You're comparing DRM on a video game to a Government of a country? Wow. Talk about comparing apples to oranges. They are so completely different that words fail me.
The rest of your post is a justifcation on why you like DRM. Just because you like it doesn't mean everybody has to.
I SAID IN MY ARGUMENT THAT I DON'T EXPECT EVERYONE TO AGREE WITH ME AND I UNDERSTAND THE OTHER SIDE.
Jesus tapdancing Christ. Heaven forbid someone with an alternate viewpoint speak his mind.
Also, YOU'RE THE ONE WHO SAID "To argue degrees of something is less or more invasive doesn't get around the fact that it still is invasive." IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE PEOPLE OFFERING COUNTER ARGUMENTS, PLEASE GO AWAY. PLEASE. GO. AWAY.
Guys, let me put a few things out there to settle these tizzies. First of all DRM is digital rights management and, without looking at wikipedia (which I hate anyway), it's the use of software incorporated into products to prevent the unauthorized use of said products. It is used to control the way people are permitted to use certain things.
Forms of DRM:
CD required to play (to prevent buddy installation deals) CD key (randomly issued to confirm the game is authentic) Non burnable CD protect (to avoid people burning copies and selling them out) Archived files (files which are formatted to make game resources unaccessible by noobs)
New forms of DRM:
Online registration (for either the game or provider) Online subscription (for the provider) Constantly online Required software (from the provider, like Valve's program Steam) Always compress ALL game files, even basic .exes so they are unaccessible). One copy per computer Invading unauthorized software installed on my computer (like Steam did)
Steam uses ALL OF THESE on my Stronghold 3 Gold DVD-ROM, except for constantly online and paid subscription (except they make me use Steam to access the game, those greedy bastards).
AND GUESS WHAT HAPPENED TO ME TODAY? I found out one of the programs Steam installed on my computer without my permission was some form of C++ runtime library which games use to organize code. I don't know how it works, but my computer already had a version of it.
Steam installed multiple things on my computer and ate several gigs of space doing so and replacing the old version of Microsoft C++ Redistribution made several of my installed games glitch and crash when I tried to use them.
I am not only going to demand my money back for S3 in the store but I am going to contact Valve and demand an explination and for justifying installing things on my computer without my acknowledgement.
@Ward: Are you sure Steam did all of that? I also got Steam and experienced none of those issues. You sure your PC isn't infected by some or the other virus, or another program installing them without your knowledge? I never had games crash because of Steam. O_o
@Kitteh_On_A_Cloud I am sure. When I was install Stronghold 3 Gold using Steam's online bullshit and attempted to run the game, it said 'setting up for first time run' or something.
Then it downloaded 4 programs, the only one I can remember is Microsoft C++ Redistribution. It was not the Stronghold disc which installed these programs, they were installed via Steam.
Updating this C++ thing made a lot of my games which seemed to rely on it crash and not work. I had to uninstall and repatch Majesty 2 for example.
I SAID IN MY ARGUMENT THAT I DON'T EXPECT EVERYONE TO AGREE WITH ME AND I UNDERSTAND THE OTHER SIDE.
Jesus tapdancing Christ. Heaven forbid someone with an alternate viewpoint speak his mind.
Also, YOU'RE THE ONE WHO SAID "To argue degrees of something is less or more invasive doesn't get around the fact that it still is invasive." IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE PEOPLE OFFERING COUNTER ARGUMENTS, PLEASE GO AWAY. PLEASE. GO. AWAY.
Clearly you don't understand the other side. You said games from GOG was DRM when they even advertise their games don't have DRM. They must be lying.
Also, it's the true sign of someone who can't have a civil discussion and debate on the points without having to resort to shouting (and at times name calling but not in this case).
Seriously, you should take your own advice. "If you can't handle people offering counter arguments, please go away. please. go. away."
@Metal_Hurlant One of you has to give in and 'lose' and I suggest it be you Metal. One of you has to act like the adult here and accept defeat. You're bickering over rubbish guys.
