@Troodon80 i don't know if that was what you meant with your post but THAT would be a nice thing to do with pre-order.
Trend already stated that he doesn't care about the person that buy the game and install it on a friend's house, they're not forcing the copyrights protection and are aiming to improve the game instead. Since it's natural that some people will spread the game by presenting it to friends, sometimes not even with a bad intent, but in the hope for this friend to join BG community, an simple but VERY EFFECTIVE pre-order bonus would be:
Pre-order BG and gain +2 CD Keys for the plataform that you brought the game in the form of a bonus (only windows atm) to present any friend that you want. Just make the extra 2 game access bonus wait 1 or 2 week (or a month if you prefer), so the extra games do not become an obstacle for the sales.
This way we that pre-ordered will feel a true difference in pre-order rather than just brought the game after the release, and the company will profit, cos this would be an excelent advertsiment pratice to reach potential customers that in normal conditions would never notice or bother themself with Baldur's Gate, creating a chance to improve (and probally double or triple) the BG community size (along with future profits from future games in the style).
@kamuizin, RE: Pre-order BG and gain +2 CD Keys. You mean like a 3-for-1 deal? I would love for that to happen, since I would have about another 50 copies to give away. Imagine the dA competitions I could do with that...
I can't see that happening, though. @Nathan wouldn't even give me another couple pre-order badges... Sad panda.
(I'm joking, by the way.)
On a serious note, I can't imagine something like that happening. I wouldn't demand it, either, even though a bonus would be nice (like in Kickstarter projects). The game is half the price of the average new release, so it's pretty inexpensive. I do wish the pre-order bonus price had gone on until November, however. There's another couple friends that I'd like to give the game to, so I guess I'll just need to buy a couple more.
Bought it mainly because - bug fixes without having to go to the trouble of installing a bunch of fan mods and in the right order (some of which don't work well together or include odd game changes or introduce their own bugs)
And for some reason, neither the widescreen nor the BGT mods would work for me (I'm most likely doing something wrong, but eh, few more weeks, right?), so even more reason for me to get it.
Just preordered, mainly to support the project and raise the chances of other infinity engine game overhauls being green-lit (I'd gladly pay 5x the price for BG2 and Planescape: Torment - actually, maybe I should just place more orders :-) ). I'm not actually sure if I'll ever have the time to play the PC version, due to work etc, but am really looking forward to the android version - I am greatly looking forward to lacking myself on my office and wasting my lunch-breaks, and generally ruining my social life:-) Been making due with GemRB thus far, but can't wait for a fully tablet-optimized version (Just to note - I own multiple copies of the games I play on that - no piracy etc) But back on topic (and I admit I only read first page of this thread, so apologies if I'm just rehashing what's already been said) - I think that those complaining about the high price-to-new-content ratio either don't really get the amount of work it takes to update an older game like this, or are simply outside of the target audience; if you're still happy playing the original release, you probably are right in thinking that you won't get your $20 worth of satisfaction out of this release - it isn't meant to be an expansion of the original game, nor a reboot, but rather a technological update that allows you to play a timeless classic again without having to cringe at the fact that some aspects of the infinity engine really did not age all that well - the additional content is just a bonus. The amount of work involved in doing that is still quite significant (If you remember the amount of work that went into the BG Tutu and BG trilogy mods ( which put the entire trilogy together by putting BG1 Content into the updated BG2 engine, along with a host of other fixes), you should realize this whole undertaking was no small task - and if it manages to be financially successful, it will help set a precedent that will make it that much easier for devs to do the same for other classic PC games, which, in my humble opinion, would just be awesome beyond belief - I've waited and waited, time and again, as ambitious modders tried to do the same thing, by porting BG into the NWN2 engine, the DA:O engine, etc, only to have my hopes crushed as the projects faltered under the massive scope of the undertaking. Having a professional Dev team successfully do this and have it be a financial success could have a serious impact on the PC gaming scene, and preorder numbers are a crucial statistic for publishers gauging whether to support similar projects, so if you are planning on buying the game post-release, skip ordering out tonight and preorder now, if only to help make possible similar projects in the future (I for one am skipping my Saturday sushi:-) ) Anyway, sorry for the wall of text, tl;dr - preorder now to help ensure future projects of a similar nature get green-lit; every little bit helps. Oh, and my personal apologies for not having preordered earlier - I've been out of the country on work and internet access was sparse at best.
