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The LoB + SCS Solo Challenge and the Tales of IWDification

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  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    Hit&run from invisibility doesn't work that well with 2.5 LoB added AC vs Belhifet. Maxed Cleric would need more than 150 invisibility potions before regen. Which is very hard to come by, maybe @Harpagornis would know if that's possible?

    Cleric hit&run from invisibility

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power (40 rounds)
    4 Violet Potion 14 dmg (24 hours)
    3 Legacy of Masters 16 dmg
    2 Helm of Balduran
    0 Medal of Valor
    -4 Invisibility
    -4 Two-Handed Weapon Style 17 dmg
    -7 Echo of the Fiend 21-26 dmg
    -8 Ring of Purity 22-26 dmg (chant)
    -9 Cloverleaf 23-26 dmg (luck)

    Belhifet AC -24 (-23 Armor Class but capped to 20, -4 Improved Invisibility)

    Average damage per 20 attacks vs. Belhifet (24.5+24.5+24.5+24.5+49+49) * (1 - 25dr/100) = 147 dmg
    Average attacks to kill Belhifet 1130hp / 147dmg * 20 = 154 (46 hits) not counting regen

    However if you first used six scrolls of Champion's Strength, then drank Violet Potion and tanked Belhifet the duration of the scrolls, you would get him to 398hp on average, maybe even kill him if you're lucky.

    Cleric Tanking

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power (40 rounds)
    -7 6x Champion's Strength Scroll (27 rounds)
    -14 Violet Potion 14 dmg (24 hours)
    -15 Legacy of Masters 16 dmg
    -16 Helm of Balduran
    -18 Medal of Valor
    -18 Two-Handed Weapon Style 17 dmg
    -21 Echo of the Fiend 21-26 dmg
    -22 Ring of Purity 22-26 dmg (chant)
    -23 Cloverleaf 23-26 dmg (luck)

    Belhifet AC -24 (-23 Armor Class but capped to 20, -4 Improved Invisibility)

    Average damage per 20 attacks vs. Belhifet (17*24.5 + 2*49) * (1 - 25dr/100) = 386 dmg
    Average damage per 20 rounds 386*2 - 20*2hppr = 732

    After that the hit&run tactic would be much faster, about 50 potions of invisibility, or you could use the other six Champion's Strength scrolls in invisibility, and tank Bel the second time.

    StummvonBordwehrMr_SaltyHarpagornis
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    semiticgod wrote: »
    @Mr_Salty: Sorry; I shouldn't have brought up Spell Immunity when you're playing a single-classed cleric. A Protection from Magic scroll will not protect you from Remove Magic (though you can use potion buffs after using that scroll, which means there are other fights where you could combine the scroll with other defenses).

    Historically, we've allowed Caelar to join the party on the grounds that, if you don't give her direct orders and let her act just on her own AI, it replicates the effect of her fighting alongside you as a non-party member, which is how she normally operates if you ask her to join you when you already have a full party. So, she's in your party, but in terms of the difficulty of the challenge, it's the same as if she was an uncontrolled ally, like Drizzt can be in BG2. I've toyed with the idea of creating a small mod that would let her fight alongside you as a non-party member even if you didn't have a full party, but that currently does not exist.

    If you can summon an ally before Belhifet casts Remove Magic (possibly through an item), and hopefully cause him to cast Remove Magic on your summoned critters instead of you, then you might be able to avoid it. But I kinda doubt that's possible. Otherwise, your only method of dodging that Remove Magic is to have Caelar join the team, so the Remove Magic spell hits her instead.

    The Hammer of Darkness is the only other available +3 weapon for a solo cleric (not counting the Martial Staff, but that's just another +3 staff like the one you already have), but you get that way, way back in Bridgefort, so going back to get that one item would be a huge setback--and I'm not sure it's worth it, since that hammer won't get STR bonuses, and your staff will. The staff is probably your best bet anyway, since a cleric's inability to force open the chest that contains the other +3 hammer in the game, Sundermaul, means that you can't dual wield two hammers regardless.

    @histamiini has been able to essentially kite Belhifet by constantly drinking Potions of Invisibility after every attack roll. You need a LOT of Potions of Invisibility to do that, but theoretically, a single-classed cleric could take down Belhifet using hit and run tactics while using Potions of Invisibility to avoid getting swarmed by the other demons. But he would be better able to advise you than me.