The problem at hand is Valve are bastards and they ripped me off $30. GOG is not DRM, requiring to download a game is as required as having the disc. You can't get the files on your computer with your mind.
Let me tell you about GamersGate when I bought Majesty Gold HD. Basicly you had to download an installer which you logged into with your GamersGate account, then the installer would download the game from their servers into a temporary folder which would be deleted after you downloaded and installed the game.
However, you do have the choice of putting the game on a storage device if you want to, but they assume you won't figure that out and you'll never get to keep the game itself.
Now even though I don't like GamersGate's registration and programs, I got to keep the game, so I am happy and they can't do anything to interfere with it.
Wow, I'm just suprised how the people debating about the meaning of DRM and how steam is good or bad are still going on. I think the topic name should be changed to "Someone is wrong on the internet!" (reference to xkcd's comic: http://xkcd.com/386/)
*runs away from the topic*
Edit: Oh! now i get it! This is all a plan to take screenshots of those that reply to this topic. It says "I'll never use steam again" and shows the last person who responded. nice way to fake show anti steam users!"
@Shinorus Steam is bad. Even people who like their games and don't mind the service, Steam is still bad, they just don't care about that. In my case, it's bad due to privacy and service.
Hell knows why those idiots are debating the meaning of DRM, we all know what it is and what it's used for and the matter at hand is Valve are preventing my unauthorized enjoyment of S3. Not that I use things in an unauthorized way.
P.S. Lolll'd at the comic brah. People really are like that on here.
Well, I haven't had any issues with Steam myself. I think it's annoying, but bearable. I especially dislike the idea of me not really owning the games as well. But then most of my games were bought at a discount (except for Skyrim) and I'm too busy with real life stuff to game much anyway. Fucking real life...Wish I could have more luck, but seems I ran out of it four years ago. Wouldn't surprise me if my laptop breaks down today. Anyway, geting off-topic, sorry.
@Shinorus Steam is bad. Even people who like their games and don't mind the service, Steam is still bad, they just don't care about that. In my case, it's bad due to privacy and service.
It's not "bad". It has advantages and disadvantages. I actually prefer to own a game on steam compared to owning it on a disc. (A DRM-free opinion would be better, if it came with the same support - but it does not) Why do I prefer it? For example a few years ago while moving I had lost one of my old BG CDs (it was the 6 CD version from the days of old) and could only play it again after I bought the complete BG series collection. If I had it on steam this couldn't have happened. I had steam for several years now, and have a lot of games on it. I never experienced any sort of troublewith any of them. A friend of mine who had, had experienced a very trough and professional support. I suggest you try doing this if you keep having problems with your copy.
Obviously there are drawbacks as well but there are drawbacks to ALL methods of buying games, even the much praised GOG DRM free version. (Anyone else bought Dungeon Keeper 2 on GOG because they advertised it can run on Win7 and then it didn't?)
You're so horribly wrong - GoG doesn't use DRM. GoG only has a login to allow you to securely store YOUR property on their servers and verify that it is YOU accessing it - just like when your bank verifies you when making a withdrawal. Once you buy a game through GoG, you can do WHATEVER you want. You can make as many backups as you want, you can store them on whatever media you want, and you never ever have to rely on a server to use it. You may be OK with Steam now, but what about when they decide that not enough people like your favorite game and they get rid of it to free up space? What if they go bankrupt (don't give me the crap of "They'd never go bankrupt!" - people have said that plenty of times about companies that now no longer exist) - then you lose everything. You may be OK with allowing someone else to control your property, but many are not. The sad thing will be the day when other industries realize that people are foolish and submissive enough to accept this type of behavior. Then we'll end up with cars that only run for a certain number of months before you have to call the manufacturer and pay for more "licenses".
CD required to play (to prevent buddy installation deals) CD key (randomly issued to confirm the game is authentic) Non burnable CD protect (to avoid people burning copies and selling them out) Archived files (files which are formatted to make game resources unaccessible by noobs)"
You're confusing copy protection with DRM. DRM restricts your ability to use a game - copy protection restricts your ability to make copies of a game...there's a HUGE difference. With all the things you listed, as long as you have hardware that will run the game, it'll work in a billion years because they merely have copy protection. A game with DRM on the other hand only works until the company decides it's no longer profitable to have those servers turned on and then it's useless.
