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What fighter-mage combination do you like best?

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Comments

  • the_sexteinthe_sextein Member Posts: 562
    edited September 3
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    That was my point, you can't abuse the game with the rules I play by. That is why I don't care about it. You can only cast one simulacrum at a time so no you can't infinite cast timestop in my game and you can't use multiple planetar's or other high level summons like the druid's elemental prince. You can't use spell scrolls with projected image or simulacrum to get infinite casts of protection from magic or timestop ect.

    If I were to abuse the game like that I wouldn't see a reason to have optimized melee damage at all because a pure class mage would gain those abuses the earliest and you could take your time using infinite timestop with any combination of spells to kill anything in the game. Kind of defeats the purpose.

  • borntodieborntodie Member Posts: 103
    Berserker > Mage dual
    No, but you can still cast TimeStop many more than four times. Your rules do allow a simulacrum to cast it. Unless you are talking about houserules?

  • the_sexteinthe_sextein Member Posts: 562
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    Yeah a simulacrum at high level could give you more timestops with your fighting ability cut down to 60 percent. A FMT can cast simulacrum too and he has access to his HLA's as well.

  • borntodieborntodie Member Posts: 103
    Berserker > Mage dual
    Yes, but then we come back to number of castings. A dual can cast Simulacrum far earlier in the game and far more often than a FMT.

    If I were to abuse the game like that I wouldn't see a reason to have optimized melee damage at all because a pure class mage would gain those abuses the earliest

    Your taste in what you call abusive is probably where we differ.

    A dual at level 9 levels so quickly that he is equally good at casting as a pure caster in the endgame. But he is much more sturdy in the early game and the fighting ability still adds a lot of power, even in the endgame, no matter how hard you 'abuse' spells. ;)

  • the_sexteinthe_sextein Member Posts: 562
    edited September 3
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    TOB introduced critical strike and while many bosses are immune, you would surprised how many enemies are susceptible to critical strike. If they can be hit with CS then they can be hit with backstab as well. LOB mode more than triples the HP of all enemies in the game and SCS further doubles and triples HP on top of it. The advantage of massive multiplier damage cannot be overstated here. The theif's traps are the equivalent of being able to cast multiple timestops and dragon breath spells before for the battle and watching them go off one after another while you run around with a X10 damage multiplier before enemy defenses can come up.

    In comparison a Berserker mage would have to spend rounds casting timestop and all enemy defenses would go up. He would start attacking much later in the battle and he would have a X1 damage multiplier but it wouldn't matter because he would have to spend his timestops debuffing enemies so they could be hit and then waiting between timestop spells for the defense to actually go down and then cast another timestop ect, ect.

  • borntodieborntodie Member Posts: 103
    Berserker > Mage dual

    I might not be the best person to try and explain this but I'll give it a go.

    You did a great job explaining it. Thanks again, I learned a lot.

  • the_sexteinthe_sextein Member Posts: 562
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    Hopefully I simply interested you in giving it a try for yourself. Weather or not YOU think it's a better class is all that really matters in the end. I think you will find it to be fun and interesting at least. Maybe down the road you will get bored and push the difficulty to stupid levels and then decide "hey maybe now would be a good time to try some of those crazy damage combos that wierdo on the web was spouting off about :p

    borntodie
  • karnor00karnor00 Member Posts: 659
    something else
    My preference is generally the Fighter > Mage dual.

    The main reason is that I usually have these characters using ranged weapons and berserkers and Kensai have ranged weapon restrictions. 5 star proficiency in bows or crossbows is really nice.

    Berserker rage is great to be sure, but I find I hardly ever use it in practice.

    the_sextein
  • jsavingjsaving Member Posts: 245
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    I think you can get different answers depending on whether you care most about endgame power, overall versatility, or getting 9th level spells as quickly as possible. Duals are way ahead in terms of getting 9th level spells quickly, but they're not as versatile as multis and suffer in the late game from losing fighter HLAs. FMTs are the most versatile and may also be the strongest in the late game due to thief HLAs, but never receive 9th level spells which may be an issue for mage-light parties. FM multis are somewhere in the middle, which can be a good place to be for those who want fighter HLAs without giving up on time stop and dragon's breath.

    the_sextein
  • the_sexteinthe_sextein Member Posts: 562
    edited September 5
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    I'm coming from a 6 person party perspective with a druid for summoning and two pure class mages for raw magic power. I focus 3 melee warriors on tank tactics and raw damage output. For me, on the hardest difficulties with enemy HP through the roof and all of the hardest elements like enemy caster pre-buff...I feel that I am cutting into the enemy before the battle can start sometimes.