    @semiticgod
    ok so if i let caelar join me belhifa is not so dangerous anymore and i tried hitting him with the staff with -25 thac0 but after all the scrolls of champ str run out belhifa has still 4 blocks of health left (btw Caelar does not die ? she just tanks everything ....and everyone targets her instead of me after all my buffs and undead protection no one attacks me..

    StummvonBordwehrHarpagornis
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    histamiini wrote: »
    Hit&run from invisibility doesn't work that well with 2.5 LoB added AC vs Belhifet. Maxed Cleric would need more than 150 invisibility potions before regen. Which is very hard to come by, maybe @Harpagornis would know if that's possible?

    Cleric hit&run from invisibility

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power (40 rounds)
    4 Violet Potion 14 dmg (24 hours)
    3 Legacy of Masters 16 dmg
    2 Helm of Balduran
    0 Medal of Valor
    -4 Invisibility
    -4 Two-Handed Weapon Style 17 dmg
    -7 Echo of the Fiend 21-26 dmg
    -8 Ring of Purity 22-26 dmg (chant)
    -9 Cloverleaf 23-26 dmg (luck)

    Belhifet AC -24 (-23 Armor Class but capped to 20, -4 Improved Invisibility)

    Average damage per 20 attacks vs. Belhifet (24.5+24.5+24.5+24.5+49+49) * (1 - 25dr/100) = 147 dmg
    Average attacks to kill Belhifet 1130hp / 147dmg * 20 = 154 (46 hits) not counting regen

    However if you first used six scrolls of Champion's Strength, then drank Violet Potion and tanked Belhifet the duration of the scrolls, you would get him to 398hp on average, maybe even kill him if you're lucky.

    Cleric Tanking

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power (40 rounds)
    -7 6x Champion's Strength Scroll (27 rounds)
    -14 Violet Potion 14 dmg (24 hours)
    -15 Legacy of Masters 16 dmg
    -16 Helm of Balduran
    -18 Medal of Valor
    -18 Two-Handed Weapon Style 17 dmg
    -21 Echo of the Fiend 21-26 dmg
    -22 Ring of Purity 22-26 dmg (chant)
    -23 Cloverleaf 23-26 dmg (luck)

    Belhifet AC -24 (-23 Armor Class but capped to 20, -4 Improved Invisibility)

    Average damage per 20 attacks vs. Belhifet (17*24.5 + 2*49) * (1 - 25dr/100) = 386 dmg
    Average damage per 20 rounds 386*2 - 20*2hppr = 732

    After that the hit&run tactic would be much faster, about 50 potions of invisibility, or you could use the other six Champion's Strength scrolls in invisibility, and tank Bel the second time.

    @histamiini
    violet potion is used for the tomes cannot use legacy of masters cause i have 4 str base using Takkok i have no points in 2 Hwep style dont have cloverleaf either

    what are my chances :neutral:

    Harpagornis
  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    edited April 2019
    @Mr_Salty You could try Slay Living. First get -23 Thac0 from the scrolls, then Slay Living should actually give 1/4 chance of killing Bel with 2.5 LoB saving throw bug. Btw did you manage to beat the Crusader Attacks?

    EDIT: forgot that you can't cast priest spells after Champion's Strength

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power
    10 Legacy of Masters
    9 Helm of Balduran
    7 Medal of Valor
    6 Ring of Purity (chant)
    5 Cloverleaf (luck)
    1 Invisibility
    -3 True Sight (Improved Invisibility dispel)
    -6 Slay Living

    15% chance of hitting, 25% chance of passing saves, so about 1/25 chance of slaying.

    Post edited by histamiini on
    StummvonBordwehrMr_SaltyHarpagornis
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    histamiini wrote: »
    @Mr_Salty You could try Slay Living. First get -23 Thac0 from the scrolls, then Slay Living should actually give 1/4 chance of killing Bel with 2.5 LoB saving throw bug. Btw did you manage to beat the Crusader Attacks?

    EDIT: forgot that you can't cast priest spells after Champion's Strength

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power
    10 Legacy of Masters
    9 Helm of Balduran
    7 Medal of Valor
    6 Ring of Purity (chant)
    5 Cloverleaf (luck)
    1 Invisibility
    -3 True Sight (Improved Invisibility dispel)
    -6 Slay Living

    15% chance of hitting, 25% chance of passing saves, so about 1/25 chance of slaying.

