Fighter/Mage vs Fighter/Cleric vs Fighter/Druid - Who's better at what?
Baldurspawn
Member Posts: 66
This is something that always interested me...
In terms of utility, offense, defense, solo- and party-capability, flavour, etc., who do you think has the edge over the others?
Never played F/D (not even interested in it, as I like Jaheira too much ^^ )
I think F/C is by far the most party-friendly, also slightly better than F/M for offense who in turn is slightly better than F/D.
F/M is best for solo (all these immunities) and of course defense, and I think F/D is against melee far better than F/C due to ironskins.
F/D takes the first place for flavour, as i always think of that multiclass as the "Avenger v2.0", raging in battle, bear to his left, tiger to his right.
F/D just fails for utility, as with F/M or F/C you have so much more spells for all your healing, detecting, opening and/or scouting needs.
All imo of course
What do you guys think?
In terms of utility, offense, defense, solo- and party-capability, flavour, etc., who do you think has the edge over the others?
Never played F/D (not even interested in it, as I like Jaheira too much ^^ )
I think F/C is by far the most party-friendly, also slightly better than F/M for offense who in turn is slightly better than F/D.
F/M is best for solo (all these immunities) and of course defense, and I think F/D is against melee far better than F/C due to ironskins.
F/D takes the first place for flavour, as i always think of that multiclass as the "Avenger v2.0", raging in battle, bear to his left, tiger to his right.
F/D just fails for utility, as with F/M or F/C you have so much more spells for all your healing, detecting, opening and/or scouting needs.
All imo of course
What do you guys think?
2
Comments
Fighter/Cleric benefits GREATLY from Draw Upon Holy Might. It almost strikes me as a spell designed with the Fighter/Cleric in mind. It does share a little bit of cross-over with the Paladin, but unlike the Paladin, you'll get access to all the Cleric spellbook eventually, and you never have to worry about falling. Plus you can be a dwarf. What's not to love?
Fighter/Mage benefits from a Wizard's flexible spellbook. You want to make a character that can blast at a distance then walk into combat? You can do that. Want one that has a lot of powerful group support and fighting on the side? You can do that as well. The Fighter part also fixes a Wizard's AC problem, with the glorious thing that is Elven Chainmail. Also, unlike the other two, the Fighter/Mage isn't limited in their weapon selection, you can use whatever your little heart desires.
I would say the Fighter mixture adds the most to Wizards and Druids, the least to Clerics, but it benefits most from Clerics and Wizards, rather than Druids.
F/C no +1 APR weapon
F/D +1 APR weapon, but can not use the best mlee weapons, unless he use the Staff of Ram, that cost him 2 APR
F/M all the best weapons and his secret OP one, sequencers and contingencies used offensively. he can do things like send to an enemy a sequencer with 3x Lower Resistance and wait that the CC triggers. And you know what the CC contains... Or he can Tank for 16/20 rounds the Ravager or the Demon Prince and their helpers without taking a single damage. He can self buff with IH, and does not matter that your main mage also can buff the fighters, his own ones are extra, there is never enough of them in a party with 2 o 3 fighters that don't abuse rest. With a couple of Spell immunity can protect his buffs or become immune at most of the damaging and disabling spells.
Imo all 3 are interesting to play, but if you look for offensive power go Mage, if you look for a tank and for self protection same.
A fighter mage best portrays a "renaissance man", someone not only good at feats of the flesh, but at feats of the mind as well.
A fighter cleric best portrays a religious zealot, fanatic with berserker, inquisitor with wizard slayer. Someone on the violent side of the religion.
But I agree that the defensive capabilties of a F/M are what really stand out - combat protections such as Mirror Image, Stoneskin, PfMW etc and spell protections such as SI, Spell Shield etc
Fighter/Mages are the best. Stoneskin and mirror image are great for protection. Against real big bads, you can throw in protection from magical weapons. They can buff themself up with fireshield for extra tankiness. And they can buff themselves offensively with spells like improved haste. Throw in a contingency for desperate situations, and few things can touch them.
Fighter/Druid: Good tankiness, and some neat tricks, but lacks
Following them I'd go with Fighter/Druids. They get to wear metal armor, unlike normal druids. They can dual wield pretty darn well with Belm in the offhand. Ironskin gives survivability. If outdoors, call lightning is ridiculous. Inspect plague shuts down spellcasters. And of course, healing.