    I am through enemy protections 3x faster and dealing 10X more damage per a hit in some situations. I can't think of any other class combo that can deal anywhere near that raw damage output other than a fighter/theif but FMT doesn't need help from another party member and even then the FMT has the magic protections and unique buffs that work with the thief class too.

    Using exploits in the vanilla game you can get away with all kinds of stuff but even then the enemy will take much longer to disable protections and way longer to deal the necessary damage to drain enemies with 500 to 2000 HP. Ultimately, the longer it takes you to kill your enemies, the more damage they will do to you and your party. It's much easier to keep all 6 party members alive if you are 10X more efficient at dealing damage and you can cut through enemies and disrupt casters before their instant protections even come up.

    I have my favorites for different game rules and party configurations. I actually prefer the Fighter/Thief because he is a pure damage oriented character and sometimes it just feels cheesy to add magic into the mix. In the end I think how effective a character is comes down to the difficulty, the mods, the party, the player's knowledge and even then it varies from fight to fight. The game has a variety of different fight setups that give each class an edge under certain circumstances. It really comes down to having fun in the end but if we are talking raw power on the toughest settings, you can't go wrong with any F/M combo or kit dual really. I prefer FMT and do feel that it edges everything else out at the end when the chips are truly down.

    Even when the FMT is at his weakest and the game is set on it's hardest, the FMT is never a liability at any point in the game. His ability to use armor, cast magic buffs and protections, use thief utility and special abilities with both fighter and thief HLA pools open and even some mage extra spell HLA's bonuses. The FMT is always useful and OP most of the time as well.

    Post edited by the_sextein on
    ThacoBellbutteredsoul
  • gorgonzolagorgonzola Member Posts: 1,572
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    i vote fmt even if i don't think that is the strongest build possible, i do it cause is the build that i prefer, the one that better suits to my playstyle and that can better perform the tactics i like the most.

    the strongest builds are kensai(9)->mage and berseker(9)->mage, at least for bg2 and tob. good fighters at the beginning, kensai needs some care to survive, short dual time and then they can hit hard using the mage's protections and buffs. as they gain levels their real power starts to show, as they get lev 9 spells.
    a mage with at least 2 lev 9 spells (3 if you don't allow scrolls in the clones quick slots) has infinite spells using the spell trap and a pi. in EE is still possible to use a version of the advanced infinite spell strategy that allows to have a pi and a simulacrum trough a chain contingency, it does not need preparation if the correct spells are memorized and can be pulled out in a fraction of a round if rov and aop are used.
    a lev 9 dual at high level can pop out projected images 1 after the other all day long if he wishes, and a pi with the correct equipment needs only the time to cast improved alacrity than can protect itself and unload the spellbook, time stop is not really needed.
    out of combat the dual can use the spell trap and pi to memorize again the stoneskins, pfmw, ih and other buffs so he never runs out of them, he can mlee and be effective while fully protected, but this is the lazy option as the really powerful one is to use his terrific arcane power, so terrific that trivializes the game no matter what mods are used (afaik...).

    the strongest mlee build is fmc, a fmc fully buffed gets 2hp/cleric level bonus, mage and cleric buffs and protections, thaco and dmg bonuses and 25str without using crom (so an other party member can use it), he rolls also maximum damage. best offensive buffs and best defensive ones without relying on other casters. he lacks apr as he can not get gm and can not use speed weapons, but gww is the solution when is needed. holy power, rm, duhm, staff of the ram and gww while he is completely immune from physical damage and magical attacks make every boss really easy.

    Borek
  • Eadwyn_G8keeperEadwyn_G8keeper Member Posts: 530
    Fighter / Mage / Thief multi
    Like the triple class for versatility, getting HLA goodies from Fighter AND Thief, which the Berserker ->Mage Dual loses.

    I also like to run a party featuring Super-Tank Aerie plus Keldorn and Yoshimo/Imoen [w/ Jaheira as long as Insect Plague is a handy Ace-in-the-hole]. ******* as added feature for TOB.

    Mostly I seem to enjoy playing the game more with a multi-talented character and I get a kick out of fooling around with Setting Traps as a change of pace. Closet Corps of Engineers-type, I guess. Planning and logistics have always been a part of Military History I want more of.

    The idea of not fighting battles until you have already won [a la Bruce Lee, Sung-Tsu] has always appealed to me.

    ThacoBellgorgonzola
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