    @histamiini
    ill try this out then, and to your question yea i managed to beat the crusader attacks here is the video of it
    the fight starts at 27:00

    histamiiniStummvonBordwehrHarpagornis
  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    edited April 2019
    @Mr_Salty Cool I'll have a look.

    Slay Living lasts 3 rounds, so you can cast Champion's Strength twice after casting Slay Living which gives additional -6 Thac0, which then would give 45% hit chance.

    Mr_SaltyHarpagornis
  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    edited April 2019
    @Mr_Salty Impressive stuff, so the OGL tanking actually worked against troll wave, couple close calls in the first two waves. :) Didn't thought about charming, seems to give nice help in some fights. You could possibly even have charmed more people with the Nymph's cloak, as it has 100 charges full.

    StummvonBordwehrMr_SaltyHarpagornis
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    edited April 2019
    histamiini wrote: »
    @Mr_Salty Cool I'll have a look.

    Slay Living lasts 3 rounds, so you can cast Champion's Strength twice after casting Slay Living which gives additional -6 Thac0, which then would give 45% hit chance.

    @histamiini
    wow i actualy did test it out and managed to do it but now i have to do it while recording lmao but here are the pictures Video will come later haha :hushed:
    42ueh4sgn7ya.jpg
    adtc5mc8jluw.jpg
    xckqf5ef4z7i.jpg
    vdw4ipcrfhu6.jpg

    histamiiniStummvonBordwehrsemiticgodHarpagornis
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    edited April 2019
    histamiini wrote: »
    @Mr_Salty Impressive stuff, so the OGL tanking actually worked against troll wave, couple close calls in the first two waves. :) Didn't thought about charming, seems to give nice help in some fights. You could possibly even have charmed more people with the Nymph's cloak, as it has 100 charges full.

    100 charges ? WHAT lmao hahahaha btw when i use the Champ str the roll on hit stayed 10 so they dont help against rolls against belhifet ? so i did it without champ str video is done! i will upload the video for u guys to see !! i won

    @histamiini
    Edit: video is up!

    histamiiniHarpagornisVictor_Creed_SFV
  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    @Mr_Salty I did thest Champion's Strength scrolls vs. Bel and they do work, you can see the Thac0 reduction in the menu screen. I also tested that Invisibility gives -4 bonus, even though he sees through invisibility.

    HarpagornisStummvonBordwehr
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member Posts: 14,442
    Well done, @Mr_Salty. Best of luck with SoA!

    A Cleric of Lathander might be able to bring down Belhifet without using Slay Living and the save bug, but it looks like you'd either need a truly incredible number of Potions of Invisibility or the Violet Potion. Stacking Champion's Strength scrolls and then using the Violet Potion would let you deal about 600 damage with Boon of Lathander, Aid, and the right set of items, and once Boon of Lathander ran out after 10 rounds, you could get another 600 damage in the 17 rounds afterwards before the Champion's Strength scrolls ran out.

    But those are ideal conditions, and in practice, things would get much uglier. You'd still want to have a bunch of Champion's Strength scrolls as a back up, as well as more Potions of Invisibility.

    Champion's Strength scrolls are a major game-changer for single-classed priests, rangers, and paladins, but the inability to dual-wield +3 weapons is a huge handicap for clerics. Druids are actually better equipped to tank Belhifet because they can use Drizzt's scimitars!

    HarpagornishistamiiniAerakar
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    edited April 2019
    histamiini wrote: »
    @Mr_Salty I did thest Champion's Strength scrolls vs. Bel and they do work, you can see the Thac0 reduction in the menu screen. I also tested that Invisibility gives -4 bonus, even though he sees through invisibility.

    yes the thac0 in invetory goes down that part is true, but the attack roll is still ??/10 <the 10 stayed the same even after 2 champ scrolls so whatever the roll was on the ?? 16+ was a hit anything lower did not hit

    o and edit: @histamiini and @semiticgod what items do i need to put in inventory to bring to SOA ? i know pantaloons work and helm of balduran ? rest i have no clue what to bring i have alot of stuff in my inventory saved up hahaa

