundred-strong complement of the Wandering Eye aided in the decision. Still, we were received in goode humore, and I will not request tribute...
...adventure it has been! Such wealth as this...only in the deepest ruins of home. Here it is almost for the taking, with only a measure of 'diplomatic' discussions as the cost...
...attacked, and barely made it to the ship in time. Dradeel did warn of such, but who is to trust a worde from his mouth? I do sweare, his senses seem addled at the best of times...
...the crew, but a larger share for the remaining will keep them well and truly happy. I shall conscript replacements from the local populace this night, and we shall set our sails at dawn...
...delays, but with one hundred and fifty new hands, one must expect the going to be slow at the start. They seem quite calm and orderly, not at all as I expected...
...should have searched! We cast him out, but his words...eady inflamed the crew. I know not what was worse, the shaman's constant...or the reaction of the crew when he was committed to the sea. Their eyes are...and resigned. I dislike a crew with no fire in their bellies, but I do suppose it is better than a fire in the hold...
...weather unseasonable, and the moode does worsen. As well, beetles have beset the foode stores, and we shall surely be hungry long before reaching the coast of home...
...set aground to forage. It is a small isle, but will yield what we need. Perhaps I shall...on my own while the crew...time on land will do them goode...
...original men seem quite shallow in the face, quite different from the pallor of the new recruits, but all are most definitely ill...
Some infos about Balduran here :
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Balduran
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Anchorome
so apparently, Entar Silvershield tried to find Balduran... maybe the BG EE could include new content about this story
Btw, there's a whole history and evolution to the city of BG itself in canon. The crescent shaped city has a big wall running through the center of it that divides it. The original older half of the city adjoins the waterfront, and a newer and richer half was constructed above the wall. The lower half is supposed to be a bit seedier and grittier.
Anyway, the main gate of the interior wall that separates the city's lower and upper halves was named after Balduran. This happened informally.
I have files for all this somewheres, including a timeline for the city's development, IRCC. I had gathered all the lore on the region that I could find when I ran the Baldur's Gate region server for A Land Far Away years ago (for NWN1, that is).
So obviously as a human he would be dead under normal conditions. But we're talking about a universe with potions of longevity, alternate planes/timestreams and other magic. Plus I find it more than a bit suspicious his body was never found, nor does such a great hero even have a tomb anywhere.
@Seldar - given that he refers to elves as "paranoid 'fair folk'" (as a result of sailing to close to Evermeet or something) he probably wouldn't be open to living with them, but who knows, maybe his views changed when he got older.
I thought the quests in TOTSC made it clear. Having escaped that wretched island he went on to found one of the largest butter knife producers in all the realms. Partly because he had forgotten his on his old ship, and partly because in that voyage he learned the value of a good butter knife.
I'm not sure I even like the idea of him 'fighting everything off and escaping in secret'. I honestly never got the impression Balduran was an accomplished warrior, or even anyone that special. The impression I got was that his travels net him a great amount of wealth with which he used to buy several expensive knick-knacks. James Cook had a dashing cape and a sword, and he got stabbed and killed pretty handily.
If Balduran did escape, I can see him retiring comfortably in some far-off land and dying fat and old. I'm not that big into all the extra lore, so I'll just say that I don't like the idea of EVERYONE being a Mary Sue.
The epic tale of Balduran's Boxers WILL be told!