@Troodon80, as i said, they could wait for a time, wait the sales drop (after the original game fans finish of buying the game) and them release that bonos to whom pre-order, support the company is cool and nice, but to get money in advance need some incentive.
Besides, there are people out there, friends of mine for example, your friends also, that never heard about Baldur's Gate, they're not inclined to play the game as they only see a game from 12 years ago remade still in 2D (with some 3D factors), those persons would never brought the game, they don't have a nostalgia to move them for it, but they would surelly play it for free, and with some luck BG II EE could finish the pre-order with 5.000 sales instead of 2.300. It's an advertsiment suggestion anyway, do or not will not change in my personal playgame.
I haven't preordered cause I believe that I will help them more if I simply buy it and give them 2 bucks more. I have no problem with that and my friends and me see no real thing that we would get for preorder. We'll wait and buy it, and I can already vouch for 6 of us like that.
I haven´t pre-ordered, because I was waiting for news about retail copy. Also I don´t use to pre-order games, I´m a bit old-schooler with purchasing, nicely walk into the shop and take the box with me and have a never-ending trip back home. Also I had a plan to wait for post-release features and then play the game, but now with the game being delayed, I´m expecting some info. If the game already contains all the features, I will most likely pre-order it sometimes next month.
I mean, I´m going to buy it, just don´t know if I´m going to play it right after the release or later and don´t want to purchase it earlier, because I wouln´t resist.
From what I understand, those who haven't preordered seem to prefer their good ol' mods doing the enhancing.
Thing is, imagine the day when we're starting to get some really awesome mods made exclusively for the BGEE-series. We already know it will be very mod-friendly. I don't think there'll be many modders still working with the original games at that point.
That and the fact that we're going to get even more stuff post-ship. Why would you, as a BG-fan, NOT want any of that? Not to mention the massive potential of BG2EE, which Beamdog will develop using their experience from having enhanced one IE-game already.
So try not to flame the ones skeptical about BGEE too much, as I already pity them for not realizing how good it will feel to own this game by November 30.
From what I understand, those who haven't preordered seem to prefer their good ol' mods doing the enhancing.
Thing is, imagine the day when we're starting to get some really awesome mods made exclusively for the BGEE-series. We already know it will be very mod-friendly. I don't think there'll be many modders still working with the original games at that point.
That and the fact that we're going to get even more stuff post-ship. Why would you, as a BG-fan, NOT want any of that? Not to mention the massive potential of BG2EE, which Beamdog will develop using their experience from having enhanced one IE-game already.
So try not to flame the ones skeptical about BGEE too much, as I already pity them for not realizing how good it will feel to own this game by November 30.
Because all of the stuff you mentioned is going to come after Nov 30th. Not pre-ordering =/= not buying.
@shawne, that's generally what I do, too. Only game I've pre-ordered before this was Mass Effect 3 (almost wish I hadn't bothered, to be quite honest). Not sure you could call Project Eternity a pre-order, but I guess you could.
I just couldn't resist putting the money down for this, though. I'll be doing the same for BG2:EE.
Doubt I'll be pre-ordering much more after that. But we'll see, I suppose.
I love the premise: if you didn't pre-order there's something wrong or whatnot. It's a product that doesn't interest all consumers. Just like every other product...
@Troodon80: I just prefer to deal in tangibles - not sure why people are equating that with refusing to support the project. Is my money somehow devalued if I buy the game when it can actually be played?
I pre-ordered it already and just pre-ordered again (Hopefully both badges are proof to my commitment to BG:EE!)
Hell, this version is going to save me time and effort every time I try to add mods. Bug fixes, Tobex, 1PP, BG Tutu and making it even more moddable all in one as a vanilla game and implemented by professionals who do this for a living than a fan who made them during his spare time.
As for the complainers, just redirect them to the features list thread and let them see for themselves.