    Harpagornis
  • HarpagornisHarpagornis Member Posts: 1,499
    edited April 2019
    150+ Invisbility Potions are easily possible even though i have forgotten a lot of stuff. Biggest numbers you can get from burning Imoen in the SoD starting assault at the palace: Thats 80. You can also wait around half an hour (or more) when sieging Dragonpear Castle: With patience (and a bit of luck) you should get really big numbers here too: 50++. ;)

    Hmmmm... i always thought that we had to kick Caelar out of party immediately when the fight against Big B starts. Anything else just looks not right - at least from my (and maybe @Grond0´s) point of view. But at the end its your personal journey @mr_salty. ;)

    Even though i havent played BG quite some time @Vynn and me had tried our poverty no-reload challenge again and again. We had used some devilish tactics but beating the Throne of Baal was still not possible. Not to mention that Sendai (and Abazigal) are also very painful (and Big B!!!). As i never touched 2.5 so far it would be interesting to hear some opinions if the challenge is now even more difficult. Is it? The saving throw bug really looks nasty - is there any chance that this will get fixed soon? However: When looking @histamiini the "normal" no-reload challenge looks far too easy. No? B)

    histamiiniStummvonBordwehrAerakar
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    edited April 2019
    @Harpagornis yea i agree next time i let caelar die but i still could have beaten belhifat and hephernan i can just run arround go invis shoot run invis shoot i had plenty of invis to do this and he is not so tough in the end

    feels kinda weird that caelar does not die when she joins the party lol

  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    edited April 2019
    @Harpagornis Yeah 2.5 LoB is tougher because of added enemy AC, I believe it's -11 now. This after the saving throws are fixed of course. Currently it's easier I think.

    Looking with NearInfinity found two +3 Morning Stars which Cleric could dual wield.

    Kiel's Morning Star +3 Its found in Durlag's Tower. Description states it makes you go berserk, but I tried it and nothing happens, except it adds the icon to the portrait.

    Blazing Glory +3 Award from Mizhena father guest. I just did the Mizhena Amulet guest the first time ever, but haven't gotten the father guest yet. Anyone know how to get it?

    StummvonBordwehr
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    histamiini wrote: »
    @Harpagornis Yeah 2.5 LoB is tougher because of added enemy AC, I believe it's -11 now. This after the saving throws are fixed of course. Currently it's easier I think.

    Looking with NearInfinity found two +3 Morning Stars which Cleric could dual wield.

    Kiel's Morning Star +3 Its found in Durlag's Tower. Description states it makes you go berserk, but I tried it and nothing happens, except it adds the icon to the portrait.

    Blazing Glory +3 Award from Mizhena father guest. I just did the Mizhena Amulet guest the first time ever, but haven't gotten the father guest yet. Anyone know how to get it?

    try again with kiels with a enemy nearby makes the unit uncontrollable haha atleast happend to me

  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    Mr_Salty wrote: »
    histamiini wrote: »
    @Mr_Salty I did thest Champion's Strength scrolls vs. Bel and they do work, you can see the Thac0 reduction in the menu screen. I also tested that Invisibility gives -4 bonus, even though he sees through invisibility.

    yes the thac0 in invetory goes down that part is true, but the attack roll is still ??/10 <the 10 stayed the same even after 2 champ scrolls so whatever the roll was on the ?? 16+ was a hit anything lower did not hit

    o and edit: @histamiini and @semiticgod what items do i need to put in inventory to bring to SOA ? i know pantaloons work and helm of balduran ? rest i have no clue what to bring i have alot of stuff in my inventory saved up hahaa
    Hmm, don't know why that it. In my test lowest hit was 10, but with two scolls 4.

    Here's list of items you can import: https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Importing#Siege_of_Dragonspear_Items

    Mr_SaltyStummvonBordwehr
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    Wow that blazing glory is pretty amazing wish i knew this from the beginning tho, there is no info on it but i just consoled it in to check it out and its quite nice not sure where the quests start tho ill have to talk to mizhena more often next time ^^ i am soon gonna start SOA but for now im experimenting on builds with prof points etc for my beserk mage (i rolled a 98 on stat screen) as far ive tested i only need 5 points in 1 wep u use as main and anything in off hand is fine with 1 point as they dont add more attacks per round

    StummvonBordwehr
  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    edited April 2019
    I did check the guests and it can indeed be acquired. First you have to do the Mizhena Amulet guest in Coalition Camp, the amulet is in Underground River. Then after the attack on Dragonspear Castle, you can find Mizhena in the courtyard. She will ask you to find her father, which you can find top left of the map. Return back and you get the Blazing Glory +3. It's good weapon, 2d4+3 +1 Fire damage and grants immunity to fatigue.

