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Dragonborn and Tiefling: Why all the hate?

ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
in Off-Topic
I see quite a few negative comments around the web about Dragonborns and Tieflings. And i wonder why.

Its because Dragonborn's beath weapon isn't up the scale?

Its because of the 4th edition retcon of Tieflings where they turned into the descendants of cursed humans with a dranei-like look?

Its because of the hole ''special snowflake'' and ''powergaming'' thing?

Its a grognard thing?

Or its just some left over hate from 4th edition?

Comments

  • KamigoroshiKamigoroshi Member Posts: 5,870
    People don't like change for the mere sake of "Change". Never did, and probably never will.

    There was no reasoning whatsoever behind the thematically change of the Tiefling plane-touched. Or the Genasi's, for that matter. In my case it's not their new looks that make my skin crawl, it's the utter disregard of already established lore from the Planescape campaign setting. At least the 5th edition tried to fix the 4th edition's mess with returning the Planes like they were before. Which is something, I guess.

    Dragonborn were another "shiningly kewl" factor WotC thoughtlessly threw at Forgotten Realms. I imagine most players didn't welcomed them with open arms due to them replacing the whole of Unther: a history rich and rather popular Old Empire and the showplace of heroic battles.

    Not to mention that Forgotten Realms already had a rather similar race ever since AD&D to begin with: the Saurials of the Dalelands. Not to mention the Draconians from the Dragonlance campaign setting. Appearance-wise the Dragonborn are less appealing to me than the aforementioned scalykinds. Mainly because of their lack of tails. Really... reptiloids without tails just look silly. Even if we consider the fact that Dragonborn were originally not a "race", but a "template" from 3.5th edition's Races of the Dragon.
  • scriverscriver Member Posts: 2,072
    I enjoy change for the sake of change when the end results aren't inferior to what we previously had.

    (New-)Tieflings and Dragonborn are trite and boring. Part of the why of that is that they're so in-your-face and unsubtle that they feel cartoonish and melodramatic. If it was still the 90's I would've expected them to skateboard and shout "radical!".

    In the case of Tieflings this problem is then amplified because of how they replaced something actually interesting.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    It's interesting how much people read into the new tieflings, for example, and criticize that.
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    It has a lot to do with how 4th edition was written. It has the patronising tone of adults trying to write for small children.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    IDK I didn't get that impression at all.
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    Personally i think any race can be a good option if written and introduced into the setting properly. There are no good races or bad races, but good writers and bad writers.
  • ButtercheeseButtercheese Member Posts: 3,766
    ShapiroKeatsDarkMage said:

    Its because Dragonborn's beath weapon isn't up the scale?

    I see what you did there.

    In all seriousness though:

    I haven't played 4th edition, I don't have an opinion about it.
    I dislike the Tiefling redesign and the Dragoneborn because of their visuals.
    When I look at Tieflings, I first think of WoW because of their uncanny resemblance to the Dreanei. I don't like WoW a whole lot. That, and I love the concept of original Tieflings, that you can make them look super diverse. You could get really creative with them (I once played a tiefling who had raptor legs for example).
    Dragonborn are too yiffy for my tastes. (If you don't know what "yiffy" means, good for you. Don't google it.) I have spend too much time on the internet for being able to disassociate them with that.

    Well, that and I prefer my D&D less cartoony ... which is pretty damn ironic, given that I am a cartoonist.
    But yeah, these designs are more cartoony than most of the stuff I am used to from D&D. (I know there is more cartoony stuff in it. I don't care.)
  • PeccaPecca Member Posts: 2,215
    Buttercheese said:

    If you don't know what "yiffy" means, good for you. Don't google it.

    Daaamn youuuuu!!!!
  • ButtercheeseButtercheese Member Posts: 3,766
    edited May 2016
    I actually meant it when I said that you shouldn't google it.
    My inner troll is still pleased though :smirk:
  • SkatanSkatan Member, Moderator Posts: 5,352
    Pecca said:

    Well the thing is, it's actually impossible not to google something someone says you shouldn't google.