Fighter/Cleric: For when you just want to smash a skull
Finally there are fighter/clerics. I'm playing one now and it is fun...but they lack the survivability of the other 2. However, making up for that is their offensive cabilities.
- Draw upon holy might = easy 25 strength
- Righteous magic = upgraded DuHM, for max damage each hit. Can you say "ouch"? It even stacks with DuHM, as RM gives strength, max damage and temporary hit points. DuHM still gives dex and con bonuses.
- Physical mirror is hilarious against ranged enemies.
- Protection from evil 10ft radius is a great party buff spell.
- Eventually getting armor of faith with defender of easthaven gives some tankability.
- And of course, healing.
And the RP!
Fighter/Mage just screams "elf" to me.
Fighter/Druid is "half-elf" only. I've personally never been a fan of half-elves...but some interesting RPing opportunity.
Fighter/Cleric just screams "dwarf."
Where the elf is self-absorbed and puts all of his spells into protecting himself and having contingency plans for when things go wrong (see what I did there?) the dwarf buffs and heals his entire team. Where the elf focuses on swinging as fast as possible, moving as a blur, the dwarf lands a few solid hits for maximum effectiveness. Where the elf folds like wet paper when his spells runs out (ie: relies on his contingency and a quick casting of stoneskin for defense) the dwarf relies on damage reduction and self-healing.
Very different mindsets. Very different playstyles. I recommend doing all of the above!
But he can do even more then that like Simulacrum + Planetar + PI that cast IA.
The Planetar restores the level of the clone, the Simulacrum protects himself from DM, TS is not a problem. so is not penalized in thaco and ST, and now watch a F/M equipping BBoD and a Planetar bashing the enemies while an other F/M unleash all the spellbook at the cost of a single lev7 slot.
Best fighter, best summoner and best caster all at the same time.
Topped off with a halfling cleric-thief, dragon desciple and a half-elven bard
There was some EEkeepering involved, but it's a fun party.
*Sees himself out*
You gain 1.5 and 2.5 per attack, 15dmg x round (Hammer) and 25 (Staff and Flail), on average.
The bulk of the damage come from STR, weapon enchantment bonus, specialization bonus and items bonus, 1.5 or 2.5 is not a big difference, useful but not game changing.
If the CM want to be devastating he uses DuHM, the Staff of the Ram and GWW, RM is used only if there is time to buff as DuHM has a short casting time, RM takes time, time that he can not use to bash the foe.
Death Ward, Chaotic Commands, and Free Action are wonderful spells, but a competent mage don't have any problem if he wants to get rid of them. I am talking of the relative power of the classes, those spells are so good in game (vanilla) just because the AI is stupid and the enemy mage try to cast a spell against which the char is protected instead of dispelling the protection.
And the C/M has good ways to survive physically, good AC and damage reduction stacking Armor of Faith, Hardness and equipping DoE.
EDIT: initial quote added.
The Bers/druid hits the hardest.
The dwarf is an obvious tank.
The addition of cleric to the halfling lost the longbow, so a lot of apr at range less, but it is good to have all the options of a cleric taped to a thief.
The bard is obviously good to give bonus, but a nice addition in the ranged attack camp as well
The dragon desciple is a bit lacking, don't know how I'll fix that.
Imo the thing that make the F/C better until 6M xp is FoA that slows the enemies, is not related with the damage output but very strong.
At 6Mxp suddenly the F/D surpasses the F/C as he jumps from 1 to 6 lev 7 slots. Deva, Elemental Prince, Implosion, Nature's Beauty, Fire Storm, Shield of the Archons, Creeping Doom are wonderful spells, having 6 of them x day is really strong.
EDIT: initial quote added.
I tell you what happened, I was answering to with and when my post was almost ready I had a long call at the telephone. Then I posted without noticing that there were new posts.
My point was that RM does not make a F/C with RM much stronger then a F/C with DuHM, not comparing him to a F/M.
Now I have edited my previous post to avoid that other readers get confused.
Edit: I noticed that something similar happened when I was answering to semiticgod, quote added also there.
I am too slow typing...
And the fact that when you post the boards show you your post right under the last post that was there when you had loaded the page, hiding the posts posted while you are reading does not help as you have to reload the page to see what has happened...