    StummvonBordwehrsemiticgod
  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    Mr_Salty wrote: »
    try again with kiels with a enemy nearby makes the unit uncontrollable haha atleast happend to me
    Yeah, seems unusable because the Berserk can't be stopped.

  • histamiinihistamiini Member Posts: 1,306
    edited April 2019
    Ok found out another weapon for Cleric to wield, The Root of the Problem +1 +3 vs. unnatural creatures. Tested it against Bel and it works. Does 1d6+1 +2 damage vs Bel, the +2 skips damage resistance.

    So with dual wielding Blazing Glory and The Root of the Problem, Cleric should be able to tank Bel in 21 rounds on average, which is just the time when first from the six Champions Strength scrolls should run out.

    Cleric vs. Bel

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power (40 rounds)
    -7 6x Champion's Strength Scroll (27 rounds)
    -14 Violet Potion 14 dmg (24 hours)
    -15 Legacy of Masters 16 dmg
    -16 Helm of Balduran
    -18 Medal of Valor
    -21 Blazing Glory 21-27 dmg
    -22 Ring of Purity 22-27 dmg (chant)
    -23 Cloverleaf 23-27 dmg (luck)

    Belhifet AC -24 (-23 Armor Class but capped to 20, -4 Improved Invisibility)

    Average damage per 20 attacks vs. Belhifet (18*25 + 50) * (1 - 25dr/100) = 375 dmg
    Average time to kill Belhifet 20*1130hp / (375dmg*3apr - 20*2hppr) = 20.8 rounds

    Post edited by histamiini on
    Mr_SaltyStummvonBordwehrsemiticgodGrond0
  • Mr_SaltyMr_Salty Member Posts: 188
    histamiini wrote: »
    Ok found out another weapon for Cleric to wield, The Root of the Problem +1 +3 vs. unnatural creatures. Tested it against Bel and it works. Does 1d6+1 +2 damage vs Bel, the +2 skips damage resistance.

    So with dual wielding Blazing Glory and The Root of the Problem, Cleric should be able to tank Bel in 21 rounds on average, which is just the time when first from the six Champions Strength scrolls should run out.

    Cleric vs. Bel

    14 Base (Level 10)
    11 Potion of Power (40 rounds)
    -7 6x Champion's Strength Scroll (27 rounds)
    -14 Violet Potion 14 dmg (24 hours)
    -15 Legacy of Masters 16 dmg
    -16 Helm of Balduran
    -18 Medal of Valor
    -21 Blazing Glory 21-27 dmg
    -22 Ring of Purity 22-27 dmg (chant)
    -23 Cloverleaf 23-27 dmg (luck)

    Belhifet AC -24 (-23 Armor Class but capped to 20, -4 Improved Invisibility)

    Average damage per 20 attacks vs. Belhifet (18*25 + 50) * (1 - 25dr/100) = 375 dmg
    Average time to kill Belhifet 20*1130hp / (375dmg*3apr - 20*2hppr) = 20.8 rounds

    oo Nice info on the weapon sweet! will note that down haha i already had that root the whole time in the bag lol

  • StummvonBordwehrStummvonBordwehr Member, Mobile Tester Posts: 892
    edited April 2019
    semiticgod wrote: »
    . Druids are actually better equipped to tank Belhifet because they can use Drizzt's scimitars!
    Druids can only wield 1 of the scimitars due to the alignment restriction (good only vs true neutral). So dual wielding Drizzts gear is not an option.

    But Vidyadhar the Rakhsasa from Zaviaks vision quest has a generic scimitar +3 - you just have to kill him to get it. He can be found in the underground river area.

    @Mr_Salty
    well done on beating SoD with an unkitted An awesome feat

    Post edited by StummvonBordwehr on
    Mr_Saltysemiticgodhistamiini
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member Posts: 14,442
    @Harpagornis: Does Caelar still behave normally if you kick her out of the party? If she still fights, then she'll take normal damage instead of double damage even if you have the bonus damage enabled (I disabled it for my Archer run specifically so it wouldn't affect her).