As for your issues with Steam? Well, that's what you get for willingly using DRM. You have no one to blame but yourself for that one.
@Totenglocke I think you (and @Metal_Hurlant) were missing the point that @sandmanCCL and I were trying to make. There's an intense stigma about DRM that exists because of things like Steam, Origin, Uplay, and similar clients that interfere with a gamer's freedoms. As a result, a lot of people assume that if something has any form of DRM, then it must be bad.
If a website says its products are DRM-free, that's a strong selling point for that website. But the service itself still has to have some form of DRM, because it has to authenticate your purchase before it allows you to download the product.
That's all DRM means. It means authenticating a purchased product before use. And in that sense, GOG.com does use a very limited, unobtrusive form of DRM. The DRM doesn't restrict your use of the game once it's been downloaded, but the fact that it requires you to log in means that it's restricting your ability to download the game. It doesn't limit the number of times you can download it; it just limits who can download it (i.e. only people with your user name and password).
So not only was I forced to have my privacy invaded by installing a 3rd party program I didn't want and sign up for something I wasn't planning to use again, but Steam installed itself into so many directories and the game ate up so much space which is now irrecoverable due to the sparseness of where it put the files.
Rally to me, fellow basement-dwellers, and stroke your neckbeards! The privacy of our basements is under Orwellian attack by the evil Gaben!
"As a result, a lot of people assume that if something has any form of DRM, then it must be bad."
It's not a "misconception", it's a fact that you lose control of your property by using DRM and that your right to use the property you payed for can be revoked at any time.
"But the service itself still has to have some form of DRM, because it has to authenticate your purchase before it allows you to download the product."
No, it's not. Your love of DRM blinds you to the fact that logging into an account to purchase something is NOT DRM because it does not in any way, shape, or form affect your ability to USE the product. That's like claiming anything you buy from Amazon has DRM because you have to log into an Amazon account to make a purchase - which is just absurd.
"It means authenticating a purchased product before use."
No, it doesn't. It means restricting your ability to use a purchased product based on the whims of the company that utilizes the DRM.
I'm not sure where your full on rage against non-DRM games comes from, but if you want to harm yourself by buying products using DRM, that's your perogative...but please stop lying and trying to mislead the uninformed into making bad purchases.
AND GUESS WHAT HAPPENED TO ME TODAY? I found out one of the programs Steam installed on my computer without my permission was some form of C++ runtime library which games use to organize code. I don't know how it works, but my computer already had a version of it.
Steam installed multiple things on my computer and ate several gigs of space doing so and replacing the old version of Microsoft C++ Redistribution made several of my installed games glitch and crash when I tried to use them.
I am not only going to demand my money back for S3 in the store but I am going to contact Valve and demand an explination and for justifying installing things on my computer without my acknowledgement.
Steam installs anything it needs to in order to get the game to work. This is no different than GoG's installers which automatically include anything it needs to in order to get the game to run on modern day systems.
The fact it ate up so much of your harddrive is strange. I only have one copy of C++ installed on my machine and whenever I install a new game, while the program runs through it again, it 'repairs' the installation. I have had a few games where it uses an older version of C++ and during the initial install, C++ gives me a prompt to over-right or ignore installing it because I've got a later version already installed. I have never had it install something "without my acknowledgement" because it simply doesn't do it. There are prompts and I for one consider it a bonus anything I need to run the game is included in the installation.
I'd also like to point out again the majority of your problem should be directed at Stronghold 3, and not the service through which it is played. Any Valve game gives you unlimited use of installations of the game, as long as you've got Steam running on that system. S3 limiting you to a single copy only is a fault of that game.
@Totenglocke: If Valve goes under, they have failsafes to allow people to continue to play their games owned via Steam. I can track down the article I've read on the subject but it'd take me a really long time because it was several years ago where I read it.