@shawne, like I said, I usually do, too. I was debating whether or not to hold off getting it entirely to see it there might be a boxed version later down the line. Since that hasn't happened (and more importantly, is not likely to happen), I have nothing to lose by pre-ordering in this case; and purchasing in bulk as I normally do, that $2 off would have been nice if I could have gotten them all on that deal.
As to your question: not at all. I don't think anyone actually said it did devalue you purchase if you leave it until it is actually released. I would put the OP's question down to simply being curious about the people who haven't pre-ordered, and their reason for not doing so.
I must admit to a similar curiosity when it came to ghostowl, back on the first page, who said they weren't going to buy it at all. Normally, I wouldn't bother asking, since it makes no difference to me and doesn't affect me in the slightest. In my mind, however, I ask myself: what are such people doing here if they have no plans to buy?
The likely reason would be because the old community (so much as it is/was) will dwindle now that almost everyone is here. The modding community may or may not, they might just change their focus to providing mods for BG:EE instead of the original. But anyone who wants to talk about Baldur's Gate in general, new or old, will have to come here to get any meaningful discussion. That's not to say that they played, or will play, anything other than Baldur's Gate, or possibly Baldur's Gate 2 (missing the first game). They will still have to come here to get that discussion.
However, not everyone will have the same answer to either question, so I can understand why the OP asked. It's just that I, personally, would normally keep questions like that to myself.
@Troodon80: I wouldn't be so quick to discount the old communities - they've lasted for fifteen years, I doubt they'll evaporate quite that easily.
Take into account that the process of adapting BG's substantial mod library to BG:EE will take months, if not years, and some modders may choose not to do so at all - in which case the original BG will always have something to offer that the BG:EE can't match.
For people claiming "there's almost nothing new, only a compilation of bugfixes" etc:
How about actual working cross-platform multiplayer? That alone would be worth twice the price for me, I can't wait to get some multiplayer action with a lot less pain than before.
I'd like to challenge those Windows users who have not-preordered, to pre-order.
Pre-ordering shows your interest in this type of game play and promises to Beamdog and Overhaul that you want to do the right thing and buy the game, because without people buying it, more games like this are not going to happen.
What ? How dare you telling us to do something ? (Yes I am Chaotic Good, I don't like people telling what others shall do).
I'm very excited about playing this game. I do support this game, and I'll buy it for sure when it's out. But as other people mentioned before, I don't see what's the point of preordeing something that can't be on shortage.
Also, since the game it not out yet, if something goes wrong, I would not have payed 20$ for nothing.
So please, keep your threat (see your first post) and your so-called "challenge" (this above reply) for you.
We do support the game, but we don't want someone to tell us what to do.
I'd like to challenge those Windows users who have not-preordered, to pre-order.
Pre-ordering shows your interest in this type of game play and promises to Beamdog and Overhaul that you want to do the right thing and buy the game, because without people buying it, more games like this are not going to happen.
What ? How dare you telling us to do something ? (Yes I am Chaotic Good, I don't like people telling what others shall do).
I'm very excited about playing this game. I do support this game, and I'll buy it for sure when it's out. But as other people mentioned before, I don't see what's the point of preordeing something that can't be on shortage.
Also, since the game it not out yet, if something goes wrong, I would not have payed 20$ for nothing.
So please, keep your threat (see your first post) and your so-called "challenge" (this above reply) for you.
We do support the game, but we don't want someone to tell us what to do.
I thought there was a pre-order discount, for me that would make it a no-brainer.
@Moomintroll, there was a $2 discount on the price, but the offer has ended already, which makes it slightly less of an incentive to pre-order if the price is the same as it would be when the game comes out, especially if you're not getting any of the frills that come with pre-ordering other types of game.
I'm surprised $18 means so much to people in 2012. It seems very little to spend so little on a great game with bugs that are fixed and works on new computers and monitors.
It wouldn't surprise me if these people who don't spend $18 on BGEE will go out and waste a lot more money on something of less value.