    ^- QFT. Nothing that affected me though. 20 years of internet (almost) has made me comfortably jaded. After you have seen 2G1C and similar, you're immune.
  • PeccaPecca Member Posts: 2,215
    Skatan said:

    Pecca said:

    Well the thing is, it's actually impossible not to google something someone says you shouldn't google.

    ^- QFT. Nothing that affected me though. 20 years of internet (almost) has made me comfortably jaded. After you have seen 2G1C and similar, you're immune.
    I have no idea what any of that means. :)
  • ButtercheeseButtercheese Member Posts: 3,766
    Well, don't google it :smirk:
  • PeccaPecca Member Posts: 2,215
    oh well...
  • ChnapyChnapy Member Posts: 360
    edited May 2016
    I can never hate the tieflings, even in full eredar mode (draeneis aren't red!), although yeah, rolling for your draenei's edit : haha nope and getting a frog-legged, metal-horned, fungus-covered character can be pretty cool. Shows how much of a mess they actually are.
    The dragonborns, on the other hand, are making Kobolds look bad and stealing their thunder, which cannot be forgiven. Also, there can only be so many mutating-dragon-worshipers before the concept gets old.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    Just how many mutating dragon worshipers are there, then?
  • ButtercheeseButtercheese Member Posts: 3,766
    edited May 2016
    Go to the Firewine Ruins and find out for yourself.
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    Still, i'll be pretty dissapointed if the next D&D game by Beamdog doesn't have Dragonborns as a playable option. I don't want to be forced to play Wizardry 8 in order to play with a humanoid dragon.
  • ButtercheeseButtercheese Member Posts: 3,766
    You could play Neverwinter Nights instead and hang out with Deekin:

  • deltagodeltago Member Posts: 7,811
    Pecca said:

    Well the thing is, it's actually impossible not to google something someone says you shouldn't google.

    *Google's it*
    And I have to ask:
    What does the Young Freight Forwarder of the Year award have to do with Dragonborn?
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    Buttercheese said:

    You could play Neverwinter Nights instead and hang out with Deekin:

    I mean as a created PC. But Deekin is cool.

  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    Buttercheese said:

    Go to the Firewine Ruins and find out for yourself.

    Been there, doesn't answer my question.
  • ButtercheeseButtercheese Member Posts: 3,766
    That might be because of the endless respawn rate.
  • BelleSorciereBelleSorciere Member Posts: 2,108
    Ask a serious question...
  • FardragonFardragon Member Posts: 4,511
    ShapiroKeatsDarkMage said:

    Still, i'll be pretty dissapointed if the next D&D game by Beamdog doesn't have Dragonborns as a playable option. I don't want to be forced to play Wizardry 8 in order to play with a humanoid dragon.

    Would rather have saurials, lizardmen, or kobolds.
  • ShapiroKeatsDarkMageShapiroKeatsDarkMage Member Posts: 2,428
    Yeah, Saurials are pretty cool, and i like dinosaurs.
  • FoggyFoggy Member Posts: 297
    edited May 2016
    Dragonborn and tieflings are so "trendy" and picked by so many bad players, either those who want to be badass rebels playing draconic and demonic creatures with no regard for the setting, or the worst kind of min-maxing munchkin powergamers.

    Couple that with my grognard hate for 4th edition and I find dragonborn and tiefling terribly boring. They are equally dull, a bit like the Kristen Stewart and Shia LaBeouf of d&d, while also the standard of the bad guys in a setting where it's entirely appropriate to judge a book by its cover.

    Haer' Dalis is pretty cool though as far as tieflings go, but I'll bash the dragonborn some more and say that I hate the term "dragonborn " because Skyrim :confounded:

    I laughed at the yiffy thing.


    Reminded me of the joke in Mass effect 2 where Mordin was treating a scale-itch of varren origin rampant on the Normandy and the implication of Kelly Chambers or was it Grunt? :D
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