Besides, it's not like the real world doesn't have issues which can cause you to lose your games. I trust Steam's servers to store my titles more than I trust mother nature to not burn down my house or my fellow man to not steal my stuff. As I already said, I had my childhood destroyed in a flood. I've had other games I've purchased stolen from burglaries, or even worse simply misplaced and lost for good.
BTW if something like that were to happen to me again, I would have to go into GoG's servers with a secure login to re-download titles purchased through there. That is still technically a form of DRM. It's the least invasive one ever, but still. You have to give up credit card/paypal information and an e-mail address. It's just the .exe itself doesn't have anything else attached to it, which honestly I think is a little silly on the part of the guys who sell it. GoG's versions of games are the #1 pirated copies of any of those titles. As much as I love the unobtrusiveness of their installers, they are handing pirates a golden plate upon which to steal.
@Aosaw I'm sorry that me using facts ruins your pro-DRM rant. If you can't deal with reality, it's best that you let the grown ups talk.
@sandmanCCL That's not true, unless they made a recent change. I've looked into it and the official TOS says that if they decide to ditch a game or go under that they "might" give you a refund or "might" give you a DRM-free version to play - but there's no guarantee.
"BTW if something like that were to happen to me again, I would have to go into GoG's servers with a secure login to re-download titles purchased through there. That is still technically a form of DRM."
*beats head against desk* There's no reasoning with your pro-DRM zealots. Logging into an account that exists as just a backup way to store your property (you can put them on dropbox, your own FTP server, an external hard drive, DVD's, etc) is NOT DRM.
Please, provide some citation for your "most pirated" claim. All games, DRM or not, are pirated - yet game companies continue to make millions of dollars each year. Hell, if you bothered to do tiny bit of reading, you'd see that CEO's of game companies have openly admitted in interviews that they don't lose any money to piracy and that the entire purpose of DRM is to try to kill off the used games market and to force people to buy new games due to intentionally breaking their existing games. It's sad that you're so thoroughly brainwashed that you not only accept the PR bull about DRM, but you actively promote it's use and insult those who don't punish their customers.
C++ runtime installers put new library's of files on your PC that you must have in order to play the game. They are nothing to do with DRM, without them you can't play the game, much like dlls, etc.
If a website says its products are DRM-free, that's a strong selling point for that website. But the service itself still has to have some form of DRM, because it has to authenticate your purchase before it allows you to download the product.
That's all DRM means. It means authenticating a purchased product before use. And in that sense, GOG.com does use a very limited, unobtrusive form of DRM. The DRM doesn't restrict your use of the game once it's been downloaded, but the fact that it requires you to log in means that it's restricting your ability to download the game. It doesn't limit the number of times you can download it; it just limits who can download it (i.e. only people with your user name and password).
You seem to be missing the point of what DRM is. Instead of making up your own incorrect definition of what DRM is, how about actually quoting a definition that's actually true. Your post would be more credible if you actually named a source of what DRM is instead of making stuff up as you go along.
@Totenglocke Copy protection does the same thing as DRM, the only difference is as a legal copy player you aren't bothered by copy protection. It's easier to include it as DRM when the purpose of all of it is to stop people from stealing.
@SandmanCCL Steam installed about 8 copies of C++ of various types on my computer some of them with completely random names like esugbwudb98wafbv9wehfwqb0fwqfnuebm.
I would not use online services to store my games over a USB. If I lose discs or something then I have burnt copies and if I can't make copies I have a digital version from GoG or something. But I'm happy with discs and not comfortable with relying on Steam, GG or GoG.
@ginger_hammer I know they have nothing to do with DRM. My point was Steam puts crap on my computer without telling me. Every game I've installed prior to SH3 asked me before it installed stuff. Unless I did not realize.
It happens the crap Steam put on my computer messed up a lot of data, that's the main reason I'm enraged.
No, copy protection and DRM don't even remotely do the same thing. Copy protection prevents you from making unauthorized copies. DRM keeps you from installing or launching a game without begging the company for permission first (permission which may be denied for any number of reasons - and will permanently be denied if / when the company goes out of business or decides that they want you to buy the next game in the series and turn off the activation servers for older games).