Okay, despite the fact that I will be buying it on iPad, and then likely on Mac once I get my Mac around X-mas time, I pre-ordered it on PC anyway. Dedication. Also, I am unsure how modable the iPad will end up being, so I'd like to have a more open platform while these things are identified.
Still, this means I'm likely to get it 3 times... =/
I'd like to challenge those Windows users who have not-preordered, to pre-order.
Pre-ordering shows your interest in this type of game play and promises to Beamdog and Overhaul that you want to do the right thing and buy the game, because without people buying it, more games like this are not going to happen.
What ? How dare you telling us to do something ? (Yes I am Chaotic Good, I don't like people telling what others shall do).
I'm very excited about playing this game. I do support this game, and I'll buy it for sure when it's out. But as other people mentioned before, I don't see what's the point of preordeing something that can't be on shortage.
Also, since the game it not out yet, if something goes wrong, I would not have payed 20$ for nothing.
So please, keep your threat (see your first post) and your so-called "challenge" (this above reply) for you.
We do support the game, but we don't want someone to tell us what to do.
BG:EE is the first game I've pre-ordered since Grimrock (received a price break), and before that, the collectors edition of IDW2, so I typically agree with you on not pre-ordering.
The point of pre-ordering BG:EE has nothing to do with shortages, it's to show support. When Beamdog goes back to license holders in the future and say "We want to make another game", they can show pre-orders as proof in the pudding. License holders love big pre-order numbers.
And just to clear up any misconceptions on my reputation, I re-read my first post and see no threat of any kind, and challenging someone is not telling them what to do.
I've seen many users in this forum, as well as BG:EE beta testers, who don't have the pre-order badge.
My question is for those of you who have not pre-ordered is simply, why have you not pre-ordered, and what would have to chance to get you to pre-order?
Why are people who have no intention on buying it, "because you get it for free with mods", even here? If everything has already been done before, there's nothing new to learn in this forum.
I hope you don't mind the sarcasm, I'm trying to prove a point.
I didn't realize that people paid so much attention to 'badges'; they're just tiny icons symbolizing a false sense of accomplishment anyway. At least we won't have to worry about such silly marketing concepts encouraging in-game-purchases making way into BGEE.
This forum is the hottest place on the net to discuss BG, any and all fans should be welcome, whether or not they plan to purchase the game.
If pre-order is for future licenses, they don't need the pre-order repercussion, they can just show the total amount of sales of the game.
BG EE already get an astounting number of pre-orders, even without giving back to the customer a reason to pre-order. Only 150 persons more or less, that have a first comment badge didn't pre-ordered the game yet, and we should remember that not everyone will play windows version. Some people paid twice or more for multiple CD Keys, as many are saying.
So my question, yet relevant to this thread, follow exactly the contrary sense:
What will the devs give in bonus to people that pre-ordered? You know, trust, respect and support is a 2 ways road. We supported the company, in return...? An compliment only? An virtual Badge? They could even use this issue and take advantage of it, as i suggested in early posts with additional CD keys to present friend, what they can't do is ignore whom supported them.
@Metal_Hurlant, about your question, that will be based in where you live. $18 dollars can appear a small amount of money to you if you're from United States, a place where the Federal Minimum Income is something about $1.800. but for me in example, is R$ 38.00 (Reais - Brazil)+international transaction taxes of 16% more or less in a place where the Federal Minimum Income is R$622,00, a huge difference, no? Other people from other places probally pay even more.
Comments
Trend already stated that he doesn't care about the person that buy the game and install it on a friend's house, they're not forcing the copyrights protection and are aiming to improve the game instead. Since it's natural that some people will spread the game by presenting it to friends, sometimes not even with a bad intent, but in the hope for this friend to join BG community, an simple but VERY EFFECTIVE pre-order bonus would be:
Pre-order BG and gain +2 CD Keys for the plataform that you brought the game in the form of a bonus (only windows atm) to present any friend that you want. Just make the extra 2 game access bonus wait 1 or 2 week (or a month if you prefer), so the extra games do not become an obstacle for the sales.
