Alignment conundrum
Syndaree
Member Posts: 56
Greetings fellow gamers!
I am about to embark on another full Baldur's Gate saga adventure with a charname unlike any I've ever played before. I am fully decided on how to play the character but I can't for the life of me decide which evil alignment would fit him best. So out of curiousity I wanted to ask your opinion about what you think the character's alignment should be based on his personality.
Male human warrior or non-kitted cleric
Personal philosophy and way of operating:
- He wants to increase his own personal power, so that he can serve, and ideally lead, the Sword Coast. He is smart about it, making sure that every single move strengthens either him or the region. Always looking at the big picture. Weakening the region a bit to strengthen himself a lot is an acceptable move, the reverse is not.
- Prefers to wield as much power as possible himself because he believes that he can use it better than others
- He won't indulge in pointless violence unless there's something to be gained or for fun when nothing can be lost
- He will break contracts and lie, cheat and betray people whenever it strengthens him or the region
- He will be merciless when it comes to disposing, converting or manipulating the enemies of the state
- He will look for like-minded allies
- He is very sociable and loves having friends and making alliances with people and parties he finds trustworthy
The way I see it his personal goal is clearly Lawful Evil. He wants to empower himself (getting stronger personally and finding dependable allies, while maintaining and strengthening the economy and military of the area) and the region in order to serve and one day rule over it.
The way he goes about doing certain things is definitely Chaotic Evil. He loves fighting and will pick any fight that seems profitable. He has no real honor, he will betray people left and right when appropriate.
Any thoughts?
I am about to embark on another full Baldur's Gate saga adventure with a charname unlike any I've ever played before. I am fully decided on how to play the character but I can't for the life of me decide which evil alignment would fit him best. So out of curiousity I wanted to ask your opinion about what you think the character's alignment should be based on his personality.
Male human warrior or non-kitted cleric
Personal philosophy and way of operating:
- He wants to increase his own personal power, so that he can serve, and ideally lead, the Sword Coast. He is smart about it, making sure that every single move strengthens either him or the region. Always looking at the big picture. Weakening the region a bit to strengthen himself a lot is an acceptable move, the reverse is not.
- Prefers to wield as much power as possible himself because he believes that he can use it better than others
- He won't indulge in pointless violence unless there's something to be gained or for fun when nothing can be lost
- He will break contracts and lie, cheat and betray people whenever it strengthens him or the region
- He will be merciless when it comes to disposing, converting or manipulating the enemies of the state
- He will look for like-minded allies
- He is very sociable and loves having friends and making alliances with people and parties he finds trustworthy
The way I see it his personal goal is clearly Lawful Evil. He wants to empower himself (getting stronger personally and finding dependable allies, while maintaining and strengthening the economy and military of the area) and the region in order to serve and one day rule over it.
The way he goes about doing certain things is definitely Chaotic Evil. He loves fighting and will pick any fight that seems profitable. He has no real honor, he will betray people left and right when appropriate.
Any thoughts?
2
Comments
-"Break contracts, lie, cheat and betray people" - That is textbook chaotic evil. Consider the difference in D&D lore between the demons, who are chaotic evil, and the devils, who are lawful evil. A devil who agrees to a contract never breaks his word. Devils bank on their word being believed and followed to the letter. They will however look for tricky wording and loopholes that they can take advantage of, like crafty lawyers.
_Violence "for fun when nothing can be lost". Again, textbook chaotic evil thinking. Lawful evil individuals only use violence as a tool, a means to an end. Many lawful evil individuals actually deplore violence.
I think you're chaotic evil. You want to be free to pursue your own ambitions and to follow your own impulses with no restrictions, and you want to control everyone around you. You're just like Sarevok. You want to kill him because he's your rival, and he's in your way. Classic chaotic evil.
It's all about yourself. Anything and everything that gets you more power is fair game. Your description doesn't really strike me as very lawful...
I guess this is where the limitations of DnD alignment really start to show
I think I'm gonna go with neutral evil in the end. While he does want things that are supposedly lawful and chaotic and while he likes a well ordered system to live in and to have friends and allies, at the end of the day it is all about number one - HE wants all those things and they are an extension of himself. So neutral evil it is.
Thanks for the input
Neutral Evil is the practical, pragmatic alignment in which the character is willing to use any means necessary to accomplish his or her goals, and will alternate between law and chaos according to whichever is convenient or useful at the time. This character appears to have the cold, ruthless, single-minded and pragmatic approach of a Neutral Evil character.
As to why Sarevok is Chaotic Evil, he deliberately undermines social order by lying/poisoning so he can seize power even though laws and traditions say he isn't entitled to it. His picture basically belongs in the Player's Handbook as a textbook chaotic evil character.
Also, look the op's post. Their character has the longterm goal of IMPROVING the region. Their list even states that they will deny themselves what they truely want to do if it hampers the region. This isn't a temporary stay either, in order to take control and keep the refgion running smoothly, they will have to supress their urge to kill and fight for LIFE. No chaotic character, evil or otherwise would do such a thing.
Is selfish about they go about their goals, but their goals benefit someone other than themselves. I'd call that textbook lawful evil.
Naturally, there's some wobbliness about the D&D alignment system. This character definitely has elements of a Lawful Neutral, Lawful Evil, Neutral Evil, and Chaotic Evil alignment. The right kind of megalomaniac could be any of those alignments.
But basically, the way I envisioned the character, he wants the region to grow stronger because he wants to take over a strong region rather than a weak one. He also enjoys living in an orderly society as long as he can be above the law or sometimes exempt from the law. He'd rather work with reliable people because you can count on reliable people. Doesn't matter if he's not reliable himself.
But the main reason I think he's more neutral evil than chaotic is because he likes having friends and likes working with others. He will likely genuinely care about certain companions and won't betray them unless they betray him first, they plan to betray him and he finds out, or they are somehow messing up the region. He also enjoys have underlings and making sure that things run smoothly. He hates pointless destruction and waste, unless he's having a bad day and just needs to blow off steam, which certainly happens.
And as semiticgod said, he definitely has the elements of LN, LE, NE, and CE. But I think he's neutral evil. Every single thing he does is for his own benefit. He wants friends because he enjoys their company. He wants to rule because he likes being in charge and because he thinks he can do a better job than others. He wants to strengthen the region because people will love him for it, so he gets an ego boost. And when he takes over it'll be stronger that way. And while he does fight certain people because it amuses him, he certainly won't go picking fights with people he thinks are useful or valuable and even when he kills 'unnecessary' people he will try to find a good way of justifying it to himself and any others that might question him. In essence it's like a game for him.
So in my opinion 50% neutral evil, 35% chaotic evil, 10% lawful evil, 5% lawful neutral
But the main reason I think he's more neutral evil than chaotic is because he likes having friends and likes working with others. He will likely genuinely care about certain companions and won't betray them unless they betray him first, they plan to betray him and he finds out, or they are somehow messing up the region. He also enjoys have underlings and making sure that things run smoothly. He hates pointless destruction and waste, unless he's having a bad day and just needs to blow off steam, which certainly happens. "
This just sounds like textbook lawful evil to me. The op is of course free to choose whatever alignment they want, but the people saying that this cannot possibly be lawful are being silly.
It also made me realize that if I was ever given an alignment it would likely be true neutral with heavy fluctuations into both lawful neutral and chaotic neutral.