You cannot "steal" something digital. I've already said that, due to DRM, I will no longer buy BG:EE - that means Overhaul makes $0 from me. If it became available on TPB and I torrented it, their total profit from me would remain $0. You cannot steal something if there is no loss. Stealing a physical copy of a game results in a financial loss because it cost money to manufacture the disc, burn the game to the disc, make the manual, make the box, ship it to the store, and pay someone to put the boxes on the shelves. These costs are non-existent with digital copies of a game.
The rampant Stockholm Syndrome is quite saddening....
@Totenglocke I'm not interested in arguing about the definition of DRM like you are with the other fools on this thread. I included copy protective software in the list because they all serve the purpose of preventing unauthorized use, illegal use, etc.
Except you're ignoring that the primary purpose of DRM isn't to prevent copying, but to incorporate a form of planned obsolescence in a product and ensure that the game is only playable as long as the company wants it to be. Instead of trying to come up with a reason why customers should put up with such an absurd addition to a product, you keep trying to claim that it's no different from a disc check.
Comments
Jesus tapdancing Christ. Heaven forbid someone with an alternate viewpoint speak his mind.
Also, YOU'RE THE ONE WHO SAID "To argue degrees of something is less or more invasive doesn't get around the fact that it still is invasive." IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE PEOPLE OFFERING COUNTER ARGUMENTS, PLEASE GO AWAY. PLEASE. GO. AWAY.
Forms of DRM:
CD required to play (to prevent buddy installation deals)
CD key (randomly issued to confirm the game is authentic)
Non burnable CD protect (to avoid people burning copies and selling them out)
Archived files (files which are formatted to make game resources unaccessible by noobs)
New forms of DRM:
Online registration (for either the game or provider)
Online subscription (for the provider)
Constantly online
Required software (from the provider, like Valve's program Steam)
Always compress ALL game files, even basic .exes so they are unaccessible).
One copy per computer
Invading unauthorized software installed on my computer (like Steam did)
Steam uses ALL OF THESE on my Stronghold 3 Gold DVD-ROM, except for constantly online and paid subscription (except they make me use Steam to access the game, those greedy bastards).
AND GUESS WHAT HAPPENED TO ME TODAY? I found out one of the programs Steam installed on my computer without my permission was some form of C++ runtime library which games use to organize code. I don't know how it works, but my computer already had a version of it.
Steam installed multiple things on my computer and ate several gigs of space doing so and replacing the old version of Microsoft C++ Redistribution made several of my installed games glitch and crash when I tried to use them.
I am not only going to demand my money back for S3 in the store but I am going to contact Valve and demand an explination and for justifying installing things on my computer without my acknowledgement.
Except Valve I hate a little bit more at the moment.
Then it downloaded 4 programs, the only one I can remember is Microsoft C++ Redistribution. It was not the Stronghold disc which installed these programs, they were installed via Steam.
Updating this C++ thing made a lot of my games which seemed to rely on it crash and not work. I had to uninstall and repatch Majesty 2 for example.
The problem at hand is Valve are bastards and they ripped me off $30. GOG is not DRM, requiring to download a game is as required as having the disc. You can't get the files on your computer with your mind.
Let me tell you about GamersGate when I bought Majesty Gold HD. Basicly you had to download an installer which you logged into with your GamersGate account, then the installer would download the game from their servers into a temporary folder which would be deleted after you downloaded and installed the game.
However, you do have the choice of putting the game on a storage device if you want to, but they assume you won't figure that out and you'll never get to keep the game itself.
Now even though I don't like GamersGate's registration and programs, I got to keep the game, so I am happy and they can't do anything to interfere with it.
*runs away from the topic*
Edit: Oh! now i get it! This is all a plan to take screenshots of those that reply to this topic. It says "I'll never use steam again" and shows the last person who responded. nice way to fake show anti steam users!"
*runs away for good this time*
Hell knows why those idiots are debating the meaning of DRM, we all know what it is and what it's used for and the matter at hand is Valve are preventing my unauthorized enjoyment of S3. Not that I use things in an unauthorized way.