This way we that pre-ordered will feel a true difference in pre-order rather than just brought the game after the release, and the company will profit, cos this would be an excelent advertsiment pratice to reach potential customers that in normal conditions would never notice or bother themself with Baldur's Gate, creating a chance to improve (and probally double or triple) the BG community size (along with future profits from future games in the style).
I can't see that happening, though. @Nathan wouldn't even give me another couple pre-order badges... Sad panda.
(I'm joking, by the way.)
On a serious note, I can't imagine something like that happening. I wouldn't demand it, either, even though a bonus would be nice (like in Kickstarter projects). The game is half the price of the average new release, so it's pretty inexpensive. I do wish the pre-order bonus price had gone on until November, however. There's another couple friends that I'd like to give the game to, so I guess I'll just need to buy a couple more.
I'm not actually sure if I'll ever have the time to play the PC version, due to work etc, but am really looking forward to the android version - I am greatly looking forward to lacking myself on my office and wasting my lunch-breaks, and generally ruining my social life:-) Been making due with GemRB thus far, but can't wait for a fully tablet-optimized version (Just to note - I own multiple copies of the games I play on that - no piracy etc)
But back on topic (and I admit I only read first page of this thread, so apologies if I'm just rehashing what's already been said) - I think that those complaining about the high price-to-new-content ratio either don't really get the amount of work it takes to update an older game like this, or are simply outside of the target audience; if you're still happy playing the original release, you probably are right in thinking that you won't get your $20 worth of satisfaction out of this release - it isn't meant to be an expansion of the original game, nor a reboot, but rather a technological update that allows you to play a timeless classic again without having to cringe at the fact that some aspects of the infinity engine really did not age all that well - the additional content is just a bonus. The amount of work involved in doing that is still quite significant (If you remember the amount of work that went into the BG Tutu and BG trilogy mods ( which put the entire trilogy together by putting BG1 Content into the updated BG2 engine, along with a host of other fixes), you should realize this whole undertaking was no small task - and if it manages to be financially successful, it will help set a precedent that will make it that much easier for devs to do the same for other classic PC games, which, in my humble opinion, would just be awesome beyond belief - I've waited and waited, time and again, as ambitious modders tried to do the same thing, by porting BG into the NWN2 engine, the DA:O engine, etc, only to have my hopes crushed as the projects faltered under the massive scope of the undertaking. Having a professional Dev team successfully do this and have it be a financial success could have a serious impact on the PC gaming scene, and preorder numbers are a crucial statistic for publishers gauging whether to support similar projects, so if you are planning on buying the game post-release, skip ordering out tonight and preorder now, if only to help make possible similar projects in the future (I for one am skipping my Saturday sushi:-) )
Anyway, sorry for the wall of text, tl;dr - preorder now to help ensure future projects of a similar nature get green-lit; every little bit helps. Oh, and my personal apologies for not having preordered earlier - I've been out of the country on work and internet access was sparse at best.
...and now I'm shutting up, I promise.
Besides, there are people out there, friends of mine for example, your friends also, that never heard about Baldur's Gate, they're not inclined to play the game as they only see a game from 12 years ago remade still in 2D (with some 3D factors), those persons would never brought the game, they don't have a nostalgia to move them for it, but they would surelly play it for free, and with some luck BG II EE could finish the pre-order with 5.000 sales instead of 2.300. It's an advertsiment suggestion anyway, do or not will not change in my personal playgame.
I mean, I´m going to buy it, just don´t know if I´m going to play it right after the release or later and don´t want to purchase it earlier, because I wouln´t resist.
Thing is, imagine the day when we're starting to get some really awesome mods made exclusively for the BGEE-series. We already know it will be very mod-friendly. I don't think there'll be many modders still working with the original games at that point.
That and the fact that we're going to get even more stuff post-ship. Why would you, as a BG-fan, NOT want any of that? Not to mention the massive potential of BG2EE, which Beamdog will develop using their experience from having enhanced one IE-game already.
So try not to flame the ones skeptical about BGEE too much, as I already pity them for not realizing how good it will feel to own this game by November 30.
I just couldn't resist putting the money down for this, though. I'll be doing the same for BG2:EE.
Doubt I'll be pre-ordering much more after that. But we'll see, I suppose.