  • Victor_Creed_SFVVictor_Creed_SFV Member Posts: 588
    Wow nice find with the slay living, never realized it ignores magic resistance.

  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member Posts: 14,442
    @histamiini: I've just gotten through BG1 with my Archer. Do you have any advice for me as I'm heading into SoD?

  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member Posts: 14,442
    Mostly I'm concerned about Ziatar and Akanna, and I'm wondering if surrendering Bridgefort is the better option. Also, I'm worried about making some minor mistake with Belhifet--how do I make sure I get the timing right so I arrive at the final battlefield with those Champion's Strength scrolls at near-max duration?

    I'm hoping I'll be able to just let Caelar do the heavy lifting while supporting her with Greater Restoration scrolls, but even without the double damage, Belhifet could kill her in one round with Hephernaan's assistance, and Hephernaan has 350 HP for us to get through.

    Maybe I should just resign myself to dual-wielding the Short Sword of Backstabbing and that +3 longsword from Thrix. I calculate it'll take 18 rounds to kill Belhifet if I do have all those Champion's Strength scrolls active and also have the Violet Potion on hand (though I do need to spend two rounds afterwards drinking a Potion of Fortitude and Potion of Agility). Without the Violet Potion, it's 25 rounds, or just under 20 if I use a Potion of Storm Giant Strength instead.

    You know, for warriors, the Potion of Storm Giant Strength isn't a bad alternative to the Violet Potion. You don't have to worry about spending two whole rounds countering the DEX and CON penalties, which is pretty relevant for Champion's Strength stacking.

    StummvonBordwehr
  • semiticgodsemiticgod Member Posts: 14,442
    Come to think of it, Called Shot could slightly improve Caelar's chances by penalizing Belhifet's THAC0. But it would take several rounds to have an impact, and you need to spend your aura on those Greater Restoration scrolls to keep her alive. It would only be useful after Belhifet teleported away, when you have a brief respite and can afford to not use a scroll for another round.

  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 6,541
    150+ Invisbility Potions are easily possible even though i have forgotten a lot of stuff. Biggest numbers you can get from burning Imoen in the SoD starting assault at the palace: Thats 80. You can also wait around half an hour (or more) when sieging Dragonpear Castle: With patience (and a bit of luck) you should get really big numbers here too: 50++. ;)

    Hmmmm... i always thought that we had to kick Caelar out of party immediately when the fight against Big B starts. Anything else just looks not right - at least from my (and maybe @Grond0´s) point of view. But at the end its your personal journey @mr_salty. ;)

    Even though i havent played BG quite some time @Vynn and me had tried our poverty no-reload challenge again and again. We had used some devilish tactics but beating the Throne of Baal was still not possible. Not to mention that Sendai (and Abazigal) are also very painful (and Big B!!!). As i never touched 2.5 so far it would be interesting to hear some opinions if the challenge is now even more difficult. Is it? The saving throw bug really looks nasty - is there any chance that this will get fixed soon? However: When looking @histamiini the "normal" no-reload challenge looks far too easy. No? B)

    @Harpagornis I think my view was perhaps distorted by the fact that the first time I ever saw Belhifet was in MP - and in that Caelar did not join the party, but still fought against Belhifet (effectively the game treated the party as full even though there were only 2 characters in it). That set my expectations, so I was very annoyed to find eventually there was no way to get the same result in SP. In roleplay terms it also seemed appropriate to me that there should have been a dialogue choice that would result in you refusing to let Caelar join, but still not pissing her off enough to join what is clearly her enemy.

    I agree that having Caelar on your side makes the game easier - so if you want to make it as hard as possible then you shouldn't allow that :p. However, there's plenty of precedent in the game for getting help from neutral characters fighting against a common enemy - so I don't see anything wrong in principle with aiming for that situation.

    StummvonBordwehr
  • Grond0Grond0 Member Posts: 6,541
    semiticgod wrote: »
    You know, for warriors, the Potion of Storm Giant Strength isn't a bad alternative to the Violet Potion. You don't have to worry about spending two whole rounds countering the DEX and CON penalties, which is pretty relevant for Champion's Strength stacking.

    I agree storm giant strength is a good alternative (and can be topped up to 25 for at least 20 rounds through using Bhaal DUHM). If you're not worried about dispel magic though you can take the violet potion much earlier as the duration of the supporting potions for that is longer than with most of your buffs.

    StummvonBordwehr
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