P.S. Lolll'd at the comic brah. People really are like that on here.
Umm actually, I did not know it woud send a notification, if I left it in a quote, sorry...:)
You're so horribly wrong - GoG doesn't use DRM. GoG only has a login to allow you to securely store YOUR property on their servers and verify that it is YOU accessing it - just like when your bank verifies you when making a withdrawal. Once you buy a game through GoG, you can do WHATEVER you want. You can make as many backups as you want, you can store them on whatever media you want, and you never ever have to rely on a server to use it. You may be OK with Steam now, but what about when they decide that not enough people like your favorite game and they get rid of it to free up space? What if they go bankrupt (don't give me the crap of "They'd never go bankrupt!" - people have said that plenty of times about companies that now no longer exist) - then you lose everything. You may be OK with allowing someone else to control your property, but many are not. The sad thing will be the day when other industries realize that people are foolish and submissive enough to accept this type of behavior. Then we'll end up with cars that only run for a certain number of months before you have to call the manufacturer and pay for more "licenses".
@Ward
"Forms of DRM:
CD required to play (to prevent buddy installation deals)
CD key (randomly issued to confirm the game is authentic)
Non burnable CD protect (to avoid people burning copies and selling them out)
Archived files (files which are formatted to make game resources unaccessible by noobs)"
You're confusing copy protection with DRM. DRM restricts your ability to use a game - copy protection restricts your ability to make copies of a game...there's a HUGE difference. With all the things you listed, as long as you have hardware that will run the game, it'll work in a billion years because they merely have copy protection. A game with DRM on the other hand only works until the company decides it's no longer profitable to have those servers turned on and then it's useless.
As for your issues with Steam? Well, that's what you get for willingly using DRM. You have no one to blame but yourself for that one.
I think you (and @Metal_Hurlant) were missing the point that @sandmanCCL and I were trying to make. There's an intense stigma about DRM that exists because of things like Steam, Origin, Uplay, and similar clients that interfere with a gamer's freedoms. As a result, a lot of people assume that if something has any form of DRM, then it must be bad.
If a website says its products are DRM-free, that's a strong selling point for that website. But the service itself still has to have some form of DRM, because it has to authenticate your purchase before it allows you to download the product.
That's all DRM means. It means authenticating a purchased product before use. And in that sense, GOG.com does use a very limited, unobtrusive form of DRM. The DRM doesn't restrict your use of the game once it's been downloaded, but the fact that it requires you to log in means that it's restricting your ability to download the game. It doesn't limit the number of times you can download it; it just limits who can download it (i.e. only people with your user name and password).
"As a result, a lot of people assume that if something has any form of DRM, then it must be bad."
It's not a "misconception", it's a fact that you lose control of your property by using DRM and that your right to use the property you payed for can be revoked at any time.
"But the service itself still has to have some form of DRM, because it has to authenticate your purchase before it allows you to download the product."
No, it's not. Your love of DRM blinds you to the fact that logging into an account to purchase something is NOT DRM because it does not in any way, shape, or form affect your ability to USE the product. That's like claiming anything you buy from Amazon has DRM because you have to log into an Amazon account to make a purchase - which is just absurd.
"It means authenticating a purchased product before use."
No, it doesn't. It means restricting your ability to use a purchased product based on the whims of the company that utilizes the DRM.
I'm not sure where your full on rage against non-DRM games comes from, but if you want to harm yourself by buying products using DRM, that's your perogative...but please stop lying and trying to mislead the uninformed into making bad purchases.
Okay. Clearly there's no interest here in having an intelligent discussion. If you only want to vent and talk about how evil DRM, go ahead.
Wow. Just...wow.
The fact it ate up so much of your harddrive is strange. I only have one copy of C++ installed on my machine and whenever I install a new game, while the program runs through it again, it 'repairs' the installation. I have had a few games where it uses an older version of C++ and during the initial install, C++ gives me a prompt to over-right or ignore installing it because I've got a later version already installed. I have never had it install something "without my acknowledgement" because it simply doesn't do it. There are prompts and I for one consider it a bonus anything I need to run the game is included in the installation.