Hell, this version is going to save me time and effort every time I try to add mods. Bug fixes, Tobex, 1PP, BG Tutu and making it even more moddable all in one as a vanilla game and implemented by professionals who do this for a living than a fan who made them during his spare time.
As for the complainers, just redirect them to the features list thread and let them see for themselves.
As to your question: not at all. I don't think anyone actually said it did devalue you purchase if you leave it until it is actually released. I would put the OP's question down to simply being curious about the people who haven't pre-ordered, and their reason for not doing so.
I must admit to a similar curiosity when it came to ghostowl, back on the first page, who said they weren't going to buy it at all. Normally, I wouldn't bother asking, since it makes no difference to me and doesn't affect me in the slightest. In my mind, however, I ask myself: what are such people doing here if they have no plans to buy?
The likely reason would be because the old community (so much as it is/was) will dwindle now that almost everyone is here. The modding community may or may not, they might just change their focus to providing mods for BG:EE instead of the original. But anyone who wants to talk about Baldur's Gate in general, new or old, will have to come here to get any meaningful discussion. That's not to say that they played, or will play, anything other than Baldur's Gate, or possibly Baldur's Gate 2 (missing the first game). They will still have to come here to get that discussion.
However, not everyone will have the same answer to either question, so I can understand why the OP asked. It's just that I, personally, would normally keep questions like that to myself.
Take into account that the process of adapting BG's substantial mod library to BG:EE will take months, if not years, and some modders may choose not to do so at all - in which case the original BG will always have something to offer that the BG:EE can't match.
How about actual working cross-platform multiplayer? That alone would be worth twice the price for me, I can't wait to get some multiplayer action with a lot less pain than before.
What ? How dare you telling us to do something ?
(Yes I am Chaotic Good, I don't like people telling what others shall do).
I'm very excited about playing this game.
I do support this game, and I'll buy it for sure when it's out.
But as other people mentioned before, I don't see what's the point of preordeing something that can't be on shortage.
Also, since the game it not out yet, if something goes wrong, I would not have payed 20$ for nothing.
So please, keep your threat (see your first post) and your so-called "challenge" (this above reply) for you.
We do support the game, but we don't want someone to tell us what to do.
Every penny makes a pound!
It wouldn't surprise me if these people who don't spend $18 on BGEE will go out and waste a lot more money on something of less value.
Still, this means I'm likely to get it 3 times... =/
The point of pre-ordering BG:EE has nothing to do with shortages, it's to show support. When Beamdog goes back to license holders in the future and say "We want to make another game", they can show pre-orders as proof in the pudding. License holders love big pre-order numbers.
And just to clear up any misconceptions on my reputation, I re-read my first post and see no threat of any kind, and challenging someone is not telling them what to do.
I didn't realize that people paid so much attention to 'badges'; they're just tiny icons symbolizing a false sense of accomplishment anyway. At least we won't have to worry about such silly marketing concepts encouraging in-game-purchases making way into BGEE.
This forum is the hottest place on the net to discuss BG, any and all fans should be welcome, whether or not they plan to purchase the game.
BG EE already get an astounting number of pre-orders, even without giving back to the customer a reason to pre-order. Only 150 persons more or less, that have a first comment badge didn't pre-ordered the game yet, and we should remember that not everyone will play windows version. Some people paid twice or more for multiple CD Keys, as many are saying.
So my question, yet relevant to this thread, follow exactly the contrary sense:
What will the devs give in bonus to people that pre-ordered? You know, trust, respect and support is a 2 ways road. We supported the company, in return...? An compliment only? An virtual Badge? They could even use this issue and take advantage of it, as i suggested in early posts with additional CD keys to present friend, what they can't do is ignore whom supported them.
@Metal_Hurlant, about your question, that will be based in where you live. $18 dollars can appear a small amount of money to you if you're from United States, a place where the Federal Minimum Income is something about $1.800. but for me in example, is R$ 38.00 (Reais - Brazil)+international transaction taxes of 16% more or less in a place where the Federal Minimum Income is R$622,00, a huge difference, no? Other people from other places probally pay even more.