I'd also like to point out again the majority of your problem should be directed at Stronghold 3, and not the service through which it is played. Any Valve game gives you unlimited use of installations of the game, as long as you've got Steam running on that system. S3 limiting you to a single copy only is a fault of that game.
@Totenglocke:
If Valve goes under, they have failsafes to allow people to continue to play their games owned via Steam. I can track down the article I've read on the subject but it'd take me a really long time because it was several years ago where I read it.
Besides, it's not like the real world doesn't have issues which can cause you to lose your games. I trust Steam's servers to store my titles more than I trust mother nature to not burn down my house or my fellow man to not steal my stuff. As I already said, I had my childhood destroyed in a flood. I've had other games I've purchased stolen from burglaries, or even worse simply misplaced and lost for good.
BTW if something like that were to happen to me again, I would have to go into GoG's servers with a secure login to re-download titles purchased through there. That is still technically a form of DRM. It's the least invasive one ever, but still. You have to give up credit card/paypal information and an e-mail address. It's just the .exe itself doesn't have anything else attached to it, which honestly I think is a little silly on the part of the guys who sell it. GoG's versions of games are the #1 pirated copies of any of those titles. As much as I love the unobtrusiveness of their installers, they are handing pirates a golden plate upon which to steal.
@sandmanCCL That's not true, unless they made a recent change. I've looked into it and the official TOS says that if they decide to ditch a game or go under that they "might" give you a refund or "might" give you a DRM-free version to play - but there's no guarantee.
"BTW if something like that were to happen to me again, I would have to go into GoG's servers with a secure login to re-download titles purchased through there. That is still technically a form of DRM."
*beats head against desk* There's no reasoning with your pro-DRM zealots. Logging into an account that exists as just a backup way to store your property (you can put them on dropbox, your own FTP server, an external hard drive, DVD's, etc) is NOT DRM.
Please, provide some citation for your "most pirated" claim. All games, DRM or not, are pirated - yet game companies continue to make millions of dollars each year. Hell, if you bothered to do tiny bit of reading, you'd see that CEO's of game companies have openly admitted in interviews that they don't lose any money to piracy and that the entire purpose of DRM is to try to kill off the used games market and to force people to buy new games due to intentionally breaking their existing games. It's sad that you're so thoroughly brainwashed that you not only accept the PR bull about DRM, but you actively promote it's use and insult those who don't punish their customers.
@SandmanCCL Steam installed about 8 copies of C++ of various types on my computer some of them with completely random names like esugbwudb98wafbv9wehfwqb0fwqfnuebm.
I would not use online services to store my games over a USB. If I lose discs or something then I have burnt copies and if I can't make copies I have a digital version from GoG or something. But I'm happy with discs and not comfortable with relying on Steam, GG or GoG.
It happens the crap Steam put on my computer messed up a lot of data, that's the main reason I'm enraged.
No, copy protection and DRM don't even remotely do the same thing. Copy protection prevents you from making unauthorized copies. DRM keeps you from installing or launching a game without begging the company for permission first (permission which may be denied for any number of reasons - and will permanently be denied if / when the company goes out of business or decides that they want you to buy the next game in the series and turn off the activation servers for older games).
You cannot "steal" something digital. I've already said that, due to DRM, I will no longer buy BG:EE - that means Overhaul makes $0 from me. If it became available on TPB and I torrented it, their total profit from me would remain $0. You cannot steal something if there is no loss. Stealing a physical copy of a game results in a financial loss because it cost money to manufacture the disc, burn the game to the disc, make the manual, make the box, ship it to the store, and pay someone to put the boxes on the shelves. These costs are non-existent with digital copies of a game.
The rampant Stockholm Syndrome is quite saddening....
Except you're ignoring that the primary purpose of DRM isn't to prevent copying, but to incorporate a form of planned obsolescence in a product and ensure that the game is only playable as long as the company wants it to be. Instead of trying to come up with a reason why customers should put up with such an absurd addition to a product, you keep trying to claim that it's no different from a disc check.